My wife getting scared

Paul,

because Rochester aviation's dirty little secret was that he was a known
corner-cutter and risk taker.


As an aside, we as in "the GA community" should stop keeping those
secrets. I for one, have vowed to myself to speak up when I see dangerous
behaviour be "esteemed" peers.

--
Thomas Borchert (EDDH)

Jay Honeck wrote:
This fear has faded somewhat, now that our kids are teenagers. When
they were in elementary school, Mary was VERY uncomfortable flying
without them (for some reason it's okay WITH them, which is pretty
odd, if you analyze it too much), because of the awful prospect of
them waiting a day or two for relatives to arrive.

I don't think that's odd, Jay. No parent wants anything bad to happen to
their kids, and most would give their own lives to save their children;
but there's also a purely gut instinct that if anything's going to
happen, you hope you're all together, especially when they're
elementary-school age and completely dependent on you. That's both
caring and selfish -- caring in that you KNOW what the aftermath is like
for those left behind (esp kids that age), and selfish in that you don't
want to go and leave them behind to have lives that you won't experience
with them. The redeeming thing is that once they're older and you KNOW
they'd be able to understand, care for themselves (with help) and be
okay if anything happened to you, you can be more okay with them moving
forward in your absence.

Not only is that a possibility if you fly (or fill in the blank with any
other activity), it's also a medical possibility, and we have way less
control over that, assuming we take reasonably good care of ourselves,
than we do over safety in activities. Don't we all know of someone who
was WAY too young when a terminal illness struck without warning and
took them?

On the plus side, this fear has made us VERY meticulous and careful
pilots. Preflights are NEVER omitted, fuel tanks are ALWAYS filled,
gas is ALWAYS tested, maintenance is ALWAYS done. Still, we all know
that "**** happens", and we could become statistics at some point.

Yep. I've been teased that my preflights are like 100-hr inspections. I
do everything you listed above, and it didn't stop the oil cooler from
failing.

Question: how often do you practice simulated engine failures over
places you aren't used to flying patterns? We'd done a simulated engine
failure approach *and landing* on a dirt strip two weeks prior to our
accident. Just having thought about and actually flown the procedure and
then critiqued it later (it went very well but there's always something
you may have done differently/better) may have saved a few precious
seconds in thinking/reacting in the actual emergency. We continue to
practice engine-outs frequently, and not over airports that we're
comfortable flying in and out of -- but it's surprising how many pilots
only do them during BFRs or when getting checked-out in a rental
aircraft.

I always fall back on two facts that comfort me:

1. You can either live, or wait to die. It's up to you.

2. Mary and I could be killed driving on the highway any day of the
week.

Although true, #2 doesn't usually do much to comfort anyone who is
worried about a loved one that flies.

My daughter flies, too. I didn't find out she was soloing until after
the fact, and I appreciate that she spared me -- there was also a method
to her madness as she knew that if I'd known, I'd have been there taking
pictures! But I understood. She's a CFI now and also just became an ATC.
We've flown together some, and I'm comfortable that she's a safe,
competent pilot (and a good CFI) ... but I admit that it's still easier
to hear about her flights after rather than before the fact!

Life is a terminal condition. No one is getting off of this planet
alive. It's up to each of us to make the best of our time here, and
-- in my world -- that means flying.

;-) -- a sentiment most of us agree with. The afternoon of our
accident, when we were driving back to the airport (plane was totaled),
we asked each other if we would fly again, and we both said "I don't
know." That feeling (sadness and uncertainty) lasted for two days. On
the third day, I awoke ANGRY and wanted to complete the flight that we'd
begun the day of the accident.

I'd be interested to know, of those who survive engine failures or other
occurrences that bring airplanes down, what percentage give up flying.

Shirl

In a previous article, Jay Honeck said:
2. Mary and I could be killed driving on the highway any day of the
week.

Statistically, that's true. In human terms, though, my wife knows maybe
25 pilots, and 2 of them have died in airplanes in the last couple of
years. She knows hundreds of drivers, and none of them have died in car
crashes recently. (Ok, one of them was kidnapped, raped and killed by a
guy impersonating a police officer who stopped her driving, but that's
another fear of hers regarding our four teenage and early twenties
daughters.)



--
Paul Tomblin http://blog.xcski.com/
There are two ways to write error-free programs. Only the third one works.

Have survived ( just barely ) a engine loss/crash , I went back up as soon
as I could. It was a little bit easier for me as I had no memory of the
accident.

John

"Shirl" wrote in message
...
Jay Honeck wrote:
This fear has faded somewhat, now that our kids are teenagers. When
they were in elementary school, Mary was VERY uncomfortable flying
without them (for some reason it's okay WITH them, which is pretty
odd, if you analyze it too much), because of the awful prospect of
them waiting a day or two for relatives to arrive.

I don't think that's odd, Jay. No parent wants anything bad to happen to
their kids, and most would give their own lives to save their children;
but there's also a purely gut instinct that if anything's going to
happen, you hope you're all together, especially when they're
elementary-school age and completely dependent on you. That's both
caring and selfish -- caring in that you KNOW what the aftermath is like
for those left behind (esp kids that age), and selfish in that you don't
want to go and leave them behind to have lives that you won't experience
with them. The redeeming thing is that once they're older and you KNOW
they'd be able to understand, care for themselves (with help) and be
okay if anything happened to you, you can be more okay with them moving
forward in your absence.

Not only is that a possibility if you fly (or fill in the blank with any
other activity), it's also a medical possibility, and we have way less
control over that, assuming we take reasonably good care of ourselves,
than we do over safety in activities. Don't we all know of someone who
was WAY too young when a terminal illness struck without warning and
took them?

On the plus side, this fear has made us VERY meticulous and careful
pilots. Preflights are NEVER omitted, fuel tanks are ALWAYS filled,
gas is ALWAYS tested, maintenance is ALWAYS done. Still, we all know
that "**** happens", and we could become statistics at some point.

Yep. I've been teased that my preflights are like 100-hr inspections. I
do everything you listed above, and it didn't stop the oil cooler from
failing.

Question: how often do you practice simulated engine failures over
places you aren't used to flying patterns? We'd done a simulated engine
failure approach *and landing* on a dirt strip two weeks prior to our
accident. Just having thought about and actually flown the procedure and
then critiqued it later (it went very well but there's always something
you may have done differently/better) may have saved a few precious
seconds in thinking/reacting in the actual emergency. We continue to
practice engine-outs frequently, and not over airports that we're
comfortable flying in and out of -- but it's surprising how many pilots
only do them during BFRs or when getting checked-out in a rental
aircraft.

I always fall back on two facts that comfort me:

1. You can either live, or wait to die. It's up to you.

2. Mary and I could be killed driving on the highway any day of the
week.

Although true, #2 doesn't usually do much to comfort anyone who is
worried about a loved one that flies.

My daughter flies, too. I didn't find out she was soloing until after
the fact, and I appreciate that she spared me -- there was also a method
to her madness as she knew that if I'd known, I'd have been there taking
pictures! But I understood. She's a CFI now and also just became an ATC.
We've flown together some, and I'm comfortable that she's a safe,
competent pilot (and a good CFI) ... but I admit that it's still easier
to hear about her flights after rather than before the fact!

Life is a terminal condition. No one is getting off of this planet
alive. It's up to each of us to make the best of our time here, and
-- in my world -- that means flying.

;-) -- a sentiment most of us agree with. The afternoon of our
accident, when we were driving back to the airport (plane was totaled),
we asked each other if we would fly again, and we both said "I don't
know." That feeling (sadness and uncertainty) lasted for two days. On
the third day, I awoke ANGRY and wanted to complete the flight that we'd
begun the day of the accident.

I'd be interested to know, of those who survive engine failures or other
occurrences that bring airplanes down, what percentage give up flying.

Shirl

Question: how often do you practice simulated engine failures over
places you aren't used to flying patterns?

Sadly, I have to admit that our fear of harming our engine has far
outweighed our fear of an engine-out landing. There is simply nothing
you can do to your engine (in normal use) that is worse than simulated
engine-out landings, so we do them very rarely.

We used to practice them regularly in rental birds...

;-)

My daughter flies, too. I didn't find out she was soloing until after
the fact, and I appreciate that she spared me -- there was also a method
to her madness as she knew that if I'd known, I'd have been there taking
pictures!

Hee hee! I even created a webpage for our son's solo flight, much to
his dismay. (Although I think he appreciates it now...)

I'd be interested to know, of those who survive engine failures or other
occurrences that bring airplanes down, what percentage give up flying.

Well, my mentor experienced an engine-out landing in a corn field. He
did it expertly, neither damaging himself nor the plane. He flew a
few times after that incident, perhaps to prove to himself that he
could (?), but to my knowledge (he lives in Texas now, so we've lost
touch) he's never flown again.

I think his wife -- an adamant anti-flyer -- had a lot to do with
that.
--
Jay Honeck
Iowa City, IA
Pathfinder N56993
www.AlexisParkInn.com
"Your Aviation Destination"

Now that two people she's met have died flying in a relatively short
period of time, she's getting less and less secure about my own flying.
Every time I head out to the airport, she gives me the talk. "Be careful.
Don't die. If you have the slightest doubt, come back." Etc. And so on.

I don't think she'll tell me to stop, because she knows I was a pilot
before we married. But what can I do to reassure her? The pilot
community is pretty small, and losing three people associated with our
little club is pretty scary for her.

Paul,

Sounds pretty familiar... my wife is on the same page as your wife. I
had two co-workers die in a plane crash in 2002, and my boss barely
survived it.

The sad truth is that too many people die in GA accidents, many of
them unnecessarily (bad choices, bad luck, or all of the above).

The best you can do is to be as safe a pilot as you can, demonstrate
to her that you are doing everything you can to stay safe, and resign
yourself to the fact that she probably won't fly much with you. Solo
is how you will do most of your flying unless you have other pilot
friends to go up with.

Dean

Statistically, that's true. In human terms, though, my wife knows maybe
25 pilots, and 2 of them have died in airplanes in the last couple of
years. She knows hundreds of drivers, and none of them have died in car
crashes recently. (Ok, one of them was kidnapped, raped and killed by a
guy impersonating a police officer who stopped her driving, but that's
another fear of hers regarding our four teenage and early twenties
daughters.)

Fear can paralyze people. If you read the papers, you'd never leave
your home, for fear of catastrophe at every step.

We've lost 3 friends to two flying accidents this year. One was
probably fuel exhaustion, the other was probably flying VFR into
IMC. These are the kinds of accidents it is easy to explain away
("That will never happen to me!") but in both cases the pilots were
known to be meticulous, skilled operators. So what can you do?

The kinds of crashes that REALLY scare me are the ones where a control
surface fails, or a wing comes off in flight. There was a Cherokee
235 that crashed last year after the wings departed the fuselage, thus
far for reasons unknown. Did the pilot yank the yoke back in his lap
at redline? Or was it just metal fatigue in our old fleet, like the
Grumman seaplane in Florida?

Second scariest (to me) are mid-airs, but that's not too worrisome out
here in the wide-open spaces of Iowa. Still, it happens, and it's (of
course) the one you DON'T see is the one that gets ya.

We'd all like to believe that we are superior pilots, possessing
superior judgement and skills. In fact, as private "hobby" pilots,
we're probably at the bottom of the skill heap, simply because we
don't fly often enough to get/stay really good. Once I accepted this
fact, not long after obtaining my ticket, I found myself becoming a
much more conservative (some might say "boring") pilot.

Conservative seems to be the best approach to longevity. It's the
strategy I'm planning to use so that I'm still around to fly with my
grandkids...
--
Jay Honeck
Iowa City, IA
Pathfinder N56993
www.AlexisParkInn.com
"Your Aviation Destination"

Conservative seems to be the best approach to longevity. It's the
strategy I'm planning to use so that I'm still around to fly with my
grandkids...
--
Jay Honeck
Iowa City, IA
Pathfinder N56993www.AlexisParkInn.com
"Your Aviation Destination"

Jay,

I for one am sold on the idea of a BRS. Lots of pilots poo poo the
idea, but I have seen lots of fatals that could have benefited from a
BRS, especially mid-airs that take off wings and tails but leave the
fuselage intact. The BRS is a last resort option for things that
might happen outside your control as a pilot.

Being conservative as a pilot is the best thing you can do, and I am
firmly in that camp. There is still a lot of fun to be had as a
conservative pilot.

Dean

Paul Tomblin writes:

I've been a pilot for 12 years now. I've been married (this time) for 10.
Three years ago, the DE who passed me on my private and instrument tickets
died in a stupid accident. My wife had met him a few times at flying club
dinners and around the airport. A few weeks ago, a club member who she'd
also met several times died in his float plane, a plane that I'd flown in
a few weeks before that. He died with his best friend, a former club
member who I knew a bit but whom my wife didn't.

Now that two people she's met have died flying in a relatively short
period of time, she's getting less and less secure about my own flying.
Every time I head out to the airport, she gives me the talk. "Be careful.
Don't die. If you have the slightest doubt, come back." Etc. And so on.

She's right.

I don't think she'll tell me to stop, because she knows I was a pilot
before we married. But what can I do to reassure her?

Follow her advice, and come back alive.

The pilot community is pretty small, and losing three people associated with our
little club is pretty scary for her.

I don't blame her. That's a lot of death, and it doesn't speak very well of
general aviation.

You can tell her that general aviation is safe when done correctly, which is
true. And you can prove it by flying aircraft that are properly maintained,
and flying in a safe way.

Overall, flying a small aircraft is about as dangerous as riding on a
motorcycle with someone. However, you can reduce the danger dramatically as a
pilot by safe flying practices and by flying only aircraft that are in good
condition and well maintained.

Le Chaud Lapin writes:

I'm a student pilot, and I am very curious to know what percentage of
that 32 can be attributed to pilot error.

Most such accidents are due to pilot error. Many of the rest are due to poor
maintenance.

A safe pilot in a well maintained aircraft isn't at much risk. Unfortunately,
there are lots of stupid pilots around flying poorly maintained aircraft, and
that makes the overall statistics rather grim.

Then, in an epiphanous moment, I thought, "Darwinism
might be in action, at this very moment. Pull over." I calmly pulled
my bike over to side of road, turned it off, parked it, and waited, in
total darkness, for 15 minutes until my circulation got right again.
My legs were so cramped, I could barely dismount without falling over.
I have no idea whether I would have wrecked if I had tried to hold out
those last 8 miles. But that's the point. I did not, because I made
sure. I managed my risk.

Well done.