A aviation & planes forum. AviationBanter

If this is your first visit, be sure to check out the FAQ by clicking the link above. You may have to register before you can post: click the register link above to proceed. To start viewing messages, select the forum that you want to visit from the selection below.

Go Back   Home » AviationBanter forum » rec.aviation newsgroups » Soaring
Site Map Home Register Authors List Search Today's Posts Mark Forums Read Web Partners

Too many accidents



 
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
  #1  
Old September 5th 18, 08:37 PM posted to rec.aviation.soaring
[email protected]
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 10
Default Too many accidents

I have been soaring since the late 70's and can recall many accidents in the past. It seems, however, that recently the accident rate has spiked. While I don't have exact data to confirm this (I'm sure our friends at the SSF have it), it seems that we are experiencing higher than average accidents and fatalities.

I find myself wondering what is causing this. Is it the complexity of gliders emerging in recent years? Is it the age/experience of the pilots? Lack of training? I don't have the answers but I would be interested in other's thoughts on the issue. One accident is too many and loss of any life is tragic.

Greig
  #2  
Old September 5th 18, 09:35 PM posted to rec.aviation.soaring
Andrzej Kobus
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 585
Default Too many accidents

On Wednesday, September 5, 2018 at 3:37:44 PM UTC-4, wrote:
I have been soaring since the late 70's and can recall many accidents in the past. It seems, however, that recently the accident rate has spiked. While I don't have exact data to confirm this (I'm sure our friends at the SSF have it), it seems that we are experiencing higher than average accidents and fatalities.

I find myself wondering what is causing this. Is it the complexity of gliders emerging in recent years? Is it the age/experience of the pilots? Lack of training? I don't have the answers but I would be interested in other's thoughts on the issue. One accident is too many and loss of any life is tragic.

Greig


Unfortunately, accidents have always been part of the sport. We have more slippery gliders, fly at higher wing loadings, and deal with more stresses of everyday life than any of the previous generations.
I narrowly avoided similar faith at the age of 16. It was a lesson for life that taught me a lot about how I should approach flying. That lesson was also reinforced soon after by loss of a dear friend at a very young age. Then there were many more losses and each loss made me more determined to stay focused. Flying has its risks and it demands from us proper risk mitigation techniques and learning from mistakes of others. We as glider pilots are not doing enough of it.
  #3  
Old September 5th 18, 09:49 PM posted to rec.aviation.soaring
[email protected]
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 10
Default Too many accidents

On Wednesday, September 5, 2018 at 3:35:53 PM UTC-5, Andrzej Kobus wrote:
On Wednesday, September 5, 2018 at 3:37:44 PM UTC-4, wrote:
I have been soaring since the late 70's and can recall many accidents in the past. It seems, however, that recently the accident rate has spiked. While I don't have exact data to confirm this (I'm sure our friends at the SSF have it), it seems that we are experiencing higher than average accidents and fatalities.

I find myself wondering what is causing this. Is it the complexity of gliders emerging in recent years? Is it the age/experience of the pilots? Lack of training? I don't have the answers but I would be interested in other's thoughts on the issue. One accident is too many and loss of any life is tragic.

Greig


Unfortunately, accidents have always been part of the sport. We have more slippery gliders, fly at higher wing loadings, and deal with more stresses of everyday life than any of the previous generations.
I narrowly avoided similar faith at the age of 16. It was a lesson for life that taught me a lot about how I should approach flying. That lesson was also reinforced soon after by loss of a dear friend at a very young age. Then there were many more losses and each loss made me more determined to stay focused. Flying has its risks and it demands from us proper risk mitigation techniques and learning from mistakes of others. We as glider pilots are not doing enough of it.


Well said.
  #4  
Old September 5th 18, 10:06 PM posted to rec.aviation.soaring
Pete[_9_]
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 35
Default Too many accidents

Many of these pilots have many hundreds if not thousands of hours in gliders.
That is the most sobering aspect; experience seems to make little difference in 2018.

Otherwise, I think we are seeing statistics play out pretty morbidly.

Hopefully, 2019 and beyond will statistically average out a horrible year for fatalities in our beautiful sport.


  #5  
Old September 5th 18, 10:26 PM posted to rec.aviation.soaring
Ben Hirashima
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 41
Default Too many accidents

Some random variation in the accident rate over the years is natural, and expected. It is tragic that we have had more than usual this year, but one bad year doesn't necessarily signal a trend.
  #6  
Old September 5th 18, 10:54 PM posted to rec.aviation.soaring
[email protected]
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 148
Default Too many accidents

On Wednesday, September 5, 2018 at 2:06:28 PM UTC-7, Pete wrote:
Many of these pilots have many hundreds if not thousands of hours in gliders.
That is the most sobering aspect; experience seems to make little difference in 2018.

Otherwise, I think we are seeing statistics play out pretty morbidly.

Hopefully, 2019 and beyond will statistically average out a horrible year for fatalities in our beautiful sport.




A glider pilot is experienced when s/he no longer makes small mistakes.
  #7  
Old September 5th 18, 11:25 PM posted to rec.aviation.soaring
Tim Taylor
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 751
Default Too many accidents

On Wednesday, September 5, 2018 at 3:54:24 PM UTC-6, wrote:

A glider pilot is experienced when s/he no longer makes small mistakes.


I guess I don't know any experienced pilots.
  #8  
Old September 7th 18, 09:13 AM posted to rec.aviation.soaring
krasw
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 668
Default Too many accidents

keskiviikko 5. syyskuuta 2018 23.35.53 UTC+3 Andrzej Kobus kirjoitti:

Unfortunately, accidents have always been part of the sport. We have more slippery gliders, fly at higher wing loadings...


We have been preached about dangers of slippery gliders since late 60's. Would this, 2018, be a good year to finally forget this? There has been several pilot generations that have flown only slippery gliders without any indication that they are dangerous. In fact, dangerous would be to let these pilots fly non-slippery vintage without proper briefing.

Modern gliders are safer to fly (and crash) than older gliders.
  #9  
Old September 7th 18, 10:33 AM posted to rec.aviation.soaring
[email protected]
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 1
Default Too many accidents

Several posters have raised the issue of declining reflexes with advancing age. Especially so in flying and particularly in gliding.
This surely must be at least a causal factor in many accidents and even more incidents. I don't believe its so much a matter of complacency amongst aging pilots (50). More a failure to recognize that continuing to do what we have been doing for some years is no longer good enough. Aging requires positive compensatory/offsetting action to counter waning reflexes and senses so as to maintain a high standard of inflight analysis, and situational awareness.
A highly experienced glider engineer friend is now in his 50's. He says that he longer double check his work...he triple checks it.
I recognise that I now need to be extra thorough with my flight planning, checks, lookout and overall self discipline and airmanship if I want to continue in this great sport for as long as safely possible.
Laurence Hoffman
Sydney Australia
  #10  
Old September 7th 18, 04:51 PM posted to rec.aviation.soaring
WB
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 236
Default Too many accidents

On Friday, September 7, 2018 at 4:33:35 AM UTC-5, wrote:
Several posters have raised the issue of declining reflexes with advancing age. Especially so in flying and particularly in gliding.


Certainly declining reflexes contribute to accidents. No question about it. However, general aviation does not often require lightning quick reflexes. I think there's a story about some famous pilot who was asked what he would do in an emergency and his answer was something like "First, I'd wind my watch..." meaning he would take a few seconds to think before acting. I suspect the aging related decline that is more relevant to accidents is a decline in our situational awareness. One specific decline is in our ability to perceive how a situation is changing. How long does it take us to recognize that our airspeed is decaying? How quickly do we perceive changes in yaw rate or pitch rate? We may do pretty well and compensate by being mindful of our growing deficits as we age, but as we approach some threshold of function, we might begin to have episodes where we momentarily jump well beyond a threshold of critically reduced function due to fatigue, dehydration, low blood sugar, whatever. I've seen old guys who would fly 9 of 10 flights flawlessly, then inexplicably drive a ship onto the runway or into a field at high speed and end up in a pile of busted fiberglass.

Maybe we need the advice of some folks who specialize in studying and treating cognitive decline in aging.

 




Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

vB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Forum Jump

Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
UK Air Accidents Graham Drinkell Soaring 12 June 18th 09 02:29 PM
Physiology and accidents Bill Daniels Soaring 7 May 30th 07 02:14 PM
Physiology and accidents [email protected] Soaring 0 May 29th 07 09:50 PM
Accidents in progress Dave Kearton Aviation Photos 1 April 30th 07 03:27 PM
Accidents Big John Piloting 3 December 14th 05 01:19 PM


All times are GMT +1. The time now is 02:49 PM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.6.4
Copyright ©2000 - 2024, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
Copyright ©2004-2024 AviationBanter.
The comments are property of their posters.