FAI, soaring and Olympic Games

Make everyone one-man-rig on the line!

wrote in message
...
At least the archers need strong enough arms to pull back their bows.
How bout the air rifle events? I bet they have really buff trigger
fingers.

OK, maybe it isn't an olympic sport, but tossing toilet paper rolls
out of a glider and trying to hit a target seems like an excellent
way to "exploit technology and creativity," and is certainly exciting
and fun to watch.

Of course, there are SOME cheaters, who soak it in water and freeze it
right before throwing it out the window...NOT VERY SPORTING!!!
But an excellent way to get the observers at the target excited...

:PPPPPP

Mark

In article ,
Stewart Kissel wrote:
SNIP-
To promote our sport we need to be positive, and to
exploit technology and
creativity to present it to viewers as the exciting,
challenging and
adrenalin pumping sport that it is.
SNIP

Without sounding too snide, I would think submarine
racers might say the same thing about there sport...and
it could very well be true. But translating that to
outsiders is a different issue. Face it, if most
soaring pilots are not interested in watching sailplane
races...I suspect the general TV viewing population
might find it a tough sale.







--

------------+
Mark Boyd
Avenal, California, USA

Please, give a bit reasoning. For me, it seems that parachuting events involve mostly some
jundgement by the judges to get scored and thus are not directly measurable in minutes, seconds,
kilometers or whatever units available.



"Robert Danewid" wrote in message
...
I am a gliding fanatic, but I think that the most suitable air sport for
the Olympic Games is parachuting.

Robert

iPilot wrote:
It's been under discussion for several times, but I want to bring it up again.

There have been several pro's and con's towards soaring in Olympics, but nobody argues that it'd
rise the popularity of the sport. So it is important for soaring community. Therefore my
question is
following:

Wich way is soaring worse than sailing?

None of the cities that have organised Olympic games in the past would have any geographic
troubles
on organising soaring competitions (Moscow had troubles with organising sailing competition
which
had to be held in Tallinn - 900 km away).
None of the latest summer games that I remember have had such miserable weather that the
competition
would have to be left unheld.

The main argument against soaring is the fact that equipment can make a difference here. Well.
Here
is the challenge for igc. They have to face that their first trial of monoclass failed and they
have
to try again. This time with relatively high-performing, yet still not expencive standard or 15m
class design.

As a matter of fact I don't believe that sailing deserves to have 9 different classes on
Olympics
and soaring none. I personally think that FAI has failed bigtime to find the concensus amongst
all
air sports to get air sports represented on Olympic games. It shall be the biggest argument
towards
Olympic Commety - there's no air sports in Olympics nowadays. And the most suitable sport would
be
soaring because it's competitive, not so dependent on equipment and directly measurable. Making
soaring TV-friendly shall not be a problem as well today. And with racing tasks only allowed on
olympics it shall be understandable for general public as well.

How can we do it?

Regards,
Kaido

I see the problem now. We are too obsessed with the 'flying' aspect
of the sport, where the real potential is in the assembling and
disassembling aspect of the sport.

Assembling and disassembling gliders is physically strenuous, and is
fascinating for spectators who are amazed that an airplane can be fit
in such a small trailer. It can be done in any weather and location.
And it can be a team effort.

"iPilot" wrote in message
...
Please, give a bit reasoning. For me, it seems that parachuting events
involve mostly some
jundgement by the judges to get scored and thus are not directly
measurable in minutes, seconds,
kilometers or whatever units available.



Pretty much the same as synchronised diving!

Ian

Sorry about that. Regarding sailing my message was more like: "one's physical condition is not the
main factor that makes the difference".


"Charles Petersen" wrote in message ...
SAILING NOT PHYSICAL? You obviously have no familiarity with sailing small
hot boats. Take as a good example, the Finn class, where sailors, who use
their
body weight 'hiking' (suspending themselves out over the side of the boat by
sitting on the deck with their feet tucked under straps, and leaning out
'til horizontal), to offset the force of the wind that seeks to heel (roll)
their boat, wear sweatshirts to soak up additional weight by immersing them
in the water. Each time the wind changes, they must scamper across the boat
while adjusting the sails and then get their weight out on the other side.
It is very gruelling! Studies at McMaster University Medical Research,
focused on the physical condition of sailors and its effect on their
performance, found that fatigue decreases the ability to concentrate and
make decisions on where to go, strategically and tactically, - not unlike
soaring.

For more detail, start at http://www.finnclass.org/
"iPilot" wrote in message
...
I don't buy that argument.

1. If you look at the recent winners in any soaring title championship,
you can hardly find any
fatman. Actually, in order ta win, one has to mantain full concentration
in long flights during hot
days and long competitions. Therefore one has to be in a very good
physical form. Partly for same
reasons why no fatman can win in top car racing league.
2. All shooting activities (incl. archery, clay pigeon shooting, pistol
and rifle events) in
olympics require far less physically from athletes. The same applies to
Equestrian disciplines where
physical health does not make the difference. The same applies to sailing.


Regads,
Kaido


"nafod40" wrote in message
...
iPilot wrote:
It's been under discussion for several times, but I want to bring it
up again.

While soaring is a sport, and it is competitive, I have a real hard time

viewing the participants as athletes. If you can sit in a lounge chair
for hours on end, playing Nintendo with a joystick, you've got the
athletic stamina and dexterity to be a gold medal soaring pilot.

Why isn't chess an Olympic sport? Or playing Doom on a Nintendo
GameCube?

Finally one person who thinks the same way. Are we two the only people in soaring who think in a
terms: "what to do in order to get soaring to olympic games" instead of "which ways we do not apply"
which seems to be common here?

BTW. I didn't compare monoclass soaring to F1 racing. I compared soaring in its current form
(relatively loosely defined classes) to F1. For me it seems actually that F1 is far more restricted
rules wise than any glider class out there besides WC (but of course - it's not a monoclass by far).
Money makes the difference there.

I totally agree with you in other areas.

"Tony" wrote in message ...
"soaring is a form on technical sport. And to expect a techical sport to
achieve IOC accept is the same as to expect F1 racing to make it to the
Olympics - never happens"

What's the different between racing sailplanes and sailboats - apart from
water and air? Both require technical and tactical skills. A monoclass
sailplane/sailboat comparison with F1 is invalid as competitors performance
in F1 is largely differentiated by the car.

I also think that with todays technology and some imagination, the 'gliding
is not a spectator sport' argument is weakened. Sure it is not lke watching
F1 go round a circuit where they pass by every two minutes, but there is no
reason why each glider could not be equipped to broadcast live video, GPS
co-ords, and telemetry, and the gaggles could be followed by helicopters
also broadcasting live.

Sailboat racing is not always exactly gripping neck-to-neck stuff but I'm
sure that a big gaggle would be as interesting for many viewers to watch as
a few sailboats rounding a buoy.

To promote our sport we need to be positive, and to exploit technology and
creativity to present it to viewers as the exciting, challenging and
adrenalin pumping sport that it is.





"iPilot" wrote in message
...
Beacuse otherwise it's a tehnical sport where money invested in equipment
can make a difference and
this is what is avoided generally by IOC. The examples you made are just
bad. Reasons? WC is flawed
in design philosophy and class requirements. I do not really see who it
was made for - pilots who
hav necessary skills to compete have the skills to fly more complex
aircraft than the oversimplified
WC design. 1-26 is morally and physically aged and US only.

Last but not least. Sailing wouldn't be represented in Olympics when they
wouldn't have made
monoclass rules long time ago. And I do not think that there's possible to
launch 3 different glider
monoclasses from day one. BTW monoclass does not equal single class.
Monoclass is a class where only
one particular glider (like PW-5) is allowed to participate. 3 different
monoclasses in olympics
would be super, but i do not believe that it is achievable in any
foreseeable future. Maybe we shall
have monoclasses based on one standard class design and one 18 meter
design. Maybe just to declare
one current design from both classes a standard and make the drawings
available to everyone (that
doesn't answer the cost needs however).

There's nothing wrong with current FAI classes. Just the principles of
competition are different. In
it's current form soaring is a form on technical sport. And to expect a
techical sport to achieve
IOC accept is the same as to expect F1 racing to make it to the Olympics -
never happens.



"scurry" wrote in message
...
iPilot wrote:
Your fist point is achievable and in theis regard soaring can compete
(I
don't say it currently does) with many other sports. At least I do not
know
anyone who wants to watch 8days of constant swimming.

Your second point is good information, but in order to succeed soaring
needs
to have a successful monoclass before and PW-5 just isn't that. We
have to
get our own things ok before we jump to the IWGA. Otherwise we're just
another wannabies.

Why a single class? To say its needed for the Olympics implies, to me,
that there is something wrong or unfair with current FAI classes. Any
racing is expensive, so I don't buy that as a valid argument. Lots of
people race Standard and 15 m class all over the world, the FAI has
experience with it, and one class racing doesn't occur naturally in the
international soaring world (WC is contrived, and 1-26 is US only). If
gliders are to be raced in the Olympics, our best bet is to propose a
class that's already established, with gliders already racing.

Shawn




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tango4 wrote:

"iPilot" wrote in message
...

Please, give a bit reasoning. For me, it seems that parachuting events

involve mostly some

jundgement by the judges to get scored and thus are not directly

measurable in minutes, seconds,

kilometers or whatever units available.




Pretty much the same as synchronised diving!

And, apparently, ice skating.
--
Change "netto" to "net" to email me directly

Eric Greenwell
Washington State
USA

All the arguments I'm hearing AGAINST gliding an an Olympic sport can be
equally applied to one or more other sports that are already included in the
Olympics, so I don't consider them to be valid - unless there are so many of
them that the cumulative effect is to make gliding's participation
unfeasible.

Which body is responsible for pushing for gliding to be included in the
olympics? Is it the FAI? Perhaps this is a problem as they are lobbying on
behalf of multiple air sports rather than focusing on one?

Has the FAI, IGC, or any other national or international body ever
commissioned sports broadcasting consultants to investigate how new
technology could be expoited to present and promote gliding competitions?

Aparently one country has been trying grand-prix synchronised starts. I'm
sure that would be an option for making the racing clearer to the
uneducated observer while at the same time providing for exciting TV
viewing. Synchonised starts, gaggles with individual trying to break away
and take a lead, and finish line beat-ups. I'm sure that it would be of
interest to more than die-hard glider pilots.





"Stewart Kissel" wrote in
message ...
SNIP-
To promote our sport we need to be positive, and to
exploit technology and
creativity to present it to viewers as the exciting,
challenging and
adrenalin pumping sport that it is.
SNIP

Without sounding too snide, I would think submarine
racers might say the same thing about there sport...and
it could very well be true. But translating that to
outsiders is a different issue. Face it, if most
soaring pilots are not interested in watching sailplane
races...I suspect the general TV viewing population
might find it a tough sale.







---
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Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com).
Version: 6.0.735 / Virus Database: 489 - Release Date: 06/08/2004

Hows this for a format.

84 gliders release a set distance and height from the venue all at the same
time.
They final glide to the finish line which is on the boundary fence. Extra
bonus points for using ground effect for the last three kilometres. Tall
trees and power lines for added skill test.
They can either land straight through or pull up for a dodgy circuit, then
attempt to land next to their trailers which are lined up down one side of
the runway with tops up and fuse dollys in place. Trailers are spaced six
meters apart. Their 3 man/women crews then have to clear them off the runway
or if the pilot is skillfull enough he boots on some rudder and tries to
park on the fuse dolly. Extra points for this. Then as pilot extracts
himself the crew set to work derigging the glider and storing in the
trailer. The winner is the one whos trailer top is down the fastest from the
release time and has the least penaltys. Penaltys are for hitting other
crews while landing and groundlooping.

Good crowd appeal. Everything happens within sight of the stands. Don't need
soarable weather so could be a winter games event as well. ( Ice lake would
really turn up the excitment ) Team event as well as individual. It is the
best part of the whole contest thing as far as spectator appeal goes.

I saw this once at the German nationals and its very entertaining.






"Liam Finley" wrote in message
om...
I see the problem now. We are too obsessed with the 'flying' aspect
of the sport, where the real potential is in the assembling and
disassembling aspect of the sport.

Assembling and disassembling gliders is physically strenuous, and is
fascinating for spectators who are amazed that an airplane can be fit
in such a small trailer. It can be done in any weather and location.
And it can be a team effort.