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#51
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23 July OSH accident audio
In article ,
"RST Engineering" wrote: You proceed up the railroad tracks to what we commonly call "Fisk", which is 500 yards east of the beach umbrella and directly over the railroad tracks. Isn't that the same point as FISKE? |
#52
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23 July OSH accident audio
In article et,
"Steven P. McNicoll" wrote: a. Clear aircraft to hold at selected, prominent geographical fixes which can be easily recognized from the air, preferably those depicted on sectional charts. I like this one. Listen to the ATC controllers in the archive and you will hear one of them telling aircraft to find another aircraft that is already holding over an undefined location to follow the first aircraft. |
#53
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23 July OSH accident audio
My calculations show FISKE to be about 200 yards north of the railroad
tracks at Fisk Avenue. Anybody that has a better plotter than mine is welcome to correct me. Jim "john smith" wrote in message ... In article , "RST Engineering" wrote: You proceed up the railroad tracks to what we commonly call "Fisk", which is 500 yards east of the beach umbrella and directly over the railroad tracks. Isn't that the same point as FISKE? |
#54
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23 July OSH accident audio
john smith wrote:
Isn't that the same point as FISKE? FYI, the coordinates of Fisk in the Notam are identical to those of the FISKE waypoint (as shown on Airnav and also my GPS database). Maybe this is all a moot point! |
#55
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23 July OSH accident audio
Jose,
No, but now the pilots, knowing more than before, can make their own evalutions. How? What changes in your evaluation from "hold there" to "hold there because of an accident"? -- Thomas Borchert (EDDH) |
#56
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23 July OSH accident audio
Steven,
What's "free mind capacity"? I'm not a native speaker. You know what I mean if you want to. That info gives pilots of average or better intelligence an idea of how long the airport will be closed. Then they can decide if they're better off continuing to hold or diverting to another airport and coming back later. Ah, ok. So I must be below average intelligence, because I have seen/read about vastly differing times needed for clearing of runways after accidents and would have NO idea at all what timeframe I could figure for an event like that without a vast amount of further details beyond "there's been an accident". Good for you that you are so much smarter, I guess. -- Thomas Borchert (EDDH) |
#57
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23 July OSH accident audio
Thomas Borchert wrote:
Steven, What's "free mind capacity"? I'm not a native speaker. You know what I mean if you want to. That info gives pilots of average or better intelligence an idea of how long the airport will be closed. Then they can decide if they're better off continuing to hold or diverting to another airport and coming back later. Ah, ok. So I must be below average intelligence, because I have seen/read about vastly differing times needed for clearing of runways after accidents and would have NO idea at all what timeframe I could figure for an event like that without a vast amount of further details beyond "there's been an accident". Good for you that you are so much smarter, I guess. Very few accidents take less than an hour to clear, that is just common sense. Even raising an airplane after a gear-up landing is likely an hour event at least. And that assumes no injured pax to clear. Matt |
#58
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23 July OSH accident audio
gatt wrote:
Would you describe the ATC at Oskosh as "amateur," "hobbyist," "student," "volunteer", "ad hoc"... The fact that someone earns a living at an activity means they're "a professional". Even "a professional" can execute the activity in a more professional or less professional manner. I've seen this demonstrated nicely @ KDXR on a busy weekend. As I was handed off from "the PROFESSIONALS" @ BDL approach to "the professional" @ DXR tower, the difference was very clear. One individual was top notch, fully on top of his game, and very "professional", while the other should have been fired, as he let his Delta airspace degrade to a very busy CTAF. Any more hairs to split? G |
#59
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23 July OSH accident audio
"Thomas Borchert" wrote in message ... How? What changes in your evaluation from "hold there" to "hold there because of an accident"? "Hold there because of an accident" provides an idea of how long the delay will be, "hold there" does not. |
#60
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23 July OSH accident audio
"Thomas Borchert" wrote in message ... Steven, What's "free mind capacity"? I'm not a native speaker. You know what I mean if you want to. Not true. I have no idea what you meant, but I do want to know. That info gives pilots of average or better intelligence an idea of how long the airport will be closed. Then they can decide if they're better off continuing to hold or diverting to another airport and coming back later. Ah, ok. So I must be below average intelligence, because I have seen/read about vastly differing times needed for clearing of runways after accidents and would have NO idea at all what timeframe I could figure for an event like that without a vast amount of further details beyond "there's been an accident". That was my conclusion as well. |
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