Any opinions about this book about F-8s in Vietnam?

Actually, the F-4 had a higher kill ratio. It was a Navy F-4 that shot
down
the first MIG and no F-8 guy ever achieved "ACE" status. Having posted
that
fact I must admit that most of us who flew the F-4 are not particularly
fond
of Randy "Airhead" Cunningham.

Incorrect. The F-8 posted a 6:1 kill ratio (not counting the last Mig-17
that was a no ordnance expended kill ... given to the Hancock vice the
Crusader duo who engaged it). The F-4 was barely 2:1 until Topgun and 1972.
Then they ran at 12:1 (always the figure advertised) but the OVERALL figure
was around 5 point something.

Duke was an OK guy. Not the sharpest tool in the shed, but perhaps the
driver most dedicated to being prepared for an opportunity should it occur.
While others were reading Playboy on their alert 5's, Duker was running
switchology drills, reviewing missile envelopes, the whole nine yards. When
he came off a flak suppression run, he reset the gunsight to sidewinder
boresight (more than a few Migs escaped because the driver forgot to reset
the sight). He was a good, albeit not great driver (and would admit the
same).

At any rate as a TG instructor and later in VF-154 he never acted over the
top. Willy, OTOH, really started to believe he was somebody special.

Duke saw more Migs on 10 May 1972 than many air wings saw for the entire war
(CAG-19 comes to mind). Given that, he also capitalized on the opportunity.
(What is luck but when preparation meets opportunity?) In 1972, F-8's
couldn't BUY a vector or an engagement. The frustration of the time led to
the phrase, "A Mig at six is better than no Mig at all."

R / John

From: "John Carrier"
Date: 7/14/2003 13:17 Pacific Daylight Time

At any rate as a TG instructor and later in VF-154 he never acted over the
top. Willy, OTOH, really started to believe he was somebody special.

That's an interesting observation John When researching the history of VF-96
in the late 1980s I had the opposite impression.

Didn't interview either Duke or Willy, as the history wasn't the "Duke & Willy"
show, and there was plenty of available material for Connie's 71-72 cruise,
including all the MiG kills.

BTW, did interview Duke's first tour RIO ... He mentioned what you did about
Duke soaking up whatever he could, and they would fly any and all chances that
presented itself.

This isn't meant as an argument, just a general impression gained from some 15
years ago while researching.

Anyway ... g

MW
-------------------------------------
"As soon as movement begins, so does the fog of war" - Edward N. Luttwak

Have not read this one, but this one is worth reading as well. "MIG MASTER:
The story of the F-8 Crusader" by Barrett Tillman. Naval Institute Press 2ed
1990.
It tells the good, bad, and odd about the F-8 from start to finish.
Interesting to note our "friends" the French Navy kept flying Crusaders till
they retired in 1999.


Mike Potter wrote:

Has anyone looked at Osprey Publishing's book _F-8 Crusader Units of the
Vietnam War_? Is it worth buying?

The marketing description from
http://www.ospreypublishing.com/titl...ser=COM&per=36
reads:

F-8 Crusader Units of the Vietnam War

US Price: $19.95
UK Price: £12.99

About this book
Known to its pilots as the 'last of the gunfighters' due to its quartet
of Colt-Browning Mk 12 20 mm cannon, the F-8 Crusader was numerically
the most populous fighter in the US Navy at the start of America's
involvement in the Vietnam conflict in 1964 ? some 482 F-8C/D/Es
equipped 17 frontline units. It enjoyed great success against North
Vietnamese Mig-17s and Mig-21s during the Rolling Thunder campaign of
1965-68, officially downing 18 jets, which represented 53 per cent of
all Mig claims lodged by Navy squadrons during this period.

Contents
# First Engagement
# Setting Things Up
# Making a War
# Action in the Tonkin Gulf
# War Begins in Ernest
# MiG Killers
# Assessing the Enemy
# Beyond the MiGs
# 'Leatherneck' Crusaders, 1965-68
# Final Word