Seminole Lake Gliderport for sale

Oh, give him a break.Â* Ol' CQ probably loaned his 7-year old grandson
his computer to play with.Â* Every one knows that no adult would make
such a stupid remark.Â* Maybe we should spin the kid up and see how
hysterical he'll get...

On 8/31/2019 8:46 PM, Tango Eight wrote:
On Saturday, August 31, 2019 at 10:31:10 PM UTC-4, Charlie Quebec wrote:
Geez there’s a bunch of bitter trolls in this thread, who seem to be happy to slag of someone who can’t respond, but I guess that’s the American way. Truth and justice abandoned since the tangerine Nazi was elected.
Go be a dope somewhere else.

--
Dan, 5J

On Sunday, September 1, 2019 at 12:23:28 PM UTC-4, Dan Marotta wrote:
Oh, give him a break.Â* Ol' CQ probably loaned his 7-year old grandson
his computer to play with.Â* Every one knows that no adult would make
such a stupid remark.Â* Maybe we should spin the kid up and see how
hysterical he'll get...

On 8/31/2019 8:46 PM, Tango Eight wrote:
On Saturday, August 31, 2019 at 10:31:10 PM UTC-4, Charlie Quebec wrote:
Geez there’s a bunch of bitter trolls in this thread, who seem to be happy to slag of someone who can’t respond, but I guess that’s the American way. Truth and justice abandoned since the tangerine Nazi was elected.
Go be a dope somewhere else.

--
Dan, 5J

This is great comedy on the eve of hurricane Dorian, keep it rolling boys, I am here for the ring announcer and not the monkey.

Ignoring all of the issues around the current owner, surely the focus of the conversation is around maintaining and improving an excellent Gliderport / Gliding site that can benefit both the international visiting community to Disney as well as US pilots that like the winter sunshine?

I personally would leave it to the lawyers to resolve and ensure clear title can be achieved and ensure the money is in escrow and not handed over until free and clear title is in hand.

So getting back to the sale of the gliderport - how about an international syndicate?
Class A shares $5,000 USD each
Class B shares $1,000 USD each

Raise sufficient capital across the international gliding community to include sufficient working capital and fleet renewal for 2 x K21 and maybe 3 x Discus

I know of a great deal of UK pilots especially in the winter who would love to achieve their Bronze / Silver soaring qualifications and FLA and Disney is a perfect location for Europeans to fly to have a bit of winter sun.

I'm happy to organise if there is any interest... Let's focus on gliding, not the stuff that is not very important and should be left to lawyers?

I come in peace!

Cheers

nick

On Tuesday, September 10, 2019 at 9:56:13 AM UTC-7, wrote:
Ignoring all of the issues around the current owner, surely the focus of the conversation is around maintaining and improving an excellent Gliderport / Gliding site that can benefit both the international visiting community to Disney as well as US pilots that like the winter sunshine?

I personally would leave it to the lawyers to resolve and ensure clear title can be achieved and ensure the money is in escrow and not handed over until free and clear title is in hand.

So getting back to the sale of the gliderport - how about an international syndicate?
Class A shares $5,000 USD each
Class B shares $1,000 USD each

Raise sufficient capital across the international gliding community to include sufficient working capital and fleet renewal for 2 x K21 and maybe 3 x Discus

I know of a great deal of UK pilots especially in the winter who would love to achieve their Bronze / Silver soaring qualifications and FLA and Disney is a perfect location for Europeans to fly to have a bit of winter sun.

I'm happy to organise if there is any interest... Let's focus on gliding, not the stuff that is not very important and should be left to lawyers?

I come in peace!

Cheers

nick

Another approach is to buy title insurance, and have the seller's pay for this insurance. If they can't get insurance, run, don't walk, from this deal.. Organizing a syndicate is, however, a good approach. You will need to incorporate, probably in FL. Good task for a lawyer. More difficult is advertising the offer; consult a business realtor.

Tom

Tell us more about the proposed deal! If the selling price is $3 million, and we allow for a modest return on investment of 5%, then the operation must return $150000 per year.

How much additional investment is needed to renew the fleet?
What are the yearly operating costs?
What is the yearly revenue?
Would investors participate with more modest expectations of financial return?

History says that Seminole Lake Gliderport can be operated as a modestly profitable and stable business and as an asset to the global soaring community. However, Knut and Ingrid Kjenslie never had to service a $3 million loan!



On Tuesday, September 10, 2019 at 12:56:13 PM UTC-4, wrote:
Ignoring all of the issues around the current owner, surely the focus of the conversation is around maintaining and improving an excellent Gliderport / Gliding site that can benefit both the international visiting community to Disney as well as US pilots that like the winter sunshine?

I personally would leave it to the lawyers to resolve and ensure clear title can be achieved and ensure the money is in escrow and not handed over until free and clear title is in hand.

So getting back to the sale of the gliderport - how about an international syndicate?
Class A shares $5,000 USD each
Class B shares $1,000 USD each

Raise sufficient capital across the international gliding community to include sufficient working capital and fleet renewal for 2 x K21 and maybe 3 x Discus

I know of a great deal of UK pilots especially in the winter who would love to achieve their Bronze / Silver soaring qualifications and FLA and Disney is a perfect location for Europeans to fly to have a bit of winter sun.

I'm happy to organise if there is any interest... Let's focus on gliding, not the stuff that is not very important and should be left to lawyers?

I come in peace!

Cheers

nick

On Wednesday, September 11, 2019 at 7:14:03 AM UTC-7, Hal wrote:
Tell us more about the proposed deal! If the selling price is $3 million, and we allow for a modest return on investment of 5%, then the operation must return $150000 per year.

How much additional investment is needed to renew the fleet?
What are the yearly operating costs?
What is the yearly revenue?
Would investors participate with more modest expectations of financial return?

History says that Seminole Lake Gliderport can be operated as a modestly profitable and stable business and as an asset to the global soaring community. However, Knut and Ingrid Kjenslie never had to service a $3 million loan!



On Tuesday, September 10, 2019 at 12:56:13 PM UTC-4, wrote:
Ignoring all of the issues around the current owner, surely the focus of the conversation is around maintaining and improving an excellent Gliderport / Gliding site that can benefit both the international visiting community to Disney as well as US pilots that like the winter sunshine?

I personally would leave it to the lawyers to resolve and ensure clear title can be achieved and ensure the money is in escrow and not handed over until free and clear title is in hand.

So getting back to the sale of the gliderport - how about an international syndicate?
Class A shares $5,000 USD each
Class B shares $1,000 USD each

Raise sufficient capital across the international gliding community to include sufficient working capital and fleet renewal for 2 x K21 and maybe 3 x Discus

I know of a great deal of UK pilots especially in the winter who would love to achieve their Bronze / Silver soaring qualifications and FLA and Disney is a perfect location for Europeans to fly to have a bit of winter sun..

I'm happy to organise if there is any interest... Let's focus on gliding, not the stuff that is not very important and should be left to lawyers?

I come in peace!

Cheers

nick

Just because they are asking $3M doesn't mean it's worth that. Make them hire a business valuation expert that can make a realistic assessment of its true value. This would include opening the books for, at least, the last 3 years of operation. Would the same guy (Rich) continue as manager (this is a critical issue)? And don't EVER fall in love with an investment - be willing to walk away if it doesn't make total sense.

Tom

Hi Hal,

The whole purpose is not to make a return on the investment as a cash payable dividend to the shareholders, I would propose more of a benefit in kind - where shareholders get preferential launch fees, membership and accommodation etc which is why it's easier to put in between 1-5k and benefit all the while you own the share... its not being done on a commercial loan basis under any circumstances and depending on global gliding interest there could certainly be a couple of thousand interested parties throwing in some coin.

Renewing the fleet is certainly going to add between 3-500k but you would then have an incredible site and opportunity, freehold, and with a lot of shareholders promoting and talking about it thereby increasing its viability as a site - not just for the US market but for the global community due to the well known local attractions.

cheers

N

Hey Tom,

Indeed normal due diligence would apply for any deal that starts to get legs, and hav been gliding since 1982, I'm happy that there is a good team around that know how to run gliding clubs, I instruct at Lasham in the UK and that is a 7 day week operation averaging 60,000 launches a year - we have 700 members and over 200 private aircraft as well as a 20 aircraft club training fleet... its slick for sure and I would see no reason for major changes if there is a new owner but I would certainly want it to be run as an international gliding business not a private one.

However, if no one is really interested then it will go no further as I don't have the funds personally to fund it

cheers

Nick

On Wednesday, September 11, 2019 at 9:27:03 AM UTC-7, wrote:
Hey Tom,

Indeed normal due diligence would apply for any deal that starts to get legs, and hav been gliding since 1982, I'm happy that there is a good team around that know how to run gliding clubs, I instruct at Lasham in the UK and that is a 7 day week operation averaging 60,000 launches a year - we have 700 members and over 200 private aircraft as well as a 20 aircraft club training fleet... its slick for sure and I would see no reason for major changes if there is a new owner but I would certainly want it to be run as an international gliding business not a private one.

However, if no one is really interested then it will go no further as I don't have the funds personally to fund it

cheers

Nick

Hi Nick,

And I am not interested in investing in it, either (never flown in Florida, let alone Seminole). But having been involved in not-for-profit management and a business owner for many years, I know that the ONLY way to grow an organization is for it to be creating a positive return. Note that an operation like this will either be profitable or non-profitable (there IS NO middle ground); profitable is MUCH easier to manage, believe me. The ONLY acceptable valuation is one where it generates a reasonable rate of return; anything less will ultimately doom the operation. Also, as a potential buyer of a distressed property (I do consider Seminole to be distressed), you have negotiating power - don't give it up BEFORE you have even started talking!

Tom

It might be possible to turn a profit on Seminole Lake Gliderport, but other 'member owned commercial cooperatives' focus on operating a first-class recreational/educational resource and preserving it for future generations. 'Profits' are reinvested in upgrades to equipment and facilities, and fund a reserve fund to carry on operations in 'lean years' (at a loss).

https://www.madriverglen.com/about-the-co-op/ comes to mind.

Non-profit Soaring clubs that own their airports have similar goals.