Avgas in France has reached $7.50/gal !

("Peter Duniho" wrote)
snips
* Even if it were "dunderheaded" to do so, calling an entire country
"dunderheaded" is still offensive. It's no different than calling all
Americans "dunderheaded", just because 50% of them were "dunderheaded"
enough to reelect a president who willfully fabricated justification for a
war. The other 50% weren't, and saying they are is offensive.

Bob F, I appreciate you pointing out that this isn't so much about getting
Jay to understand his errors (a futile goal, if ever there was one) as it
is about showing the rest of the readership that not all participants of
this newsgroup are as narrow-minded and bigoted as Jay. But I think we've
accomplished that goal...we're not going to get anywhere by continuing to
feed the bigots.


BTW, why is "offensive" always assumed to be a 10? Or, better yet ...11?

Bigots? Racist? Narrow minded? What is and what is not offensive? These seem
like Hate Speech codes on our college campuses.

Is there any sense of proportionality left around here? Dealing with
"correctly PC sensitive types" is like dealing with gang-bangers in the
hood - I perceive you to be diss'n me (maybe someone's tennis shoes got
stepped on) ...bang! Everything is go for the guns.

'These people are dunderheads for over taxing GA' is no longer the starting
point for a fun discussion ...bang.

There goes the neighborhood.


Montblack
"My dear fellow! This isn't Spain ... this is England!"
A Man For All Seasons (1966)
Winner of six Academy Awards - including Best

If aviation weren't dead in France, they should have the same PROPORTION
of pilots, aircraft and airports as the US.

If aviation were dead in France, they wouldn't build Airbusses.

Airbus? Pah. That's not aviation -- that's industry.

I'm talking about real, grass-roots aviation, Stefan -- like Bleriot and
Saint-Exupery practiced.

Every indicator I can find shows that the French have killed general
aviation -- or nearly so -- for everyone but the very rich.
--
Jay Honeck
Iowa City, IA
Pathfinder N56993
www.AlexisParkInn.com
"Your Aviation Destination"

'These people are dunderheads for over taxing GA' is no longer the
starting
point for a fun discussion ...bang.

There goes the neighborhood.

Thanks, Mont, but -- as you may have noticed -- there are very few topics
which *don't* offend Duniho and "Fry". I dare say, it's hard to recall the
last "fun" discussion that included either of them.

It's apparently in their makeup to be in a permanent state of politically
correct bluster. I mean, my gosh -- when we can't even bash someone for
charging $7.80 (it's gone up) per gallon for avgas -- on an AVIATION
newsgroup! -- there is very little room for discussion with people of their
stripe.
--
Jay Honeck
Iowa City, IA
Pathfinder N56993
www.AlexisParkInn.com
"Your Aviation Destination"

You fail to take several things into account. In North America, private
planes are a viable and often necessary method of transport because of
the distances and the lack of other transport methods in some areas.

This is totally and categorically false. Outside of Alaska, private
airplanes are not "necessary" for transportation in America at all.

Which is sad, I might add. It would help grow GA if it were otherwise, but
too many people look at piloting as "too hard" (for a zillion reasons) to
achieve.

All these facts combined reduce private airplanes to "expensive toys"
in Europe, and they are viewed accordingly

Same here in America, but to a far lesser degree. Most people here think of
owning an airplane as being far more extravagant than boat ownership (for
example), even though the majority of ocean (or even Great Lake) going craft
cost far more than the average used entry level airplane.

And this is, after all, at the heart a discussion of the degree to which any
government should try to engineer society with tax code. In short, is it
intelligent to tax something like general aviation, with so many obvious
economic benefits for your population, to the point of extinction?

I would submit that the answer to that question is clearly "no".
--
Jay Honeck
Iowa City, IA
Pathfinder N56993
www.AlexisParkInn.com
"Your Aviation Destination"

"Cub Driver" wrote in message
...

Since they have 6300 and 481, respectively, I'd say their avgas prices
have done a remarkably good job of killing aviation in France.

There are other reasons, of course, one being that (in effect, for
most purposes) there is no VFR flight.


Its all VFR and very little IFR for private pilots, but then hey if we
really want to go somewhere, then there is excellent public transport.

"Jay Honeck" wrote in message
news:Knz9e.4504$c24.1791@attbi_s72...
'These people are dunderheads for over taxing GA' is no longer the
starting
point for a fun discussion ...bang.

There goes the neighborhood.

Thanks, Mont, but -- as you may have noticed -- there are very few topics
which *don't* offend Duniho and "Fry". I dare say, it's hard to recall
the last "fun" discussion that included either of them.

It's apparently in their makeup to be in a permanent state of politically
correct bluster. I mean, my gosh -- when we can't even bash someone for
charging $7.80 (it's gone up) per gallon for avgas -- on an AVIATION
newsgroup! -- there is very little room for discussion with people of
their stripe.

Jay when you have to pay $7.80 for AVGAS complain and swear to give up
flying.

Those of us who do have to pay $7.80 are the ones entitled to gripe about
it. However I am also aware of where my tax £'s go and frankly I do not
worry too much about it. Why, apart from money wasted on some dunderheaded
war, most gets put to good use.
My parents get good medical treatment and they do not have to pay a cent for
it, I put a son through Oxford University for $30,000 (mostly for beer I
think) and many other things.

I consider flying a hobby, a luxury and indulgence. I do not fly to support
my job, British Airways is always the best for that.

What I don't do is take flying for granted. Here its a privilege not a right
but I have to accept that the majority of the country don't give a damn
about it and would not care a jot if it was stopped.

So while I can I will pay my $7.80 a gallon and my eurocontrol charges and
enjoy it and every so often slip over to the US and enjoy flying for $3 a
gallon and be subsidised by your tax $$s. That will taste sweet, knowing
that you are subsidising my flying.

"Jay Honeck" wrote in message
news:cEt9e.3672$WI3.540@attbi_s71...
you also have a population of 250 or 300 million. Do you want to say that
every
other nation with a smaller population is also irrelevant? Man, you are
so
ignorant.

Did you even READ my post, Martin? Man, you are SO ignorant.

;-)

Apparently not, so I will sum up.

It's the relative PROPORTION of pilots, aircraft, and airports that is out
of whack in France. If aviation weren't dead in France, they should have
the same PROPORTION of pilots, aircraft and airports as the US.


Math is not your strong subject is it Jay? If aviation in France was dead
then the proportion of pilots is irrelevant. The statement you made at the
start of this debate was that the incontrovertible truth was that GA in
France was dead. That is just not true.

There is no logical reason why there should be the same proportion of pilots
aircraft and airports as in the US.

That would assume the same population make up, the same cultural make up,
the same everything. Well, buddy, France and the US are not the same. This
may come as a bit of a shock to you but they are different. Hence different
approaches to aviation.

So while I can I will pay my $7.80 a gallon and my eurocontrol charges and
enjoy it and every so often slip over to the US and enjoy flying for $3 a
gallon and be subsidised by your tax $$s. That will taste sweet, knowing
that you are subsidising my flying.

Chris, it will only feel like we're subsidizing your flying, after the way
you've been abused. Our airports are 100% supported by the (relatively
small) taxes on our fuel. (Or, rather, they WOULD be, if our legislatures
didn't continually rape the fund for all sorts of things that have nothing
to do with aviation.)

Your obvious enjoyment of such outrageous taxation indicates that you are
apparently suffering from a peculiar psychological side effect of persistent
abuse, whereby you end up falling in love with the prison guards who abused
you the most. This was well documented during World War II, and can be
cured with extensive counseling.

Or a major tax cut.

:-)
--
Jay Honeck
Iowa City, IA
Pathfinder N56993
www.AlexisParkInn.com
"Your Aviation Destination"

Jay Honeck wrote:

Every indicator I can find shows that the French have killed general
aviation -- or nearly so -- for everyone but the very rich.

If I didn't know it before, I'd do so now: You've never been in France.
I have. You're just plain wrong.

Stefan

In article ,
"Peter Duniho" wrote:

that stuff is neither necessary nor sufficient for a decent place to live.

And aviation is?

Necessary but not sufficient. (if you know what I mean...)

--
Bob Noel
looking for a sig the lawyers will like