Global Warming The debbil made me do it

Dan wrote in news:4b64d060-4674-4d42-bf13-
:

On Mar 7, 4:18 pm, Bertie the Bunyip wrote:

No problem.

I'd rather be flying, anyway.

It's possible to do both.

Bertie

What's that? Worry about Global warming and fly?

No, do something about it and fly.

Honestly -- one of the appeals of flying is that I can concentrate on
something else, often completely.

Why? You worry about it? I thought you didn't believe it.

It's refreshing.

Like a Junior Mint.

You should try flying what I fly. Minty fresh it is not.



Bertie

"Dan" wrote:
IOW, don't confuse you with facts. Fine.

--
Dan


Ok.. facts. 20 foot sea level rise based on which incontrovertible
evidence?

There is enough ice on Greenland *alone* to raise msl 20+ feet. That is an
incontrovertible fact.

The rate of ice melt on Greenland is accelerating beyond predictions of only
a few years ago.

http://www.colorado.edu/news/releases/2007/481.html

http://www.sciencedaily.com/releases...0115102706.htm


Will we have a 10 foot rise in 50 years?

Not according to current models, but ominous things are happening in
Greenland and Antarctica that indicate there are previously unknown
accelerating phenomena at work.

But let me ask you something: Are you 100% sure your house is going to burn
down this year? If not, why are you wasting your money on insurance? Why
don't you just wait until you see flames, then buy a policy?



5 feet in 25?

Sorry, I'm not buying the sleight of hand that is the "Climate Change"
crisis of the moment.

Sorry, you cannot show any sleight of hand. It is quite evident that you
haven't studied any of the science.


We had far warmer temperatures earlier in our history, and far colder.


Far warmer in our history? Says who?



But true believers in a religious cause can't be "convinced."

There goes the old irony meter again.

On Fri, 07 Mar 2008 03:43:19 GMT, "Jay Honeck"
wrote:

Try this
http://tinurl.us/a8b68b

Facts don't matter, Denny. This "crisis" was never fact-based to begin
with, and no amount of evidence to the contrary is going to sway the true
believers...

In either direction.

Be it up or down, one year is not enough to make a yea or nay
statement.

Sunspot activity, or lack there of has long been known to create
drastic cold spells as with the so called "Maunder Minimum" and the
little ice age.

Temperature and precip vary widely from year to year and local to
local so taken by itself this past year is only a blip in a sea of
change. Give it another 10 years and then *maybe* we can say it
probably, might, could have meant something. :-))

Here (Midland MI) they are talking about the possibility of an all
time record snow fall total. 4 1/2 miles out of town where I live it's
been nothing special. The same is true in Minnesota. Some areas
already are reporting record snow falls while less than 10 miles away
(Minneapolis area) they have less than average. Here, so far our
temperatures are running close to average or a tad above on the 10
year scale.

Denny is about 10 to 15 miles from me and I'd bet his winter has been
different than mine, or Midland's. Driving over to the old family
farm (Breckenridge 30 mi SW of here) finds very little snow.
I don't know how the temps have been over there.

Roger Halstead (K8RI & ARRL life member)
(N833R, S# CD-2 Worlds oldest Debonair)
www.rogerhalstead.com

Dan wrote:

On Mar 7, 3:56 pm, Bertie the Bunyip wrote:
All the alarmist noise?

Seriously -- what are you expecting to happen?

That people wil continue to pump **** into the atmospehre nad sea until
they break it.

Even the True Believers have downplayed Al Gore's outrageous
predictions (such as sea level rise of 20 feet in 100 years).

"When Michael Crichton said that 'Historically, the claim of consensus
has been the first refuge of scoundrels; it is a way to avoid debate
by claiming that the matter is already settled,' he was right. When it
comes to the natural sciences consensus is not science, and science is
not consensus."

Oh well, if Michael Chrichton said it.

Jesus wept.

Now, about the work "belief" I don't "believe" anything. I can see evidence
and can see the logical result according to the best information available.

Believers generally start with a need and use the belief to fill it.
Religion is the best example of course, and one of the reasons that people
get so riled up about it is investment. And generaly a pretty short sighted
and narrow view of the investment to boot.

So, no, I don't believe it, I just see it as a likely consequence based on
my best understanding of the sciences involved. I have no investment and
I'm not crying about the sky falling.

How about you?

Bertie

I'm gonna be crying if the tax burden increases over 50% to fund more
bureaucracy.

How about you?

Dan

Now Dan, Bertie obviously knows the science of climate change
very well, and she is sincerely concerned about the fate of the planet,
and wants to make sure the polar bears get plenty of baby seals to eat
and build up their body fat enough to get through the winter.

There are more important things than people keeping warm
and getting to work so they can buy food.

And the sky can't fall, it is not affected by gravity.

On Mar 7, 5:09 pm, "Dan Luke" wrote:

We had far warmer temperatures earlier in our history, and far colder.

Far warmer in our history? Says who?

Obviously it doesn't matter who says what (though here's a sample:
http://www.iarc.uaf.edu/highlights/2...g_from_LIA.pdf)

This is the Big Problem with the Global Warming hysteria.

Those who reasonably suggest that the evidence is inconclusive that
Human Activity may not be completely responsible for the 0.6 C
worldwide temperature rise over a 100 year period, and that even if
there were a predictable rise the results will not be as catastrophic
as the alarmists claim must be silenced (for the children's sake, of
course).

I'm a reasonable person, fish, camp, canoe, hunt, and hike, have
written checks to support environmental issues, have various
memberships in ecologically forward organizations, recycle, etc, etc,
etc.

So don't equate "Doubt about Global warming" with "wants to pollute
the streams and kill the fish."

That's an smear campaign and that's what's been going on -- though you
will deny it.

At this point, I'm done with this topic and done trying to reason with
you.

It's the wrong venue, though not really -- because one day -- when
the Global Warming Nazis come collect the keys to your CO2 emitting,
fossil-fuel burning, Global Impacting Cessna -- maybe you'll wished
you'd stood up to their bullying.


Dan

Whata Fool wrote in
:

Dan wrote:

On Mar 7, 3:56 pm, Bertie the Bunyip wrote:
All the alarmist noise?

Seriously -- what are you expecting to happen?

That people wil continue to pump **** into the atmospehre nad sea
until they break it.

Even the True Believers have downplayed Al Gore's outrageous
predictions (such as sea level rise of 20 feet in 100 years).

"When Michael Crichton said that 'Historically, the claim of
consensus has been the first refuge of scoundrels; it is a way to
avoid debate by claiming that the matter is already settled,' he
was right. When it comes to the natural sciences consensus is not
science, and science is not consensus."

Oh well, if Michael Chrichton said it.

Jesus wept.

Now, about the work "belief" I don't "believe" anything. I can see
evidence and can see the logical result according to the best
information available.

Believers generally start with a need and use the belief to fill it.
Religion is the best example of course, and one of the reasons that
people get so riled up about it is investment. And generaly a pretty
short sighted and narrow view of the investment to boot.

So, no, I don't believe it, I just see it as a likely consequence
based on my best understanding of the sciences involved. I have no
investment and I'm not crying about the sky falling.

How about you?

Bertie

I'm gonna be crying if the tax burden increases over 50% to fund more
bureaucracy.

How about you?

Dan

Now Dan, Bertie obviously knows the science of climate
change
very well, and she is sincerely concerned about the fate of the
planet, and wants to make sure the polar bears get plenty of baby
seals to eat and build up their body fat enough to get through the
winter.

There are more important things than people keeping warm
and getting to work so they can buy food.


Yeh. Dealing with it will all make us freeze to death aif we don't
starve first.




And the sky can't fall, it is not affected by gravity.

Actually, it is...


Bertie

"Dan" wrote:

"When Michael Crichton said that 'Historically, the claim of consensus
has been the first refuge of scoundrels; it is a way to avoid debate
by claiming that the matter is already settled,' he was right. When it
comes to the natural sciences consensus is not science, and science is
not consensus."

http://www.hawaiireporter.com/story....9-3004159a2185


LOL.

Let's see; is the science settled? On the "yes" side:

US National Academy of Science
U.S. National Research Council
American Meteorological Society
American Geophysical Union
American Institute of Physics
American Astronomical Society
American Physical Society
American Association for the Advancement of Science
Geological Society of America
American Chemical Society (yes! even the ACS!)

On the "no" side:

A hack novelist.

So naturally, you believe (drum roll)...The Hack Novelist!

Good thinking.

On Mar 7, 5:53 pm, Bertie the Bunyip wrote:


And the sky can't fall, it is not affected by gravity.

Actually, it is...

Bertie

Only in a High pressure system...

Dan wrote in news:92f50be8-9b35-4eb0-a536-7116f6b6b4f3
@f47g2000hsd.googlegroups.com:

On Mar 7, 5:53 pm, Bertie the Bunyip wrote:


And the sky can't fall, it is not affected by gravity.

Actually, it is...

Bertie

Only in a High pressure system...


Try switching gravity off and see how much of a sky you have.


Bertie

On Mar 7, 6:27 pm, Bertie the Bunyip wrote:
Dan wrote in news:92f50be8-9b35-4eb0-a536-7116f6b6b4f3
@f47g2000hsd.googlegroups.com:

On Mar 7, 5:53 pm, Bertie the Bunyip wrote:

And the sky can't fall, it is not affected by gravity.

Actually, it is...

Bertie

Only in a High pressure system...

Try switching gravity off and see how much of a sky you have.

Bertie


I hate it when that happens.