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#31
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Dudley Henriques wrote: Flying extended cross country VFR, especially over mountainous terrain.....you just never know when all that instrument training might come in handy some day. Flying instruments in the mountains in a single like Jay's is the last thing he needs an instrument rating for. |
#32
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Dudley Henriques wrote: or.......you could get the rating and NOT make stupid decisions and become a much better pilot than you were before you got the rating, which is exactly what happens to all but those who are accidents waiting to happen anyway Except the statistics say otherwise. Once you get in the 800-1000 hour range, especially if you do it fairly quickly, all VFR, an IFR rating will add little to nothing to your flying skills other than being able to be legal. |
#33
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"Jay Honeck" wrote in message news:CGU3d.79848$MQ5.5765@attbi_s52... But, despite your barb on the instrument pilot, you have to remember that you are only half a pilot without the instrument rating. Hrm. I would strongly disagree with that. Don't worry, Dylan -- he always likes to throw that "I'm an instrument rated pilot" around, like it's some sort of badge of courage. I don't know why you assume that. Actually, I do not have an instrument rating. However, that does not change the fact that most cross country flights, especially into high density areas, are safer and vastly easier on an instrument flight plan. If you are too busy to provide the safety net that the IR provides at least your wife should have one. Send me your FBO's email address. I'll Paypal them the funds for Mary's first IR lesson. I've safely flown from one end of this country to the other, for almost ten years, VFR. Dream on! By your own admission you haven't. Your own recent posting about scud running with your wife and family vividly points that out. I have a friend who thought a lot like you and owned a Cessna 185, very much like my own. I can just see the two of you talking about how to scud run a certain route. http://www.ntsb.gov/ntsb/brief.asp?e...26X01293&key=1 This accident is now the focal point of the "Wings" program around here. It's a case of compounded poor judgment. You further naively insinuate that all instrument flying equates to hazardous weather flying. I can't think of a single instrument flight I've ever taken in a light aircraft (other than during my training with a mad man) that involved any kind of hazardous weather. Karl |
#34
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If you don't already know it, you dehydrated yourselves.
The time you spent at altitude will take its toll without your realizing it. I learned my lesson the hard way back in 1986. My wife and I rode with another couple in their C310 from Columbus OH to Ft Lauderdale FL. Six hours at 11000 feet with only a small bottle of water inflight. When we landed I had a severe headache. We went from the airport to a restaurant for dinner. I couldn't eat, but I did drink two pitchers of ice water before I felt better. Jay Honeck wrote: Just courious, and some people may consider this too much information, but... what do you do for relief on those long legs? Our longest leg was 5.4 hours -- almost two hours longer than our original flight plan -- so this could truly have been a serious problem. Luckily, it wasn't, thanks to long experience with cross-country flying. Our secret? We carefully avoided drinking beverages before launching. This, for a coffee addict like me, was one of the most difficult parts of the trip! Flying at sunrise without my usual caffeine jolt was a true hardship -- but it's one that's well worth enduring. Actually, the reverse was true -- we became quite thirsty aloft. To help with this, we kept a small water bottle on board, just to wet our lips and cut the thirst to a manageable level. Between limiting our fluid intake, and the extreme dryness at 11,000 feet, we had amazingly little trouble "holding it" for that long. (We had relief bags on board, just in case...) |
#35
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"kage" writes:
But, despite your barb on the instrument pilot, you have to remember that you are only half a pilot without the instrument rating. Oh, baloney. I've heard this kind of nonsense on every activity I've been involved since being a kid, whether it was ham radio, photography, astronomy, flying... you're not a true ham until you can copy 60wpm in your head, you're not a true photographer until you spend four hours on your belly on a frozen lake to take one photo, and so on. Jay is a full pilot, who has posted numerous accounts of really cool flights, and with great narrative I might add. -jav (instrument rated since 1993, but not bragging or belittling anyone) |
#36
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"Newps" wrote in message ... Dudley Henriques wrote: Flying extended cross country VFR, especially over mountainous terrain.....you just never know when all that instrument training might come in handy some day. Flying instruments in the mountains in a single like Jay's is the last thing he needs an instrument rating for. Flying pre planned instruments in the mountains in a single isn't the issue I'm talking about. Pre planned IFR requires a mating of weather, terrain, equipment, and experience in any decision making process. Any missing link in this equation is a basic 101 for anyone with even average intelligence. The issue is simply that 1. Instrument training increases even general VFR pilot skills and as such is worthy of the effort in attaining that training. .......and 2. Any pilot flying extended VFR cross country on any regular basis is well served to have an instrument rating even if the flight has been planned VFR and a VFR flight plan is being used. Considering a VFR pilot who likes extended long range cross country ; the additional training and the rating just could come in handy some day. Anyway....the value of instrument training even to a VFR pilot is well known and accepted as being totally positive, and aside from those few who like to find the occasional story about some idiot who used his rating to kill himself as a reason for not getting the rating; getting the rating is generally considered to be a good idea by the professional flight instruction community. Dudley Henriques International Fighter Pilots Fellowship Flight Instructor/Aerobatics/Retired |
#37
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"Newps" wrote in message ... Dudley Henriques wrote: or.......you could get the rating and NOT make stupid decisions and become a much better pilot than you were before you got the rating, which is exactly what happens to all but those who are accidents waiting to happen anyway Except the statistics say otherwise. Once you get in the 800-1000 hour range, especially if you do it fairly quickly, all VFR, an IFR rating will add little to nothing to your flying skills other than being able to be legal. In my experience this isn't the case at all. In fact, it would be just the reverse. Dudley Henriques International Fighter Pilots Fellowship Flight Instructor/Aerobatics/Retired |
#38
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I don't agree with that at all.
Depending on how much long cross country flying you do (500+ miles), and unless you wait for only the good weather, you should have learned something about weather patterns in the areas of your travels. This will aid your decision making (local knowledge). Also, that same flight hour experience will have honed your flight control manipulation skills to the point where your holding altitude and heading are second nature instead of work. There may be some habits that will have to be broken, but these are procedual things which will be replaced with repetition and efficiency. The instrument rating requires that you think and plan the flight in an orderly sequence. At each stage of the flight you must be doing something to prepare for the next. Depending upon how high you are cruising and the destination elevation, you need to begin thinking about the descent 60 nm out. By the time you reach 30-40 nm from the destination, you should have copied the destination weather, know what runway to use and what approach to brief. 20 nm miles out, you should have all the radios set and run your pre landing checklist. 10 nm miles out you will already be on the approach or vectored to the final approach fix. 5 nm you will be stabilized on speed, altitude or rate of descent and configured for landing. If you only fly VFR, you may or may not already fly this way. If you are scud running, you don't have a plan, you are making it up as you go along, depending on what you see as you progress deeper into the scud. Newps wrote: Except the statistics say otherwise. Once you get in the 800-1000 hour range, especially if you do it fairly quickly, all VFR, an IFR rating will add little to nothing to your flying skills other than being able to be legal. |
#39
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In article , kage wrote:
However, that does not change the fact that most cross country flights, especially into high density areas, are safer and vastly easier on an instrument flight plan. If you are too busy to provide the safety net that the IR provides at least your wife should have one. I would STRONGLY disagree with that. Having an IR, I've flown on both filthy weather days and fine weather days on an instrument flight plan. I gave up filing on VFR days simply because it was much easier to just use flight following instead. Most of my flying in the United States is in high density areas (Houston's class B), and I've flown a light plane in 26 states, including a coast-to-coast trip. The only time I find an IFR flight plan and IFR procedures truly useful in severe clear weather is at night at unfamiliar airports/territor. -- Dylan Smith, Castletown, Isle of Man Flying: http://www.dylansmith.net Frontier Elite Universe: http://www.alioth.net "Maintain thine airspeed, lest the ground come up and smite thee" |
#40
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Newps wrote: Except the statistics say otherwise. What statistics? Would love to see them. -- Jack Allison PP-ASEL, IA Student "When once you have tasted flight, you will forever walk the Earth with your eyes turned skyward, for there you have been, and there you will always long to return" - Leonardo Da Vinci (Remove the obvious from address to reply via e-mail) |
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