Odyssey Battery-Jerry Springer

On Sun, 31 Aug 2003 11:17:54 -0400, David O
wrote:


Rob Cherney wrote:

I did a lot of research on batteries and settled on the Odyssey when a
replacement was needed for Long-EZ N271J. I put a PC-925 (27 A-h) in
her back in February. So far, so good.

I use a sealed lead-acid lawn tractor battery from the local
automobile parts store in my Long EZ -- about $25 as I recall. I swap
it out every 2 to 3 years. It cranks in 20 degree F temps and I've
never had one fail. I prefer this to buying an expensive battery and
hoping it will last 4+ years.

Trading lifetime for cost works when you have easy access to the battery to
swap it out (like Long-EZs I've seen) but it's a bear when it's hard to
access the battery. The gel-cell in my Fly Baby is mounted forward of the
instrument panel, flush with the cockpit floor, underneath a big box
containing all the avionics and electrical system paraphernalia (circuit
breakers, gauges, etc.). Getting to the box requires jackknifing as far as
the instrument panel will let me or almost standing on my head hanging over
the cockpit sidewalls.

The box, as it exists now, cannot be removed without physically dismounting
the transponder (hardwired with no connectors). I can, barely, move it far
enough to get the battery out from underneath.

Needless to say, this is NOT a process I like to do very often. I'll
gladly pay $25 or $50 more for a battery I only have to replace every four
years instead of every two.

Now, if only I could find one... :-)

Ron "Standing on my head next weekend" Wanttaja

On 31 Aug 2003 09:54:00 -0700, wrote:

I've been using the Panasonics in parallel for 4 years, changing out one each
year, and it's never faded. I cranked a 200 hp IO-360 12 times, 15 secons per
crank (mags off) then stopped for 60 seconds to let the starter cool off, and
they were going strong on try #12, no apparent slowing from the first crank.

This is contrary to the recommendation of Panasonic. See page 7 of:

http://www.panasonic.com/industrial/...orHandling.pdf

If you must connect two batteries in parallel, the electrical
properties should be balanced. Practically speaking, this means that
both batteries should be of the same age. Otherwise, the fresher
battery will be accepting most of the charge current. Over many
charge cycles, the imbalance will increase.


Rob-
------------------------------------------------------------------
Robert Cherney e-mail: rcherney(at)comcast(dot)net

Rob Cherney wrote in message . ..
On Sat, 30 Aug 2003 23:32:20 GMT, (Badwater
Bill) wrote:

Another goofy thing about the Odyssey is that you can't recharge it
using a trickle charger. Less than 1.25 Amps won't put all the energy
back into the battery. You have to use a 10 Amp charger to get back
to full energy.

From their data, it looks like the charge efficiency sharply decreases
below 0.1C (1C = rated A-h @ 10h discharge rate). This is 1.6A for
your battery. Note that this only applies to a fully discharged
battery.

Anybody know the chemistry behind that? I don't get
it. Lead peroxide is lead peroxide. When you drive the sulfate off
the lead atom and reattach an oxygen, what the hell difference does it
make how fast you do it (high Amps)?

Hawker doesn't say specifically, but reading between the lines it
looks like it could be a function of the small amount of tin that's
added to the lead in the plates. This is done to increase service
life for deep-discharge applications. Don't ask me about tin
chemistry, though. I'm an electronics weenie.

The only thing I can think of is
that the battery itself has an internal resistance of 7 Ohms so the
higher the current, the higher the temperature of the battery itself.
And, as you all know, for every 10 degrees Centigrade, the chemical
reactivity rate coefficient doubles.

Two things:

The internal resistance is 7 milliohms.

The primary aging mechanism for these batteries is corrosion of the
positive electrode grid. For this particular mechanism, the reaction
doubles every 8 °C, not 10° C as one would expect.

So, the rate constant will be
higher for the charge cycle on a hot battery. They say you can
completely recharge this baby in 2 hours if you use 10 Amps. I'm
thinking that it heats up...that's why!

Yep, and that's not unique to this particular battery.

Actually, Odyssey says the battery can be recharged in as little as 20
minutes, assuming you have a charger that's beefy enough (3.5C= 56 A).
At this rate, the internal temperature will rise about 20 °C and will
peak about the time charging current starts decreasing (assumes the
recommended voltage-limited constant-current charging).

For a 2-hour charge, the expected temperature rise will be only about
10 °C.

By the way, my information came from http://www.hepi.com/papers.htm.
I pretty sure the Odyssey battery is an evolution of the Cyclon and
Genesis batteries that are mentioned in the papers.

Lastly...

I did a lot of research on batteries and settled on the Odyssey when a
replacement was needed for Long-EZ N271J. I put a PC-925 (27 A-h) in
her back in February. So far, so good.


Rob-
------------------------------------------------------------------
Robert Cherney e-mail: rcherney(at)comcast(dot)net


************************************************** ******************************


I've used an Odyssey PC 925 in my RV-4 for 1 1/2 years and it sits on
its SIDE, in the same place the worthless Gel-Cel fit,and cranks with
seemingly no end. It survived me learning hot-starts last summer just
fine.
NO MORE Gel-Cels for me !! I put the one from the RV-4 in my antique
Farmall runway mower. Most expensive mower battery in the
neighborhood!

Bob Olds RV-4 , N1191X
Charleston,Arkansas



************************************************** *****************************

On 1 Sep 2003 10:39:06 -0700, wrote:

I DO NOT RECOMMEND THAT ANY ONE USE ONE OF THESE BATTERIES FOR ANY PURPOSE
WHATSOEVER. IF YOU SEE ONE, RUN AWAY AND CONTACT THE PROPER AUTHORITIES. THEY
WILL EXPLODE WITH A FORCE EQUAL TO 20,000 TONS OF TNT IF A FLY LANDS ON ONE.
THEY WILL NOT STORE OR RELEASE ANY ELECTRICITY AT ALL. THEY WILL INVADE YOUR
HOUSE AND KILL YOUR CHILDREN. THEY WILL TAKE OVER MIDDLE EASTERN COUNTRIES AND
TURN THEM INTO BASES FOR TERRORISTS. THE PANASONIC BATTERIES WERE RESPONSIBLE
FOR THE ICE AGE, THE BLACK PLAGUE, WW1 AND 2 AND KILLED JFK. DO NOT TRUST THEM.
IF YOU ARE THINKING OF USING ONE IN AN AIRPLANE, KILL YOUR FAMILY, YOUR
NEIGHBORS AND YOURSELF NOW, BEFORE YOU BECOME ENSLAVED TO THE PANASONIC
BATTERIES.

Advice taken.

Thanks.

Rob-
------------------------------------------------------------------
Robert Cherney e-mail: rcherney(at)comcast(dot)net

wrote
I DO NOT RECOMMEND THAT ANY ONE USE ONE OF THESE BATTERIES FOR ANY PURPOSE
WHATSOEVER. IF YOU SEE ONE, RUN AWAY AND CONTACT THE PROPER AUTHORITIES.
THEY
WILL EXPLODE WITH A FORCE EQUAL TO 20,000 TONS OF TNT IF A FLY LANDS ON
ONE.
THEY WILL NOT STORE OR RELEASE ANY ELECTRICITY AT ALL. THEY WILL INVADE
YOUR
HOUSE AND KILL YOUR CHILDREN. THEY WILL TAKE OVER MIDDLE EASTERN
COUNTRIES AND
TURN THEM INTO BASES FOR TERRORISTS. THE PANASONIC BATTERIES WERE
RESPONSIBLE
FOR THE ICE AGE, THE BLACK PLAGUE, WW1 AND 2 AND KILLED JFK. DO NOT TRUST
THEM.
IF YOU ARE THINKING OF USING ONE IN AN AIRPLANE, KILL YOUR FAMILY, YOUR
NEIGHBORS AND YOURSELF NOW, BEFORE YOU BECOME ENSLAVED TO THE PANASONIC
BATTERIES.

I knew it!

Ron Wanttaja wrote:

snip

Now, if only I could find one... :-)

Agreed on all points, including the last.

David O -- http://www.AirplaneZone.com

On Tue, 02 Sep 2003 17:14:20 GMT, "Eric Miller"
wrote:

wrote
I DO NOT RECOMMEND THAT ANY ONE USE ONE OF THESE BATTERIES FOR ANY PURPOSE
WHATSOEVER. IF YOU SEE ONE, RUN AWAY AND CONTACT THE PROPER AUTHORITIES.
THEY
WILL EXPLODE WITH A FORCE EQUAL TO 20,000 TONS OF TNT IF A FLY LANDS ON
ONE.
THEY WILL NOT STORE OR RELEASE ANY ELECTRICITY AT ALL. THEY WILL INVADE
YOUR
HOUSE AND KILL YOUR CHILDREN. THEY WILL TAKE OVER MIDDLE EASTERN
COUNTRIES AND
TURN THEM INTO BASES FOR TERRORISTS. THE PANASONIC BATTERIES WERE
RESPONSIBLE
FOR THE ICE AGE, THE BLACK PLAGUE, WW1 AND 2 AND KILLED JFK. DO NOT TRUST
THEM.
IF YOU ARE THINKING OF USING ONE IN AN AIRPLANE, KILL YOUR FAMILY, YOUR
NEIGHBORS AND YOURSELF NOW, BEFORE YOU BECOME ENSLAVED TO THE PANASONIC
BATTERIES.

I knew it!
+++++++++++++++++++++

I didn't.

Barnyard BOb -- wrote in message . ..
.... A 16 amp-hour
Odyssey is going to empty out pretty quick unless one
is willing to start the blades rotating by hand. ....

I am using the PC680 Odyssey battery for starting
a 10.5/1, 220HP Franklin engine. It has no trouble
cranking the thing. True, at 225amps cranking the
battery won't last more than a few minutes. But if
the thing does not start in the first 5-10 seconds,
there is something else wrong.

----------------------------------------------------
Paul Lee, SQ2000 canard project: www.abri.com/sq2000

On Sun, 31 Aug 2003 00:24:41 GMT, Jerry Springer
wrote:

Ouch, :-( Sunn battery has them for $74.00+ $5.00 shipping. That was in
my first message about the battery. I hope it works for you Bill, really
works great in my RV. Better than any Gell cell, or RG battery I have
ever tried before.
http://sunnbattery.com/item.jhtml?UC...0&PRID=1292858
Jerry


Hell, that was after calling all the retailers on the page at the
Odysey website. It was $126 plus tax. Most wanted nearly $140.
Something is wrong somewhere.

Bill

On 3 Sep 2003 14:12:04 -0700, (Paul Lee) wrote:

Barnyard BOb -- wrote in message . ..
.... A 16 amp-hour
Odyssey is going to empty out pretty quick unless one
is willing to start the blades rotating by hand. ....

I am using the PC680 Odyssey battery for starting
a 10.5/1, 220HP Franklin engine. It has no trouble
cranking the thing. True, at 225amps cranking the
battery won't last more than a few minutes. But if
the thing does not start in the first 5-10 seconds,
there is something else wrong.

That's an interesting application. The 680 is only 15 pounds and it's
small in volume, that's why I like it. I got a hold of a couple 35
Amp-hr Gel Cell batteries today from a buddy (brand new out of the box
and he just gave them to me since his application disappeared). I'm
going to make an APU out of them and use them to hook up in parallel
during my starts. That way I'll have plenty for the flying day.

My real problem here, and I haven't talked about it, is that my blades
aren't tracked properly. I've painted one tip red and one black. You
can't track them without flying the damn thing. In flight, you look
at the tips and see what blade is above the other. Then you land and
reduce AOA on the high blade, spool up again and go for another try.
It's an empirical thing until you get it dialed in. The problem with
a Walmart motorcycle battery is that I get about three starts from it
with a 30 minute charging time between each start and the battery is
toast since it deep cycles to full discharge. That battery is simply
not designed for what I need to do.

Another problem is that I have to crank the engine after I start the
main rotor blades and get them into autorotation facing into the wind.
If there is no wind, I have to taxi to make relative wind and I have
to start the Rotax 582 to do that. I can't do that without a Mambo
battery.

BWB