Grand Canyon overflight proposal

One can fly anywhere. One can only commune with the grand canyon in silence at the grand canyon. So, flying should be restricted, by your comment above.

It seems as though you are in favor of being able to view the canyon from a certain perspective; backpacking or hiking in your case.

No, I am using Peter Duniho's reply to my abstract argument to support a
POV that resembles that. However, my argument (somewhat in support of
restrictions) is not based on "permitted perspectives of viewing".
Viewing is hardly the issue - experiencing is of far more depth. The
experience for which the national parks were created (that of unspoiled
wilderness) is adversely impacted by certain activities, such as
superhighways, jetskis, boomboxes, and the like. Airplanes fit into
this category. Gliders probably do not (though their support system may).

Restrict the air routes, and altitude, and make sure there are areas that will not be touched by the sound, but don't eliminate the wonderful perspective that viewing the grand canyon by air provides.

If this could be done, I'd be in favor. I don't know that it can't be
done, and I would love it if it could.

Jose
--
The price of freedom is... well... freedom.
for Email, make the obvious change in the address.

As long as they continue to regulate the parks, and still allow things like snowmobiles, there is no way you can convince me that eliminating airplanes is a just thing to do.

Aren't snowmobiles restricted? You can't go anywhere in the parks with
them, can you?

Jose
--
The price of freedom is... well... freedom.
for Email, make the obvious change in the address.

"Jose" wrote

Aren't snowmobiles restricted? You can't go anywhere in the parks with
them, can you?

I recall seeing a blurb on the tube about snowmobiles, and the number of
permits issued (number restricted) for snowmobiling in Yellowstone and
Teton, as I recall.

So yes, they are allowed, in at least some, national parks.
--
Jim in NC

Jay Honeck wrote:

You limit them to 2 days per week (or whatever) of flying rights, and
they won't survive. Pilots, handlers, ticket agents, etc., will be
thrown out of work, and hundreds (thousands?) of tourists will be
denied their flight of a lifetime every WEEK.

And hundreds OF thousands of tourists/hikers/walkers/visitors will be
denied a quiet experience. Who should win? To me, as a pilot, it's not
at all obvious. Name calling and knee-jerk reactions accomplish
nothing. The fact that a few folks may lose their jobs may or may not
be a factor.

You know, in general we talk about promoting aviation on this
group -- your comments seem quite out of step with this attitude.

Aviation is not the be-all and end-all of existence, no matter how much
I may love it. While I promote it relentlessly, it does not take
precedence over EVERYTHING. It is acceptable for folks to believe that
in certain circumstances, it's OK to restrict flying privileges.

You have no issue with the restriction on flying over populated areas
below 500 ft, I assume? Or most of the rest of the FAR's? Why not
eliminate them, and allow pilots to do whatever they like, wherever they
like, everyone else be damned?

It's a balance, just like everything else.

--
Marc J. Zeitlin
http://www.cozybuilders.org/
Copyright (c) 2006

So yes, they are allowed, in at least some, national parks.

No question they are allowed; question was are they restricted. They
are, at least as to number. They may also be, as to area.

Jose
--
The price of freedom is... well... freedom.
for Email, make the obvious change in the address.

No, they are owned by a tribe with their own set of rules to one extent
or another.

Jay Honeck wrote:
And no, none of the places I'm thinking of are on Indian lands. All
PUBLIC lands.

"Indian" lands aren't public?
--
Jay Honeck
Iowa City, IA
Pathfinder N56993
www.AlexisParkInn.com
"Your Aviation Destination"

Morgans wrote:

"Jose" wrote


Aren't snowmobiles restricted? You can't go anywhere in the parks
with them, can you?

I recall seeing a blurb on the tube about snowmobiles, and the number of
permits issued (number restricted) for snowmobiling in Yellowstone and
Teton, as I recall.

So yes, they are allowed, in at least some, national parks.


And where ever they are allowed you must stay on the roads that have
been closed for the winter to allow snowmobiling. You may not ever
leave the road.

"Newps" wrote

And where ever they are allowed you must stay on the roads that have been
closed for the winter to allow snowmobiling. You may not ever leave the
road.

From the special I saw, that must not be true, for all parks. They had
trails set up, all over the place, throughout the park.
--
Jim in NC

"Jose" wrote in message
t...
One can fly anywhere. One can only commune with the grand canyon in
silence at the grand canyon. So, flying should be restricted, by your
comment above.

It's not the flying that is the activity in question. It's the viewing of
the Grand Canyon. I even said so in my post, but you decided to trim that
part from your quote (I suppose to make your own post seem like it was a
relevant reply).

Pete

"Jose" wrote in message
...
How so? The national parks are areas where development is restricted, and
people are restricted, and noise is restricted, and lots of things are
restricted

They are public lands, where *everyone* (every person, that is...my dog is
not welcome) is granted equal access.

, so that those who choose to put out the BTUs to enjoy nature will have
some nature to enjoy. The premise is that those people should be able to
visit without interference from, well, not "anyone else", but from the hoi
polloi of civilization.

Wrong. The national park system was designed *for* the hoi polloi of
civilization.

Pete