report runway incursion non-towered airport?

It pays to pay attention. Geezz I wonder how in the world we all got
along before everyone had radios and had to call everyone in the world
before we did anything........
What the hell is wrong with pilots these days?
grumpy old gray haired fart pilot who learned in the 50's ......

"Joe Johnson" wrote in message
...
Me: 240 hr PP-ASEL, minding my own business, doing touch & goes at an
untowered field, and scrupulously calling my position in every leg of the
pattern.

The offender: pilot of a small Citation jet.

I saw the Citation taxiing toward the active as I was downwind. I watched
the plane carefully (suspiciously) as there was never any transmission on
the CTAF frequency. I listened to departure on my second radio; he/she
wasn't on that frequency either. When I turned base, the Citation was at
the hold short line adjacent to the active threshold. As I was on 1/4 to
1/2 mile final, the Citation suddenly took the runway and started the
takeoff roll; nary a radio call was heard. Prepared for this, I did a
360,
landed, and got the tail number from an airport employee.

Should I report this to the FAA? If so, how? When in the course of an
aviation career does someone become so complacent that they don't say
"boo"
before taking an active runway?

We all see lots of idiot drivers on the road. I used to think aviation
was
different, both because the training is more rigorous and because the
stakes
are so much higher. With all the idiotic and careless mistakes I read
about
in NTSB accident reports, I'm beginning to wonder.

Thanks for reading--I'm a little less upset after having written this
down.



I posted a while back about a Gulf Jet that did that to me at my local
untowered field.
I didn't do anything, because everyone makes a mistake...once.
If it happens again, I'll definitely report it.
I'd like to think that if I ever made a mistake (wrong frequency, etc),
someone would cut me some slack.

Adam
N7966L
Beech Super III

"Robert Coffey" wrote in message
news:NvwUd.64289$wc.37428@trnddc07...

are radio calls mandatory on uncontrolled fields?


No.

"Joe Johnson" wrote in message
...

Should I report this to the FAA? If so, how? When in the course of an
aviation career does someone become so complacent that they don't say
"boo"
before taking an active runway?

If you report it, it's your word against his. Whose to say you were on the
right frequency? Or that you didn't have the volume turned down because you
were listening to AWOS on the other radio?

My feeling is never involve the FAA in anything if avoidable.

Michael

Michael 182 wrote:

If you report it, it's your word against his. Whose to say you were on the
right frequency? Or that you didn't have the volume turned down because you
were listening to AWOS on the other radio?

It really is irrelevant whether the OP and/or the pilot of the Citation
were on the correct frequency. The OP could have been a nordo Cub.

The claim that the Citation pilot allegedly entered the runway in front of
an aircraft on short final is the issue being discussed here.

--
Peter













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"Peter R." wrote in message
...
Michael 182 wrote:

If you report it, it's your word against his. Whose to say you were on
the
right frequency? Or that you didn't have the volume turned down because
you
were listening to AWOS on the other radio?

It really is irrelevant whether the OP and/or the pilot of the Citation
were on the correct frequency. The OP could have been a nordo Cub.

The claim that the Citation pilot allegedly entered the runway in front of
an aircraft on short final is the issue being discussed here.

--
Peter

Good point - I missed that on the original post. However, I'd still avoid
the FAA at all costs...

Michael

"Peter R." wrote in message
...

It really is irrelevant whether the OP and/or the pilot of the Citation
were on the correct frequency. The OP could have been a nordo Cub.

The claim that the Citation pilot allegedly entered the runway in front of
an aircraft on short final is the issue being discussed here.


What's short final? Aircraft enter runways and takeoff in front of aircraft
on final regularly without mishap. I believe the OP said he was on a on 1/4
to 1/2 mile final. Maybe. Maybe not. Many pilots are absolutely horrible
at judging distance. There may have been plenty of room.

"Steven P. McNicoll" wrote:

I believe the OP said he was on a on 1/4
to 1/2 mile final. Maybe. Maybe not. Many pilots are absolutely horrible
at judging distance. There may have been plenty of room.

Hence my use of the word "allegedly."

--
Peter













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"Steven P. McNicoll" wrote in message
nk.net...

"Robert Coffey" wrote in message
news:NvwUd.64289$wc.37428@trnddc07...

are radio calls mandatory on uncontrolled fields?


No.


Those of you who fly to Canada:

.... be aware that designated uncontrolled airports DO have a Mandatory
Frequency (MF) assigned, listening watch is to be maintained on that
frequency within the specified radius of the airport, and calling procedures
must be followed, whether or not there is a ground station of any type.
"Calling procedures" normally include statement of intentions at least 5
minutes before entering the area, and report of joining the pattern,
downwind, final, and clear of runway.

On departure, report intentions before taking the runway, taking the runway,
and departing the pattern.

a/c on IFR approaches have their own rules with respect to reporting fixes.

Such airports are shown on the Canadian VFR charts with an M and the
frequency in the lower right-hand portion of the airport descriptor box, as
in: M122.3, for example.

It is also my understanding than any controlled airport where the tower
operates less than 24/7, operates as a MF airport during any period when the
tower is not in operation.

As I was on 1/4 to
1/2 mile final, the Citation suddenly took the runway and started the
takeoff roll; nary a radio call was heard. Prepared for this, I did a 360,
landed, and got the tail number from an airport employee.

Should I report this to the FAA?

No.

It might be worth a NASA report, but AFAICS no FAA regs were broken, and
"careless and reckless" doesn't seem to apply. Half mile final in a
cherokee (for example) is thirty seconds to touchdown. In that thirty
seconds the citation would be in the air and not a factor. It is not a
requirement to talk on the radio at an untowered field (and it shouldn't
be).

It is possible he didn't see you, had the wrong frequency, your radios
were turned down, you misjudged distance, any number of things. You
might (since you got the tail number) send the owner a note expressing
your concern, in case it's an "oops" on his part that he didn't realize.
It can be anonymous if you like - the important thing is that he get
the message that (maybe) he cut it too close.

But in this circumstance I don't see what calling the FAA out on him
would accomplish.

Jose
--
Nothing is more powerful than a commercial interest.
for Email, make the obvious change in the address.