MoGas Tips, Tricks, Concerns, How To

"Jay Honeck" wrote in message
ups.com...
From what I've been reading on the Mooney list by Walter Atkinson, LOP
is
a Good Thing, and even doable on carbureted engines (one needs to play
with the carb heat setting, an engine analyzer and a carb temp gauge
are
de rigueur).

A touch of Carb heat and the throttle cracked ever so slightly. It
creates
turbulence in the intake system that evens things out rather nicely.

Care to expand on that?

http://www.avweb.com/news/columns/182085-1.html

"Carbureted Engines, and Fixed-Pitch Props
The single most-asked question I've had from these engine management columns
has been some wistful variant of, "But what about my 182, which has a
carbureted engine?" Or, "What about my 172, with its fixed-pitch prop?"

Folks, I'm really sorry, there's just not that much that can be done, beyond
a few simple tips that have been commonly used for years, like leaning on
the ground (see below).

Here's another tip for carbureted engines only. When operating at full
throttle, it is often helpful to back off on the throttle until you see just
the tiniest drop in MP (if you have a MP gauge, otherwise look for the
slightest drop in RPM), and leave it there instead of fully open. That cocks
the throttle plate just enough to set up a slightly turbulent flow, and that
helps mix the fuel and air for better combustion. A touch of carburetor heat
may help, too.

But I've flown a couple of 182s that are simply hopeless, and I'm tempted
just to leave the mixture full rich and forget it. Pity, the Skylane is a
marvelous airplane, but that TCM O-470 engine has the worst mixture
distribution of any powerplant on the planet.

If you're fortunate to have an all-cylinder engine monitor on a carbureted
engine, see if you can operate lean enough to get all cylinders lean-of-peak
(LOP) without the engine jumping off its mounts from vibration. I haven't
seen one that would yet, but there may well be some engines that will do it.
If so, some of this column may be helpful.

While the knowledge of these things may be helpful in a general way for
everyone who flies, it is only the high-performance, fuel-injected engines
that allow some of the more sophisticated techniques. Even on those, it
almost always takes GAMIjectors to make these tricks work well enough to use
them at all. This is the primary reason you have not seen some of this
information in the past - it simply hasn't been very useful, and there's
been no need for it.

Once again, this column will refer entirely to normally-aspirated engines,
unless otherwise noted. Yes, yes, I know, there are two or three turbo
owners out there who want me to do a column for them, and I'll get to it,
one day, I promise (but I'm not saying when!)"

"Bob Fry" wrote in message ...
"MB" == Montblack writes:

MB What would your unleaded fuel of choice be?

Good old 80/87. But that's not coming back.


Uhhh, 80/67 had lead in it....

"Matt Barrow" wrote in message
...
"Newps" wrote in message
...


Allen wrote:



They are also multi-million dollar aircraft engine companies that
recommend against LOP operation. (Unless you are running a FADEC
system).

Yes, suddenly it's OK to run LOP when you give them $10K for their
FADEC.


That is because you have zero control over the fuel-air mixture, they
do.

Which isn't their argument now. They flat out say it isn't good for the
engine period.

That is correct, because you can't control the fuel flow to all cylinders
precisely enough.

Well, so lets put in $8000 for a FADEC instead of $1000 for GAMI's. Yeah,
that's a great deal.

The FADEC system will not allow the engine to run in an condition that
will cause damage. If a CHT is too high or EGT too high guess what
happens. It INCREASES the fuel flow to that one cylinder to bring it
down.

FADEC can't adjust one cylinders fuel flow.

You are absolutely wrong, it can and does. Time to do your homewrk and try
to comprehend, gullyboy.



It can also retard the ignition on that one cylinder only to correct the
condition. It never LEANS further to cool cylinders or EGT temps.

What a marvel of Rube Goldberg engineering.

So, are they going to increase their warranties from nothing to something
now?


Sounds like you have this aircraft engine thing figured out. Maybe instead
of building cheap houses you should be building cheap aircraft engines.

"Jay Honeck" wrote in message
oups.com...
Maybe you can have him explain how he's doing such a great business in
when
maybe 5% of the aircraft are being run LOP?

Maybe you can have him explain how that happens when the EGT is
symetrical
on either side of peak EGT, and the CHT is actually cooler...much cooler?

I believe Dawley's exhaust business is benefiting from people running
INCORRECTLY lean of peak.

They're probably wrong on BOTH sides of peak. Pilots have been chewing up
engines long before GAMI reinstituted the "LOP craze".

"A. Smith" wrote in message
. com...

"Matt Barrow" wrote in message

The FADEC system will not allow the engine to run in an condition that
will cause damage. If a CHT is too high or EGT too high guess what
happens. It INCREASES the fuel flow to that one cylinder to bring it
down.

FADEC can't adjust one cylinders fuel flow.

You are absolutely wrong, it can and does. Time to do your homewrk and
try to comprehend, gullyboy.

Cite? (that means you posta link, AKA a URL, not just barf something you
read in an advertisement.)


It can also retard the ignition on that one cylinder only to correct the
condition. It never LEANS further to cool cylinders or EGT temps.

What a marvel of Rube Goldberg engineering.

So, are they going to increase their warranties from nothing to something
now?


Sounds like you have this aircraft engine thing figured out.

Nope, but some experts who actually did tests on a 128 channel test stand
did.

Wrong again. So why not go abck to 2nd grade and relearn "reading
comprehension".



Maybe instead of building cheap houses you should be building cheap
aircraft engines.

The more you try your elementary school intimidation, the more you show just
how full of **** you are.

Maybe you should learn to analyze, rather than just puke back the manual ala
high school.

Face it, all you "know" is what some self-proclaimed expert and the FAA
shoved down your throat and you were too chicken to question it.

Oh, and your wonderful TCM and Lycomings that haven't been able to go past
800 hours without a TOH, yes, their advice has really worked well. And their
warranties are the epitome of honorable adherence to a contract.

So go back and read the Flying Mag ads. Punk!

"A. Smith" wrote in message
. com...

"Matt Barrow" wrote in message
...
Sounds like you have this aircraft engine thing figured out. Maybe
instead of building cheap houses you should be building cheap aircraft
engines.

Hey ****brains, my structural warranty claims, per unit, are one-third what
Richmond, US Home, and several others are. So evidently you know as much
about construction as you do about engines. Go back and read your magazine
ads.


--
Matt
---------------------
Matthew W. Barrow
Site-Fill Homes, LLC.
Montrose, CO

Jay Honeck wrote:

A touch of Carb heat and the throttle cracked ever so slightly. It creates
turbulence in the intake system that evens things out rather nicely.

The Cessna Pilots Assoc has been teaching that for years. You fly with
whatever amount of carb heat gives you a carb temp of about 40-45
degrees. Helps to even out the mixture too.

"Matt Barrow" wrote in message
...

"A. Smith" wrote in message
. com...

"Matt Barrow" wrote in message
...
Sounds like you have this aircraft engine thing figured out. Maybe
instead of building cheap houses you should be building cheap aircraft
engines.

Hey ****brains, my structural warranty claims, per unit, are one-third
what Richmond, US Home, and several others are. So evidently you know as
much about construction as you do about engines. Go back and read your
magazine ads.
--
Matt

Ah, profanity, the last resort of the mentally challenged. Maybe you should
take some time and collect your thoughts so you can reply in one post. Do
your own research, I have and I have seen FADEC in action. It works.

Uhhh, no it didn't. It was allowed a MAXIMUM of 0.5 ml / gallon of TEL, but
from the '50s on, the actual TEL count was zero in 80.

Jim



".Blueskies." wrote in message
. net...

"Bob Fry" wrote in message
...
"MB" == Montblack writes:

MB What would your unleaded fuel of choice be?

Good old 80/87. But that's not coming back.


Uhhh, 80/67 had lead in it....

..Blueskies. wrote:

"Bela P. Havasreti" wrote in message ...
On 12 May 2006 12:00:24 -0700, "M" wrote:

Lower octane autogas is quite common in mountain states where the
elevation is high. Non turbo-charged car engines have a bigger
denotation margin at higher elevation and require less octane.

So that's why "super" mogas in Florida is 93 octane but only
92 octane in the Seattle area. Thanks everyone for the replies
(usenet is good for something besides arguing about politics
afterall!).

Bela P. Havasreti


Both Seattle and Florida are basically at sea level. The lower octane is not explained by altitude difference in this
case....

Most of Florida is close to sea level.

You don't have to go far from downtown Seattle to be at 6000 feet.

--
Jim Pennino

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