What was controller implying??

"Matt Whiting" wrote in message
...

Do good controllers make good managers? I know that good engineers often
don't make good engineering managers.


But do poor engineers make good engineering managers?

In my experience, every good manager had been a good controller and I've
never known a poor controller to make a good manager. But that's a small
sample.

In article .net,
"Steven P. McNicoll" wrote:

"Matt Whiting" wrote in message
...

Do good controllers make good managers? I know that good engineers often
don't make good engineering managers.


But do poor engineers make good engineering managers?

In my experience, every good manager had been a good controller and I've
never known a poor controller to make a good manager. But that's a small
sample.

One thing I've noticed about technical management is that the evaluation
of whether somebody is a good manager is very subjective. If you ask
the people being managed, "is your boss a good manager", you might get a
very different answer than if you ask the people several layers up in
the food chain.

I recently read the book "Good To Great" (ostensibly a book about how to
invest in the stock market) and came upon an interesting statement in
there. The author claims that any organization can overcome the
occasional bad manager, but is doomed to failure when it gets two
adjacent layers of bad managers.

"Roy Smith" wrote in message
...

One thing I've noticed about technical management is that the evaluation
of whether somebody is a good manager is very subjective. If you ask
the people being managed, "is your boss a good manager", you might get a
very different answer than if you ask the people several layers up in
the food chain.


No doubt. The manager would have been selected for his position by the
people above. Saying he's a poor manager would be saying they made a poor
choice.

Matt Whiting wrote:

Do good controllers make good managers? I know that good engineers
often don't make good engineering managers.

Bad controllers can make good managers. Some people are just not cut
out to control. Had a guy who transferred in here as a supervisor. He
got thru ground control but was pencil whipped thru tower and radar.
Was the temporary manager for about 6 months and was pretty good at it.
Eventually transferred out and went to Boise as a controller. Made it
thru ground control training but never had a chance as a tower
controller, his brain isn't wired to work that way. Stayed at Boise
awhile as a QATS and then became manager at Helena, MT tower, where they
loved him. Is now at TIW as the manager. What you don't want is the
gung ho type bad controller. Those make terrrible management.

Matt Whiting wrote
Do good controllers make good managers? I know that good engineers
often don't make good engineering managers.

True, but bad engineers invariably make bad engineering managers.

It's sort of like the pilot/instructor thing. A good pilot can be a
poor flight instructor, but a bad pilot is always a flight instructor.

You can't manage it (or teach it) if you can't do it.

Michael

"Newps" wrote in message
...


Matt Whiting wrote:

Do good controllers make good managers? I know that good engineers
often don't make good engineering managers.

Bad controllers can make good managers. Some people are just not cut
out to control. Had a guy who transferred in here as a supervisor. He
got thru ground control but was pencil whipped thru tower and radar.
Was the temporary manager for about 6 months and was pretty good at it.
Eventually transferred out and went to Boise as a controller. Made it
thru ground control training but never had a chance as a tower
controller, his brain isn't wired to work that way. Stayed at Boise
awhile as a QATS and then became manager at Helena, MT tower, where they
loved him. Is now at TIW as the manager. What you don't want is the
gung ho type bad controller. Those make terrrible management.

In a big radar facility like an ARTCC, the last thing you want is for an
incompetent controller to become a QATS person. Sadly, at my facility our
QA (quality assurance) people haven't worked traffic since they ran from the
control room floor 12 years ago. They can't even keep up with procedural
changes, and they are *permanent* AT staff. No wonder my ARTCC is leading
the nation this year in Deals.

I represented a controller who had misapplied enroute visual separation
between a plane at 17,000 and another at FL180 during a vertical control
maneuver. I had to freaking *argue* with the QA specialist that enroute
visual separation was legal above 10,000 and my guy had simply had a brain
fart during the Error. She was so out of touch I thought I was talking air
traffic control procedures to a janitor...

Chip, ZTL

I don't think that this is true in all pursuits. I was arguing
the other day with a friend of mine who was complaining that
his choir director was a lousy singer -- and therefore could not
be a good vocal conductor.

I pointed out that the maestro of the orchestra doesn't need to
be able to play all of the instruments to be a good conductor.

Regards,
-Nick

Michael wrote:

Matt Whiting wrote
Do good controllers make good managers? I know that good engineers
often don't make good engineering managers.

True, but bad engineers invariably make bad engineering managers.

It's sort of like the pilot/instructor thing. A good pilot can be a
poor flight instructor, but a bad pilot is always a flight instructor.

You can't manage it (or teach it) if you can't do it.

Michael

"Nicholas Kliewer" wrote in message
...
I don't think that this is true in all pursuits. I was arguing
the other day with a friend of mine who was complaining that
his choir director was a lousy singer -- and therefore could not
be a good vocal conductor.

I pointed out that the maestro of the orchestra doesn't need to
be able to play all of the instruments to be a good conductor.


But it helps if he can read the music... :-)

Chip, ZTL

"Chip Jones" wrote
I pointed out that the maestro of the orchestra doesn't need to
be able to play all of the instruments to be a good conductor.

But it helps if he can read the music... :-)

And he really needs to have played at least one instrument reasonably
well. The stereo doesn't count.

Michael

"Michael" wrote in message
om...

And he really needs to have played at least one instrument reasonably
well. The stereo doesn't count.


Why not? It's got every instrument in it.