FS Sage CVA Vario

For sale Sage CVA Vario. Legacy colors. Works perfectly. Currently installed but removing to replace with Winter Varios to conform with type certificate. BYOF, bring your own flask, I am keeping mine. Takes a .45 liter. Picture on request. $450 dollars, I will take care of the shipping (3 day FedEx insured).

On Thursday, February 20, 2014 11:19:29 AM UTC-6, NG wrote:
For sale Sage CVA Vario. Legacy colors. Works perfectly. Currently installed but removing to replace with Winter Varios to conform with type certificate. BYOF, bring your own flask, I am keeping mine. Takes a .45 liter.. Picture on request. $450 dollars, I will take care of the shipping (3 day FedEx insured).

Are you saying your type certificate REQUIRES Winter varios? That's odd - usually the type is more of a suggestion, or at worse a list of approved types.

And I sure wouldn't replace a Sage with a Winter!

Kirk
66

Correction, CV NOT CVA, sorry about that.

Kirk. The FAA approved DG documentation states that there is a minimal equipment list needed for certification. On the list there are various choices of certified instruments. Winters are certified, Sages are not. Having spent 2 years in Federal court doing battle with the FAA over a type certificate, and having lost, I don't wish to engage in any further debate with them if I can avoid it.

On Thursday, February 20, 2014 12:07:58 PM UTC-6, NG wrote:
Correction, CV NOT CVA, sorry about that.



Kirk. The FAA approved DG documentation states that there is a minimal equipment list needed for certification. On the list there are various choices of certified instruments. Winters are certified, Sages are not. Having spent 2 years in Federal court doing battle with the FAA over a type certificate, and having lost, I don't wish to engage in any further debate with them if I can avoid it.

Wow, that's a new one to me. Never heard of any varios described as "certified". Methinks you got screwed by a poor translation from German, and a clueless FAA.

Good luck!

Kirk
66

For my twin DG glider, the Type Certificate states:

The basic required equipment as prescribed in the applicable airworthiness regulation must be installed in the glider for certification.

The approved Flight Manual states:

As minimum equipment only the instruments and equipment specified in the equipment list (see maintenance manual) are admissible.

In the maintenance manual there are only two variometers identified:

Winter 5 St VM5 (daim. 58 mm) Certification No. TS10.230/14
Winter 5 StV5 (dia.80 mm) Certification No. TS 10.230/13

And I don't think these are just friendly suggestions. So you may very well be right, but good luck arguing the point with the FAA. From my own experience on a different issue, they are not easy to argue with, it is their way or the highway. I think once your A&P, or even the manufacturer, puts the variometer in the glider, it may be wise to use the one on the instrument list, even though it may be inferior. Having my standard airworthiness certificate jerked is not an experience I wish to repeat.

Are you aware of this Document?

http://www.dg-flugzeugbau.de/fileadm...%20DG-G-07.pdf

Randy

Thank God for experimental gliders!

I didn't see anything in that DG TN saying that there were any acceptable substitutes for the specified instruments on the equipment list, just how to install additional equipment.

Schleicher has a similar TN which does specifically state that you can substitute other makes and models of the required instruments so long as they meet a certification standard (TSO, JTSO, ETSO) as well as giving instructions on the installation of additional equipment. My 15B type certificate and flight manual specifies the generic equipment required but says nothing about any particular make or model. My friend's 19 on the other hand does mention specific makes and models of instruments in the manual.

Another club member with a DG800 wanted to put a Bohli compass in the glider but the type certificate and manual required a certain make and model of compass, period. Yet another ran into trouble with importing a Polish sailplane as the type certificate required a specific make and model of altimeter (different from the one that was installed) and a specific make and model of seat belt (and ONLY that one) which also had a lifetime of 15 years - and the company which manufactured the seat belts had been out of business longer than 15 years.