Navigation strategy on a short flight

On Jun 27, 9:59*pm, Mxsmanic wrote:
writes:
... obviously my answer doesn't mean a thing.

Unfortunately, I agree.

SO WHY DID YOU ASK???????????

Now you have PROVEN you are a troll and NOT HERE TO LEARN FROM REAL
EXPERIENCES.

writes:

SO WHY DID YOU ASK???????????

Because there are many other people reading this newsgroup, some of whom
actually know enough to answer the question.

On Jun 28, 5:37*am, Mxsmanic wrote:
writes:
SO WHY DID YOU ASK???????????

Because there are many other people reading this newsgroup,

AGAIN, I ASK YOU, WHY DID YOU ASK ME the following question. YOU
REPLIED TO MY POST.

The controller was a real person. What did he do that was unrealistic?

AND THEN YOU COME BACK WITH

writes:
... obviously my answer doesn't mean a thing.

Unfortunately, I agree.

YOU AGAIN are proven a dayem TROLL. YOU ARE NOT HERE TO LEARN FROM
REAL WORLD EXERIENCE.

some of whom actually know enough to answer the question.

YOU DON"T HAVE real world experience!!!!!!!! I GAVE YOU THE ANSWER.

So, how do you know that I did not answer the question since YOU DON'T
FLY an airplane?????????????????

On Jun 26, 5:39*pm, Mike Ash wrote:
In article ,

*Mxsmanic wrote:
Exclude pilotage

You should really put this at the top of your message next time, instead
of after 7 paragraphs of less relevant detail. Given that the two
airports are less than 32nm apart, that there are numerous landmarks
along the way, and that even dead reckoning will do a fine job of
depositing you close enough to your destination, I'm sure that everyone
wading through your seven previous paragraphs was repeatedly thinking,
"LOOK OUT THE WINDOW!" There can be merit in rejecting the obvious
solution, but if you're going to do it, you should do it right at the
start.

Some more concrete advice: pilotage really does work, very well. If you
want to practice other techniques, a stopwatch and a look at your
airspeed indicator will help you avoid that odd problem of always having
the impression that you've gone further than you actually have. Finally,
although there are indeed a lot of small airfields in the area, a quick
glance at the sectional reveals that virtually all of them have runways
pointed in different directions, so a quick way to figure out which one
you're looking at would be to read the gigantic numbers painted on the
threshold and compare with what's on the chart.

Oh, and one more thing: VFR-worthy GPS units are really cheap, and help
with this sort of problem immensely. An imaginary VFR-worthy GPS is
probably *really* cheap, and these days is probably more realistic than
going without one.

If any of this wasn't already blindingly obvious to you, then I suggest
your vast experience with aircraft simulation may have taught you less
about flying than you think it has.

--
Mike Ash
Radio Free Earth
Broadcasting from our climate-controlled studios deep inside the Moon

Mike, the reality is, any student who is past solo who gets lost (let
me define that -- does not know where he is) on a 30 some ,mile flight
should not have been signed off by his instructor.

Any pilot holding an instrument rating even with a minimal panel who
does not know where he is should be required to undergo retraining. In
the real world I'd like ATC to let the FAA know when pilots screw up,
because a survivable screw up now may not be survivable the next time.
In the real world we are required to have some 'book learning', in the
sim one all one needs is a computer and the software.

On 6/28/2010 6:27 AM, a wrote:
In
the real world I'd like ATC to let the FAA know when pilots screw up,
because a survivable screw up now may not be survivable the next time.

All you will do there is cause much higher accident/fatality rates as
you will encourage anyone that needs help to *not* ask for it.

In article ,
"Stephen!" wrote:

WARNING!! These pictures are *NOT* recommended viewing for those who pee
their pants when they think of flying across open water in a single
engine aircraft!

http://imagesdesavions.com/xcntry/nmi/index.html

Impressive! What kind of safety equipment do you have on board for that?
That does seem scary to me, but it's comforting to think that at least
the water is probably decently warm.

--
Mike Ash
Radio Free Earth
Broadcasting from our climate-controlled studios deep inside the Moon

In article ,
"Stephen!" wrote:

Mike Ash wrote in news:mike-6301E3.00192329062010@62-
183-169-81.bb.dnainternet.fi:

http://imagesdesavions.com/xcntry/nmi/index.html

Impressive! What kind of safety equipment do you have on board for that?
That does seem scary to me, but it's comforting to think that at least
the water is probably decently warm.

Every flight more than gliding distance from the shoreline had me
carrying a four-man raft with full provisions and wearing an inflatable
life vest. I also never fly without a hand-held radio and cell phone. The
cell phone wouldn't have done much good 50 miles off shore but the raft,
vest, and radio woulda been handy.

Excellent. I'm sure that helps give some peace of mind, although I'd
definitely want to avoid using that equipment if possible....

This was in the days long before SPOT tracking but if I were flying
around there now, I'd likely have one.

I fly with a SPOT. I mostly use it for the tracking mode so friends and
family can know what I'm up to while I'm in the air, but its use for
emergency signaling helps give me peace of mind. It's definitely a neat
piece of technology.

--
Mike Ash
Radio Free Earth
Broadcasting from our climate-controlled studios deep inside the Moon

Mike Ash wrote:
In article ,
"Stephen!" wrote:

WARNING!! These pictures are *NOT* recommended viewing for those who pee
their pants when they think of flying across open water in a single
engine aircraft!

http://imagesdesavions.com/xcntry/nmi/index.html

Impressive! What kind of safety equipment do you have on board for that?
That does seem scary to me, but it's comforting to think that at least
the water is probably decently warm.


I think you do well to be scared.
A flight over water means that the worst moment is half way.
It is then that given the option, you should be high enough
to glide ashore. A flight required to stay low for a
57 mile trip had better have at least a lifejacket and an
ELT or some such.

Brian W

"Stephen!" wrote in message
...
"Flaps_50!" wrote in news:936e4ca2-5f71-402d-ab98-
:

Use your compass / DI and allow for the drift expected from winds at
your altitude.


Now do it at 1500' MSL from PGSN to PGUM *without* a GPS and you've got
the return leg of one of my student solo cross "country" flights. 57 nm
between visual checkpoints across open water. At 1500' I was below both
the VOR and the RADAR on Guam. All I had to keep me company was my Mag
Compass, DG, and the COM radio until I got near Rota. The VOR was
flagged most the way back.

An unexpected/unpredicted cloud base moved in and I had the choice of
staying below or trying to get above them. Stopping in Saipan was *not*
an option. I wasn't even allowed to make the standard stop for log book
signing. Touch-and-go only due to Customs and Immigration regulations.
Still proud of my ded-reckoning on that one. When Rota finally came into
view, it was only 2° off my port bow.

Here are some snapshots of a time when the weather was better and I was
able to make the flight by visual checkpoints the entire way (I saw Rota
from 57 miles away):

WARNING!! These pictures are *NOT* recommended viewing for those who pee
their pants when they think of flying across open water in a single
engine aircraft!

http://imagesdesavions.com/xcntry/nmi/index.html

--
RCOS #7
IBA# 11465
http://imagesdesavions.com

It looks a lot like the Bahamas, only more grass and greener trees--perhaps
the soil is better.

BTW, I understand that it was always quite common for dual students to be
less than one mile off course when arriving at Bimini from Opa Locka. That
was about 60nm and KOPF did have a reasonably well maintained compass rose
back when I was familiar there--and I, too, did arrive very nearly on
course. Then again, the compass variation is small here on the east coast,
so we do have it pretty easy.

Peter

On Jun 29, 1:24*pm, "Peter Dohm" wrote:
"Stephen!" wrote in message

...



"Flaps_50!" wrote in news:936e4ca2-5f71-402d-ab98-
:

Use your compass / DI and allow for the drift expected from winds at
your altitude.

*Now do it at 1500' MSL from PGSN to PGUM *without* a GPS and you've got
the return leg of one of my student solo cross "country" flights. *57 nm
between visual checkpoints across open water. *At 1500' I was below both
the VOR and the RADAR on Guam. *All I had to keep me company was my Mag
Compass, DG, and the COM radio until I got near Rota. *The VOR was
flagged most the way back.

*An unexpected/unpredicted cloud base moved in and I had the choice of
staying below or trying to get above them. *Stopping in Saipan was *not*
an option. *I wasn't even allowed to make the standard stop for log book
signing. *Touch-and-go only due to Customs and Immigration regulations.
Still proud of my ded-reckoning on that one. *When Rota finally came into
view, it was only 2 off my port bow.

*Here are some snapshots of a time when the weather was better and I was
able to make the flight by visual checkpoints the entire way (I saw Rota
from 57 miles away):

WARNING!! These pictures are *NOT* recommended viewing for those who pee
their pants when they think of flying across open water in a single
engine aircraft!

http://imagesdesavions.com/xcntry/nmi/index.html

--
RCOS #7
IBA# 11465
http://imagesdesavions.com

It looks a lot like the Bahamas, only more grass and greener trees--perhaps
the soil is better.

BTW, I understand that it was always quite common for dual students to be
less than one mile off course when arriving at Bimini from Opa Locka. *That
was about 60nm and KOPF did have a reasonably well maintained compass rose
back when I was familiar there--and I, too, did arrive very nearly on
course. *Then again, the compass variation is small here on the east coast,
so we do have it pretty easy.

Peter

Re the Bahamas: some time ago I decided to go from Grand Bahama Island
to Nassau. While en route was told to delay my arrival time by a half
hour or 45 minutes because of thunderstorms. It was blue skies where
we were, and just to the side was an island with a dirt strip that
looked really inviting. I dragged the strip -- 500 feet, dirty, and it
looked like a great place to stop for a while. "OK" I told my pax,
"let's do that". I got back to about 900 feet, flew a downwind, base,
turned onto final, and we saw some people come out to the runway:
probably only two or three, but at the time it looked like an army
because they were all carrying long guns. I decided the message was,
this was a very private airstrip. Throttle forward, gear and flaps up,
and we got out of there pretty quickly. Then flew in circles for a
half hour.

Same trip after clearing customs in as I remember Hollywood FL, I had
finished a weather briefing and was approached by a guy who asked if I
was flying to Boston. He overheard part of the briefing. I told that
was my plan. He told me he had two hundred pounds of delicate
electronics he needed to get to Boston, and if I could hang around for
an hour he'd get them into my airplane. Then, with a wink, he said if
I took them I could keep a couple of pounds for myself.

I was wheels up very soon after that.

Electronics by the pound: interesting idea, isn't it?