Screwdrivered Security (a little long)

OK... So I flew home from Tom Ridge airport in Erie, PA today.

I couldn't fly myself there because of weather (freezing rain, snow, ice
and such), so I took the bus (Airbus, that is)...

Anyway, flying out from LGA everything was smooth as silk. I fly
commercially enough to know the routine and generally avoid beeping and
getting wanded because I forgot to take off my watch, etc.

Now I fly commercially on average once or twice a month (especially in
the winter). I carry two spare car keys in my wallet, which never goes on
the belt, and never go off. I have had this shirt-pocket-pen-style
computer screwdriver that I have had in my laptop bag for about 2 years.
I never take off my sneakers because there is no significant metal in
them, actually I didn't think there was any at all.

Until today...


On my flight home today, tho, I experienced the Tom Ridge treatment...
First of all, I beeped. I didn't actually hear the beep. Apparently it
would be a security breach to hear the beep go off.

So as the guy directs me to the wanding booth, my laptop bag is being
attacked and held up by two TSA agents. Of course, at the same time, the
third security agent is taking my laptop, my coat, and my other bag, and
shuffling them down to the end of the line for anyone to help themselves
to.

Immediately, I request the Wander to ask the Shuffler to give my laptop
and my other stuff to the Holder Upper to keep securely together while I
am getting wanded. Fortunately, they were willing to comply.

So the guy wands me for like 10 minutes. First, he somehow finds metal in
my sneakers. Not in the sole, but on the top. Now these sneakers are the
velcro-type - they don't even have laces, or metal grommets for laces. So
I have no idea where the metal is.

So he takes my shoes off, throws them in a box, and passes them off to
Mr. Shuffler for XRays.

Next, he wands every inch of my body. Quite thoroughly, I might add.
Several times, he had to adjust the position of my arms and legs to
ensure he properly hit all the crevices. Every single grommet and stud in
my pants pocket was thoroughly examined, as was the belt buckle, and my
zipper! It was quite interesting, although would have been much more
enjoyable if I had gotten Ms. Wander instead!

So now we go over to Mr. Holder Upper with my stuff. Now I happened to
have some computer connector wire assemblies that are fairly non-
standard. You might be able to buy them at Radio Shack, but the average
non-geek probably wouldn't even know what it was. So I figured that's
what the problem was, and started directing him toward them. He says,
"no, that's not it." Instead, he pulls out my little, narrow, pocket-pen-
style screwdriver, and shows it to his supervisor.


Then he takes the bag and runs it through the XRay again. At this point,
Mr. Supervisor explains to me that the airport has a policy prohibiting
passengers from carrying tools on the plane. I explain to him that I am
going home, and that the screwdriver has been flying with me for several
years now, and I have had no trouble with it at other airports. I did
have trouble with a crimping tool once, and they told me at that point
that there was a size limitation.

Bear in mind, of course, I have the computer connectors in my bag (wires
and such), I have my toiletry bag which has a couple of bic disposable
razors, and my fingernails haven't been cut in a couple of days.

But somehow, this teeny, precision slotted computer screwdriver is
considered a risk. At the end of the day, I didn't think I would have
time to go back and check it and then get wanded again and still make the
flight. And mailing was not offered as an option. So I told him to keep
it, but I got dibs on anything else they find in my bag.

This is just ridiculous already. Do they think that a terrorist's photo
ID won't match their ticket? Are they afraid that I might unscrew the
seatbelt during taxi, takeoff, or landing?

Or have we become a country of bumbling, cowering, idiots?

"For the land of naive, and the home of afraid..." ?

"Judah" wrote in message
...
|
| Or have we become a country of bumbling, cowering, idiots?

Bingo.

On 2004-02-05 21:59:41 -0800, "C J Campbell"
said:

| Or have we become a country of bumbling, cowering, idiots?

Bingo.

He stole my line!

--
Larry Fransson
Seattle, WA
E-mail address changes regularly to thwart spam.

This is just ridiculous already. Do they think that a terrorist's photo
ID won't match their ticket? Are they afraid that I might unscrew the
seatbelt during taxi, takeoff, or landing?

Or have we become a country of bumbling, cowering, idiots?

'Enjoyed' your account..... your last sentence hit the issue of the
absurdity of it all right on the head..

"Any society that would give up a little liberty to gain a little security
will deserve neither and lose both. "

-Benjamin Franklin-

--
--
=-----
Good Flights!

Cecil
PP-ASEL

Check out my personal flying adventures complete with pictures and text at:
www.bayareapilot.com

"I fly because it releases my mind from the tyranny of petty things."
- Antoine de Saint-Exupery -

"We who fly, do so for the love of flying. We are alive in the air with
this miracle that lies in our hands and beneath our feet"
- Cecil Day Lewis -
"Judah" wrote in message
...
OK... So I flew home from Tom Ridge airport in Erie, PA today.

I couldn't fly myself there because of weather (freezing rain, snow, ice
and such), so I took the bus (Airbus, that is)...

Anyway, flying out from LGA everything was smooth as silk. I fly
commercially enough to know the routine and generally avoid beeping and
getting wanded because I forgot to take off my watch, etc.

Now I fly commercially on average once or twice a month (especially in
the winter). I carry two spare car keys in my wallet, which never goes on
the belt, and never go off. I have had this shirt-pocket-pen-style
computer screwdriver that I have had in my laptop bag for about 2 years.
I never take off my sneakers because there is no significant metal in
them, actually I didn't think there was any at all.

Until today...


On my flight home today, tho, I experienced the Tom Ridge treatment...
First of all, I beeped. I didn't actually hear the beep. Apparently it
would be a security breach to hear the beep go off.

So as the guy directs me to the wanding booth, my laptop bag is being
attacked and held up by two TSA agents. Of course, at the same time, the
third security agent is taking my laptop, my coat, and my other bag, and
shuffling them down to the end of the line for anyone to help themselves
to.

Immediately, I request the Wander to ask the Shuffler to give my laptop
and my other stuff to the Holder Upper to keep securely together while I
am getting wanded. Fortunately, they were willing to comply.

So the guy wands me for like 10 minutes. First, he somehow finds metal in
my sneakers. Not in the sole, but on the top. Now these sneakers are the
velcro-type - they don't even have laces, or metal grommets for laces. So
I have no idea where the metal is.

So he takes my shoes off, throws them in a box, and passes them off to
Mr. Shuffler for XRays.

Next, he wands every inch of my body. Quite thoroughly, I might add.
Several times, he had to adjust the position of my arms and legs to
ensure he properly hit all the crevices. Every single grommet and stud in
my pants pocket was thoroughly examined, as was the belt buckle, and my
zipper! It was quite interesting, although would have been much more
enjoyable if I had gotten Ms. Wander instead!

So now we go over to Mr. Holder Upper with my stuff. Now I happened to
have some computer connector wire assemblies that are fairly non-
standard. You might be able to buy them at Radio Shack, but the average
non-geek probably wouldn't even know what it was. So I figured that's
what the problem was, and started directing him toward them. He says,
"no, that's not it." Instead, he pulls out my little, narrow, pocket-pen-
style screwdriver, and shows it to his supervisor.


Then he takes the bag and runs it through the XRay again. At this point,
Mr. Supervisor explains to me that the airport has a policy prohibiting
passengers from carrying tools on the plane. I explain to him that I am
going home, and that the screwdriver has been flying with me for several
years now, and I have had no trouble with it at other airports. I did
have trouble with a crimping tool once, and they told me at that point
that there was a size limitation.

Bear in mind, of course, I have the computer connectors in my bag (wires
and such), I have my toiletry bag which has a couple of bic disposable
razors, and my fingernails haven't been cut in a couple of days.

But somehow, this teeny, precision slotted computer screwdriver is
considered a risk. At the end of the day, I didn't think I would have
time to go back and check it and then get wanded again and still make the
flight. And mailing was not offered as an option. So I told him to keep
it, but I got dibs on anything else they find in my bag.



"For the land of naive, and the home of afraid..." ?

On Fri, 06 Feb 2004 05:29:51 GMT, Judah wrote:

OK... So I flew home from Tom Ridge airport in Erie, PA today.

I couldn't fly myself there because of weather (freezing rain, snow, ice
and such), so I took the bus (Airbus, that is)...

Anyway, flying out from LGA everything was smooth as silk. I fly
commercially enough to know the routine and generally avoid beeping and
getting wanded because I forgot to take off my watch, etc.

Now I fly commercially on average once or twice a month (especially in
the winter). I carry two spare car keys in my wallet, which never goes on
the belt, and never go off. I have had this shirt-pocket-pen-style
computer screwdriver that I have had in my laptop bag for about 2 years.
I never take off my sneakers because there is no significant metal in
them, actually I didn't think there was any at all.

Until today...


On my flight home today, tho, I experienced the Tom Ridge treatment...
First of all, I beeped. I didn't actually hear the beep. Apparently it
would be a security breach to hear the beep go off.

So as the guy directs me to the wanding booth, my laptop bag is being
attacked and held up by two TSA agents. Of course, at the same time, the
third security agent is taking my laptop, my coat, and my other bag, and
shuffling them down to the end of the line for anyone to help themselves
to.

Immediately, I request the Wander to ask the Shuffler to give my laptop
and my other stuff to the Holder Upper to keep securely together while I
am getting wanded. Fortunately, they were willing to comply.

So the guy wands me for like 10 minutes. First, he somehow finds metal in
my sneakers. Not in the sole, but on the top. Now these sneakers are the
velcro-type - they don't even have laces, or metal grommets for laces. So
I have no idea where the metal is.

So he takes my shoes off, throws them in a box, and passes them off to
Mr. Shuffler for XRays.

Next, he wands every inch of my body. Quite thoroughly, I might add.
Several times, he had to adjust the position of my arms and legs to
ensure he properly hit all the crevices. Every single grommet and stud in
my pants pocket was thoroughly examined, as was the belt buckle, and my
zipper! It was quite interesting, although would have been much more
enjoyable if I had gotten Ms. Wander instead!

So now we go over to Mr. Holder Upper with my stuff. Now I happened to
have some computer connector wire assemblies that are fairly non-
standard. You might be able to buy them at Radio Shack, but the average
non-geek probably wouldn't even know what it was. So I figured that's
what the problem was, and started directing him toward them. He says,
"no, that's not it." Instead, he pulls out my little, narrow, pocket-pen-
style screwdriver, and shows it to his supervisor.


Then he takes the bag and runs it through the XRay again. At this point,
Mr. Supervisor explains to me that the airport has a policy prohibiting
passengers from carrying tools on the plane. I explain to him that I am
going home, and that the screwdriver has been flying with me for several
years now, and I have had no trouble with it at other airports. I did
have trouble with a crimping tool once, and they told me at that point
that there was a size limitation.

Bear in mind, of course, I have the computer connectors in my bag (wires
and such), I have my toiletry bag which has a couple of bic disposable
razors, and my fingernails haven't been cut in a couple of days.

But somehow, this teeny, precision slotted computer screwdriver is
considered a risk. At the end of the day, I didn't think I would have
time to go back and check it and then get wanded again and still make the
flight. And mailing was not offered as an option. So I told him to keep
it, but I got dibs on anything else they find in my bag.

This is just ridiculous already. Do they think that a terrorist's photo
ID won't match their ticket? Are they afraid that I might unscrew the
seatbelt during taxi, takeoff, or landing?

Or have we become a country of bumbling, cowering, idiots?

"For the land of naive, and the home of afraid..." ?

It is irritating that there isn't an option to mail your stuff back
home at the airport. It is so easy to be in a rush on the way to the
airport and to forget to take something out of your pockets or laptop
bag. At ORD, they are collecting 100s if not 1000s of items a day
from passengers. Wonder what happens to them? Maybe the TSA workers
get a nice pocketknife collection.

-Nathan

Tell ya what...... get 'in the know' about the lack of thorough screening of
the people who service the plane in the 'catering trucks' (airplane meals,
et al) - those that actually have access to ALL the plane and then come back
and tell me again how you don't see the 'procedures' as so much window
dressing... which is what all this nonsense is. Think of Israel, with all
their anti-terrorist efforts over MANY years,,, you can't go a week without
hearing how some terrorist has blown him/herself up in a public market, or
with a truck loaded with explosives. And Israel's anti-terrorist methods
have been in place and honed over countless decades. ..... And that
conscientious objector who got those illegal items on the plane to make a
point (and he had it done multiple times AND he even wrote the govt. to let
them know when and where it was going to be done,,,, in advance). I think
he should have received a medal for trying to show us that the 'security
procedures' were only so much fluff and riddled with holes.

Don't even get me started on the absurdity AND constitutional violation of
TSA's pilot certificate revocation power - Let me get this right.... they
can TAKE your hard earned 'ticket' without telling you why,,, AND your only
recourse is an appeal to the original agency that made the accusation (no
third party),,, and you don't even know what you are defending yourself
against? Furthermore,,,, let me get this right, too......... You have a
terrorist who has a pilot's certificate and you take away his/her
certificate - do the 'powers that be' REALLY think that the terrorist is
really gonna say "Gee,,, I was going to commit a despicable act with a
plane, but if I were to fly, now, withOUT my certificate, THAT would be
illegal.... and golly, gosh, willikers,,,,, I wouldn't want to break the
law" Give me a break,,, window dressing and cotton candy passed as
substantive action... The truth is,,,, short of locking every person in
their house with a plethora of guards outside every house there is no
measure of security that is going to do very much.


--
--
=-----
Good Flights!

Cecil
PP-ASEL

Check out my personal flying adventures complete with pictures and text at:
www.bayareapilot.com

"I fly because it releases my mind from the tyranny of petty things."
- Antoine de Saint-Exupery -

"We who fly, do so for the love of flying. We are alive in the air with
this miracle that lies in our hands and beneath our feet"
- Cecil Day Lewis -

On 2004-02-06, Jeffrey Voight wrote:
Just to advocate on behalf of the devil for a second--

Some wag pointed out (on a net for this kind of topic) that
a far more effective security measure would be to pass out
large knives to all passangers

....but, since TSA is unlikely to adopt that practice I'll
continue to check my bags and pockets. Even in and out of
DCA and IAD the only delays I encounter is caused by newbie
travlers arguing with security over screwdrivers, pen knives
and other stuff that's been on the nightly news for two
years.

Judah wrote:

Or have we become a country of bumbling, cowering, idiots?

No, the people who are running the show are, so they think the rest of us are too.

George Patterson
Love, n.: A form of temporary insanity afflicting the young. It is curable
either by marriage or by removal of the afflicted from the circumstances
under which he incurred the condition. It is sometimes fatal, but more
often to the physician than to the patient.

I have flown back and forth to Israel on El-Al many times since I was in
the 1st grade - quite regularly while I was a teenager. Admittedly, I
haven't been back since before 9/11, but as rude as El Al people are
(especially the Flight Attendants), I am quite sure that they don't
confiscate pen-screwdrivers from their customers in the name of security.

And I also can tell you that we were poked fun at their security questions
from a very early age. ("Did you pack your own bags? Are you carrying any
bombs? Are you a good witch or a bad witch?")

I have flown through many airports since 9/11. I have been wanded two or
three times, and have not complained (much). I do believe there is
potential benefit (though not a failsafe) to check ID once, to scan people
for weapons. and to make sure that the people who get on the plane match
the bags that get on the plane (although even that may matter less now that
every bag gets X-Rayed). I don't complain that the TSA uses unpublished
blacklists for flagging passengers who require additional security
attention (El Al has been known to do this for a very long time, and I
believe the airlines have done this since before 9/11). In fact, I believe
airlines would be well served to cooperate in researching passengers before
they get on their planes.

I am not upset that the screwdriver was found, or even identified. That's
not the problem.

The problem is that they claim to be protecting the public, but basically
the process itself, at least in this case, was exactly the opposite. While
they were "protecting" me, they left my laptop exposed, sitting at the end
of the counter for anyone to stuff in their bag and take as their own.
While they were "protecting" me, they stole my favorite pocket screwdriver
and left me no options for keeping it except missing my plane and staying
another night in Erie or Pittsburgh. Their "high security" environment
protects Tom Ridge very nicely, since it's his name on the airport. But
quite frankly, they have taken the process too far and left gaping holes in
their own system.

Airport security is federally regulated, but apparently each airport has
its own rules. (As another example, LGA still requires you to show your ID
again upon boarding. Even the gate agent was making wisecracks about this
"security policy".)

I'm not advocating that we shouldn't have any security at airports
(although busses and trains seem to do OK without it). But when all of
this happened, I had flashes of Bernie Geotz dressed as a pilot wielding
his loaded pair of tweezers.


Jeffrey Voight wrote in news:_JMUb.14939$EH5.1447
@nwrddc01.gnilink.net:

Just to advocate on behalf of the devil for a second--

Isn't it more likely that we're upset that we can't be so cavalier in
our security procedures? I happen to be a big fan of laziness (Hard
work has a future payoff. Lazy pays of right now.). I like being able
to breeze through airport security. That seems to have been taken away
from me. I like being able to take my leisure in getting to the
airport. That's been taken away as well.

I recently got to fly into and out of Tel Aviv. I got to pass through
El Al security both ways. At no time did I think to myself, "Wow, this
is a lot of security. These people must really be cowardly idiots."

I did, however, think to myself, "Wow, this is a lot of security. I
hope nobody figures out how to sneak a Palestinian/Iraqi/Anybody else
that hates the Israelis bomb on board."

It seems to me that it's a case of what-changed-itis. In Israel,
nothing's changed. We don't suspect El Al of encouraging cowardace. In
the U.S., we had a dramatic recent change. Suddenly, we suspect us of
severe cowardace.

And, to look at some of the other places from which I've flown, I've
seen some pretty lazy security and, I haven't always felt safe. Knowing
that one can purchase a quick ride through security in Moscow didn't
make me feel any better about the fact that I had just purchased a quick
ride through security considering that I didn't really have much money
on me, nor was I carrying anything remotely dangerous. It didn't seem
to matter to our friendly panhandlers in uniform. I had money and for
that money, they would turn a blind-eye to my baggage. Without my
money, we were going to be in for a long wait. Who had what in their
baggage and had enough money to purchase their way through behind me?

The lessor of two evils may very well be to allow the occasional attack
on U.S. soil. A couple of thousand dead every few years really doesn't
compare to how many die from smoking or car accidents especially when
held up against my desire to board the aircraft with my nail clippers.

Jeff...

C J Campbell wrote:
"Judah" wrote in message
...
|
| Or have we become a country of bumbling, cowering, idiots?

Bingo.

Nathan Young wrote:
Judah wrote:

Or have we become a country of bumbling, cowering, idiots?

It seems so.

"For the land of naive, and the home of afraid..." ?

So chips are "naivety fries" now, eh?

It is irritating that there isn't an option to mail your stuff back
home at the airport. It is so easy to be in a rush on the way to the
airport and to forget to take something out of your pockets or laptop
bag. At ORD, they are collecting 100s if not 1000s of items a day
from passengers. Wonder what happens to them? Maybe the TSA workers
get a nice pocketknife collection.

There's one obvious solution to this stupidity for items which are
permissible in hold baggage: check the passenger and *all* his baggage
in one go and allow him to transfer items between his cabin and hold
bags.