boycott united forever

wrote in message
ups.com...
It's the Pension Benefit Guaranty Corporation and it is still
technically not taxpayer-funded. All employers with defined benefit
plans pay insurance premiums that in theory will cover the cost of
bailouts, assuming that not too many are needed. UAL does not yet break
the bank but it comes close. Then, as with the S&L crisis, Congress
will end up authorizing a payout from the General Fund.


A real problem with insurance like PBGC (and FDIC) is that the prudent
companies (or banks) end up paying the cost of those who don't contribute to
their employees pensions The real solution is enforcement of contributions
by not allowing deferments.

Mike
MU-2

So was the FSLIC until it became bankrupt.

Mike
MU-2

"Jim" wrote in message
oups.com...
The guarantee comes from the PBGC which is funded by payments from
companies, not taxes.

-Jim

"Bob Fry" wrote in message
...
"GP" == George Patterson writes:
GP You're thinking of a 401K. A pension used to be a guaranteed
GP retirement income in exchange for spending your life working
GP for the company. One could argue that you exchanged a higher
GP salary for a lower salary and a pension, but no money was
GP taken out of your paycheck.

I work for the State of California, have a defined-benefit pension,
and for sure they take money from my salary to help fund the pension.

That must be a reassuring position to be in, giving your retirement money to
the State of California. Hope you are building a nest egg separate from
what you are giving to California.

On Sat, 14 May 2005 03:42:16 GMT, "Dave Stadt"
wrote:

I work for the State of California, have a defined-benefit pension,
and for sure they take money from my salary to help fund the pension.

That must be a reassuring position to be in, giving your retirement money to
the State of California. Hope you are building a nest egg separate from
what you are giving to California.

And then they use it for political purposes!

Most people contribute to their pensions. Social Security is also
defined-benefit, though it's Congress that gets to define it The
difference is that with defined-benefit, it's all based on a promise,
whether or not the promise can be fulfilled.

A defined-contribution plan has no promise, and usually the worker
owns it a lot sooner. The really important part is that he can take it
from job to job, or into self-employement, which is not true of most
private-sector defined-benefit plans. Since it's based on real assets
that belong to the worker, the payout depends on the performance of
those assets.

In short, it's what some politiciians like to call "a risky scheme,"
but not half so risky as depending on the promises of companies who
may be out of business by the time you retire, and of congressmen who
will be retired (on your taxpayer dollar) much more comfortably than
you will be.


-- all the best, Dan Ford

email (put Cubdriver in subject line)

Warbird's Forum: www.warbirdforum.com
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the blog: www.danford.net
In Search of Lost Time: www.readingproust.com

Pension plans are a form of
"deferred compensation" and became popular in the United States during the
1930s, when wage freezes prohibited direct pay (in the form of salary) to
increase.

That's the problem with Wikipedia. Some damn fool typing faster than
his mind could follow!

I assure you, there were no wage freezes in the 1930, nor were they
showing any tendency to increase.. Wages were going *down* in the
1930s!

What the Wiki guy meant to say was "during World War II," but he
probably couldn't remember what number it was (I, II, III?).



-- all the best, Dan Ford

email (put Cubdriver in subject line)

Warbird's Forum: www.warbirdforum.com
Piper Cub Forum: www.pipercubforum.com
the blog: www.danford.net
In Search of Lost Time: www.readingproust.com

On Fri, 13 May 2005 21:24:24 GMT, Bob Moore
wrote:

Not at PanAm, the pilot group (unlike the other employee groups) insisted
that our pension plan be held by an outside source, in this case,

You must thank the wisdom of your negotiators every time you see the
Pan Am logo on a rinky-dink start-up airline or training program.



-- all the best, Dan Ford

email (put Cubdriver in subject line)

Warbird's Forum: www.warbirdforum.com
Piper Cub Forum: www.pipercubforum.com
the blog: www.danford.net
In Search of Lost Time: www.readingproust.com

On 13 May 2005 05:48:16 -0700, wrote:

It's the Pension Benefit Guaranty Corporation and it is still
technically not taxpayer-funded.

Neither were the savings & loan associations until the bailout came
due.

The PBGC overhang is nearly double what it cost us to straighten out
the S&Ls.


-- all the best, Dan Ford

email (put Cubdriver in subject line)

Warbird's Forum: www.warbirdforum.com
Piper Cub Forum: www.pipercubforum.com
the blog: www.danford.net
In Search of Lost Time: www.readingproust.com

On 13 May 2005 14:33:02 -0700, "Jim" wrote:

The guarantee comes from the PBGC which is funded by payments from
companies, not taxes.

Just you wait, Henry Higgins!


-- all the best, Dan Ford

email (put Cubdriver in subject line)

Warbird's Forum: www.warbirdforum.com
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the blog: www.danford.net
In Search of Lost Time: www.readingproust.com

On 13 May 2005 16:26:53 -0700, "Jim" wrote:

The funding for the PBGC does not come from taxes. You will not be
paying them.

Heh-heh. Where did we hear that before?


-- all the best, Dan Ford

email (put Cubdriver in subject line)

Warbird's Forum: www.warbirdforum.com
Piper Cub Forum: www.pipercubforum.com
the blog: www.danford.net
In Search of Lost Time: www.readingproust.com

On Fri, 13 May 2005 14:26:11 GMT, "Mike Rapoport"
wrote:

Social Security was a well thought out, adequately funded program when it
was inplemented in 1935.

It was a Ponzi scheme, whereby the people bailing out first were
repaid by the entry fees of those who joined later. It worked as long
as the labor force grew faster than the retirement community.

Then somebody discovered the link between cigarettes and lung cancer,
and bingo! One of my pals is celebrating his 90th birthday in the
Bahamas next February. He got remarried last year. He no longer sails
to the Bahamas every fall, but he sails a small boat every day when
he's down there.



-- all the best, Dan Ford

email (put Cubdriver in subject line)

Warbird's Forum: www.warbirdforum.com
Piper Cub Forum: www.pipercubforum.com
the blog: www.danford.net
In Search of Lost Time: www.readingproust.com