Slow Down, Speed up

Several years ago, I was told that the US signals for slow down and speed
up are not the same as used in Europe.
Can any European friends confirm or deny this?

In USA, Slow Down is yaw
Speed Up is Rock wings

Thanks,

Bob

On Apr 12, 5:15*pm, Robert Gaines
wrote:
*Several years ago, I was told that the US signals for slow down and speed
up are not the same as used in Europe.
*Can any European friends confirm or deny this?

* In USA, *Slow Down is yaw
* Speed Up is *Rock wings

*Thanks,

*Bob

Presuming ground launching, most operations I'm aware of no longer
rock wings for speed up, but simply lower the nose. The tail wag, or
yaw, is still used for slow down.

Frank Whiteley

Frank Whiteley skrev:
On Apr 12, 5:15 pm, Robert Gaines
wrote:
Several years ago, I was told that the US signals for slow down and speed
up are not the same as used in Europe.
Can any European friends confirm or deny this?

In USA, Slow Down is yaw
Speed Up is Rock wings

Thanks,

Bob

Presuming ground launching, most operations I'm aware of no longer
rock wings for speed up, but simply lower the nose. The tail wag, or
yaw, is still used for slow down.

Frank Whiteley

In Denmark, it's exactly the opposite...

Yaw/Rudder for speed up, Roll/Ailerons for slow down and they are the
same in Germany as far as I know.

/J

In Denmark, it's exactly the opposite...

Yaw/Rudder for speed up, Roll/Ailerons for slow down and they are the
same in Germany as far as I know.

Interesting. I remember the US signals by remembering that if I'm slow
on the edge of a stall the last thing I want to do is aggressive
ruddering.

John Cochrane

UK BGA: rudder for too fast and ailerons for too slow (in 20 years of being

around winch sites I have never seen or used the latter) I am staggered
that
the alternative method is used anywhere, even if the correct and expected
pre
cursor is to lower the nose and unload the airframe.

GG

(It's more like 25 years now that I think of it!)

At 20:53 15 April 2009, John Cochrane wrote:

In Denmark, it's exactly the opposite...

Yaw/Rudder for speed up, Roll/Ailerons for slow down and they are the
same in Germany as far as I know.

Interesting. I remember the US signals by remembering that if I'm slow
on the edge of a stall the last thing I want to do is aggressive
ruddering.

John Cochrane

The use of ailerons to rock the wings to indicate too slow was discontinued
in the UK in the 1960s, it was thought to be responsible for gliders
spinning on the wire. The appropriate action is to lower the nose. A
switched on winch driver will spot this and speed up, if he can. If you
get a dozy one, or there is a problem then the action is to treat as a
failure and release.
Too fast, yaw with rudder. I have always wondered about high yaw rates
with high angle of attack and wing loading, even if the indicated speed is
"high", but that is still the "official" procedure in the UK.
Yaw to indicate too slow, seems a quick way to get back down on the ground
to me.


At 22:45 15 April 2009, Gav Goudie wrote:
UK BGA: rudder for too fast and ailerons for too slow (in 20 years of
being

around winch sites I have never seen or used the latter) I am staggered
that
the alternative method is used anywhere, even if the correct and
expected
pre
cursor is to lower the nose and unload the airframe.

GG

(It's more like 25 years now that I think of it!)

At 20:53 15 April 2009, John Cochrane wrote:

In Denmark, it's exactly the opposite...

Yaw/Rudder for speed up, Roll/Ailerons for slow down and they are the
same in Germany as far as I know.

Interesting. I remember the US signals by remembering that if I'm slow
on the edge of a stall the last thing I want to do is aggressive
ruddering.

John Cochrane

In the distant past I saw a friend die when he rocked the wings as a too
slow signal.

Nose down to maintain a safe speed and wait for the winch driver to get
the message. If he doesn't, pull off, land next to the winch and
threaten him with physical violence if he does it again....

At 08:30 16 April 2009, Z Goudie wrote:
In the distant past I saw a friend die when he rocked the wings as a too
slow signal.

Nose down to maintain a safe speed and wait for the winch driver to get
the message. If he doesn't, pull off, land next to the winch and
threaten him with physical violence if he does it again....

Your friends fatal accident, amongst others, is why we gave up rocking the
wings as a too slow signal. Yawing the tail for too slow would be even more
likely to lead to a spin!

The current UK system is to yaw the glider (waggle the tail) with the
rudder for 'too fast' and to lower the nose for 'too slow'. The latter
also reduces the chance of stalling or spinning by reducing the effective
wing loading and angle of attack, notwithstanding the dangers of
manoeuvring close to the stall. BTW, we no longer ease forward to unload
the glider before signalling too fast, as this could initially be
misinterpreted as a too slow signal. If the launch is very much too fast,
or doesn't slow down after signalling, pilots are advised to climb gently
to a minimum safe circuit height and then pull off. The biggest loads on
the glider's structure occur near the top of the launch, and when the
pilot is pulling back hard.

Some of the German Clubs I have flown at rocked the wings for too fast and
waggled the rudder rather rapidly over a small range for too slow. The
latter was intended as a signal to the launch marshall to tell the winch
driver to speed up via the landline telephone that they have to have in
that country.

To the best of my knowledge, nobody has died and no gliders have suffered
structural damage as a result of giving the currently recommended UK
signals.

Derek Copeland

At 08:30 16 April 2009, Z Goudie wrote:
In the distant past I saw a friend die when he rocked the wings as a too
slow signal.

Nose down to maintain a safe speed and wait for the winch driver to get
the message. If he doesn't, pull off, land next to the winch and
threaten him with physical violence if he does it again....


Only threaten? Pity all winch drivers are not up to the Wotherspoon
standard, right every time.

At 14:30 16 April 2009, Don Johnstone wrote:
At 08:30 16 April 2009, Z Goudie wrote:
In the distant past I saw a friend die when he rocked the wings as a
too
slow signal.

Nose down to maintain a safe speed and wait for the winch driver to get
the message. If he doesn't, pull off, land next to the winch and
threaten him with physical violence if he does it again....


Only threaten? Pity all winch drivers are not up to the Wotherspoon
standard, right every time.
Threatening the winch driver could be counter productive, he may be a
black belt or be similarly qualified and if not, you may never get a
decent launch ever again from the tiny minority of winch driving members.