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General Tibbets Goes West



 
 
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  #31  
Old November 2nd 07, 09:02 PM posted to rec.aviation.piloting
Maxwell
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Posts: 1,116
Default General Tibbets Goes West


"Gatt" wrote in message
...
He was 92. God speed, General.


Damn. Another fine one of the great generation gone.

Guys like him are pretty dang tough to come by.


I always wondered how well he slept at night long after the war.

Not saying what he did was wrong, but, so many men of virtue who knew they
were fighting the good fight or who had no choice but to kill are haunted
by their war. The pilot of my grandfather's plane never talked about it
to his family, and the co-pilot shut down to the point where he refused to
believe--he got angry at the suggestion--that there were ever B-17s that
weren't olive drab when I spoke with him a few years ago. One of the
officers later committed suicide. Very brave men who did what they had to
do, but couldn't bear to remember.

To be reminded of that every time the History Channel or somebody talked
about dropping The Bomb must have weighed heavy on the old warrior. May
he rest in eternal peace.


I had heard years ago that Tibbet's bombardier had taken his own life
shortly after the war, but I have my doubts. Does anyone know for sure?


  #32  
Old November 2nd 07, 09:18 PM posted to rec.aviation.piloting
Gatt
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Posts: 179
Default General Tibbets Goes West


"Maxwell" wrote in message
...

I had heard years ago that Tibbet's bombardier had taken his own life
shortly after the war, but I have my doubts. Does anyone know for sure?


http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Thomas_Ferebee

"Like Tibbets, Ferebee never expressed regret for his role in the bombing,
saying, "it was a job that had to be done."

He remained in the military in the years after World War II, eventually
serving in Vietnam and retiring in the rank of He died in Windermere,
Florida home at the age of 81"


  #33  
Old November 2nd 07, 09:57 PM posted to rec.aviation.piloting
Maxwell
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Posts: 1,116
Default General Tibbets Goes West


"Gatt" wrote in message
...

"Maxwell" wrote in message
...

I had heard years ago that Tibbet's bombardier had taken his own life
shortly after the war, but I have my doubts. Does anyone know for sure?


http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Thomas_Ferebee

"Like Tibbets, Ferebee never expressed regret for his role in the bombing,
saying, "it was a job that had to be done."

He remained in the military in the years after World War II, eventually
serving in Vietnam and retiring in the rank of He died in Windermere,
Florida home at the age of 81"


That's good to know Gatt, thanks.


  #34  
Old November 2nd 07, 10:31 PM posted to rec.aviation.piloting
Al G[_1_]
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Posts: 328
Default General Tibbets Goes West


"S Green" wrote in message
...

"Morgans" wrote in message
...

"C J Campbell" wrote

He was 92. God speed, General.


Damn. Another fine one of the great generation gone.

Guys like him are pretty dang tough to come by.

Rest easy, brave one.


I am sure there is a place reserved for him in Hell.


Some people have too large a carbon footprint.

Al G


  #35  
Old November 3rd 07, 03:13 AM posted to rec.aviation.piloting
Dudley Henriques[_2_]
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Posts: 2,546
Default General Tibbets Goes West

Bill Watson wrote:
Just for the record Mr Henriques, I consider myself pretty far out on
the left side political and social thinking. At the same time, I
totally honor Mr Tibbets. I even think a lot of you. Do we have to
politicize EVERYTHING?

Mr Oppenheimer arguably had more to do with dropping the big one - check
out what the far right did to him... and that actually happened.

Christ! Politics! Let's fly.

Dudley Henriques wrote:
Mortimer Schnerd, RN wrote:
Bill Watson wrote:
He has been recorded more than once answering that question. He's
always answered it the same way. To his credit, I doubt whether that's
true. Perhaps best reflected in his request for no funeral or grave
marker... though it can be interpreted in several ways.


I wondered about that too. He is eligible for a military burial at
Arlington National Cemetery... and there ain't so such thing as a
protest there. He'd be in excellent company and he'd be safe for
posterity.



Tibbets received many letters after the war and all through his life
from Japanese citizens thanking him for helping to save what would
have been millions of their lives as well the American lives saved by
forcing the surrender.
He never had trouble sleeping and always understood the role he played
in ending the war.
About his grave request; Tibbets always has understood and has had to
deal with the extreme left all through his life. He was well aware of
the ingenuity and inventiveness of some of these people. To my
knowledge he has always believed that no matter where he was buried,
the location would be a prime target for these people.
As for Arlington; interning him there would only have served to feed
the extreme left who would again have used the very location of the
internment as cannon fodder for keeping his name alive for use in the
anti-war movement.
The word I have gotten through my sources is that Tibbets simply
wanted to not be used after his death in any way the location of his
remains would have provided. He had quite enough of that in life, and
simply wanted not to be used in any ongoing controversy.

Personally, I think he did the right thing, although it's puzzling to
me why, considering his goals, he simply didn't choose cremation. It's
not too much a stretch however, to surmise that feeling the way he did
about all of it, that he chose to take even the "fire" relationship
out of the equation for the extreme left.

Not quite sure what you are addressing here, but I'm assuming you
believe I have politicized something that need not have been politicized?
Anyway, I'm happy that you "even like me" whatever the "even" might
represent :-))

--
Dudley Henriques
  #36  
Old November 3rd 07, 04:29 AM posted to rec.aviation.piloting
Dudley Henriques[_2_]
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Posts: 2,546
Default General Tibbets Goes West

Bill Watson wrote:
Sorry Dudley, I just have a habit of reacting to terms like "these
people" and "extreme". They've been used so often to negatively
characterize people of good faith and purpose. I also tend to consider
the terms "left wing" and "extreme left" to be political, don't you? And
I consider their application to the remembrance of the recently
deceased to be "politicizing".

And yes, I still 'even' respect you despite your insistence on the
casual politicization of the passing of a hero.... or your unwillingness
to recognize the weight of you words.

I think Paul Tibbets was a man who bore his duty, and the great burden
that attended it, with honor and distinction. And I know you do too.

Perhaps we can agree with that if nothing else.

Bill Watson
Durham NC

Dudley Henriques wrote:
Bill Watson wrote:
Just for the record Mr Henriques, I consider myself pretty far out on
the left side political and social thinking. At the same time, I
totally honor Mr Tibbets. I even think a lot of you. Do we have to
politicize EVERYTHING?

Mr Oppenheimer arguably had more to do with dropping the big one -
check out what the far right did to him... and that actually happened.

Christ! Politics! Let's fly.

Dudley Henriques wrote:
Mortimer Schnerd, RN wrote:
Bill Watson wrote:
He has been recorded more than once answering that question. He's
always answered it the same way. To his credit, I doubt whether
that's
true. Perhaps best reflected in his request for no funeral or grave
marker... though it can be interpreted in several ways.


I wondered about that too. He is eligible for a military burial at
Arlington National Cemetery... and there ain't so such thing as a
protest there. He'd be in excellent company and he'd be safe for
posterity.



Tibbets received many letters after the war and all through his life
from Japanese citizens thanking him for helping to save what would
have been millions of their lives as well the American lives saved
by forcing the surrender.
He never had trouble sleeping and always understood the role he
played in ending the war.
About his grave request; Tibbets always has understood and has had
to deal with the extreme left all through his life. He was well
aware of the ingenuity and inventiveness of some of these people. To
my knowledge he has always believed that no matter where he was
buried, the location would be a prime target for these people.
As for Arlington; interning him there would only have served to feed
the extreme left who would again have used the very location of the
internment as cannon fodder for keeping his name alive for use in
the anti-war movement.
The word I have gotten through my sources is that Tibbets simply
wanted to not be used after his death in any way the location of his
remains would have provided. He had quite enough of that in life,
and simply wanted not to be used in any ongoing controversy.

Personally, I think he did the right thing, although it's puzzling
to me why, considering his goals, he simply didn't choose cremation.
It's not too much a stretch however, to surmise that feeling the way
he did about all of it, that he chose to take even the "fire"
relationship out of the equation for the extreme left.

Not quite sure what you are addressing here, but I'm assuming you
believe I have politicized something that need not have been politicized?
Anyway, I'm happy that you "even like me" whatever the "even" might
represent :-))


Sorry. I can't agree with you on that. I do however respect your right
to an opinion and I won't push the issue.
Best to you
DH

--
Dudley Henriques
  #37  
Old November 3rd 07, 08:42 AM posted to rec.aviation.piloting
S Green
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Posts: 74
Default General Tibbets Goes West


"Gatt" wrote in message
...

"S Green" wrote in message
...

Rest easy, brave one.


I am sure there is a place reserved for him in Hell.


Arrogant, ignorant and meaningless.

The only difference between him and your average war criminal is that he was
on the winning side


  #38  
Old November 3rd 07, 05:59 PM posted to rec.aviation.piloting
Matt Whiting
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Posts: 2,232
Default General Tibbets Goes West

S Green wrote:
"Morgans" wrote in message
...
"C J Campbell" wrote

He was 92. God speed, General.

Damn. Another fine one of the great generation gone.

Guys like him are pretty dang tough to come by.

Rest easy, brave one.


I am sure there is a place reserved for him in Hell.



No, you have your place and his confused.

Matt
  #39  
Old November 3rd 07, 06:17 PM posted to rec.aviation.piloting
Bob Noel
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Posts: 1,374
Default General Tibbets Goes West

In article ,
"S Green" wrote:

The only difference between him and your average war criminal is that he was
on the winning side


Define "war criminal"

--
Bob Noel
(goodness, please trim replies!!!)

  #40  
Old November 6th 07, 02:58 AM posted to rec.aviation.piloting
Gatt
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 179
Default General Tibbets Goes West


"S Green" wrote in message
...

Arrogant, ignorant and meaningless.

The only difference between him and your average war criminal is that he
was on the winning side


My assessment of you stands. You are of course entitled to your opinion.
Thanks, mainly, to guys like Tibbets who risked their lives so that it could
be preserved for you.

Had Japan or Germany won the war you would not now have the ability to
accuse their warriors of war crimes in a public forum.

-c


 




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