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#1
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Youth Members in your (US) Club
Hi all,
I need your input on an issue that has led to an ongoing, heated debate ever since my son joined our soaring club at age 14. He begun taking lessons and soloed during a youth soaring camp organized by another club this summer. A small but vocal group of members are stricktly against youth- and family memberships. Kids under 18 are considered a liability, a hazard to themself during the operation and just not desirable members in their minds. All kinds of half-baked legalities are being cited i.e. that the club could get dragged down finacially if a minor would get hurt and a suit be filed by the parents, etc. I can't shake the impression that these guys would like to have a 'good 'ol boy county club with planes'! (Heck, the golf carts are already there!) Therefore my questions: Does your club have a youth/family membership category with reduced dues and/or waived initiation fees? Does your club have a youth program? Have there ever been any legal/insurance issues with minor members in your club? Any input is appreciated. (you may reply privately, if you don't want to discuss this on the net) Ulrich Neumann |
#2
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We support youth soaring with a discounted membership rate.
Most of the income to the club is from youth taking flying lessons. Our group insurance covers us, but in the event of a parental law suit for injuries.. no club is safe from financial ruin, could even happen if an adult is hurt and a disgruntled wife who hated flying finds a lawyer. Our instructors are pretty good evaluators of flying capability and attentiveness of the student, adult or otherwise. We've actually had to discourage more adults from learning to fly, then the youths. We've actually "kicked out" some adult rated pilots for their risky flying and not willing to change. They lead a poor example of professionalism for our kids. We have not had any legal problems with any of our members, youth or adult. BT "Ulrich Neumann" wrote in message om... Hi all, I need your input on an issue that has led to an ongoing, heated debate ever since my son joined our soaring club at age 14. He begun taking lessons and soloed during a youth soaring camp organized by another club this summer. A small but vocal group of members are stricktly against youth- and family memberships. Kids under 18 are considered a liability, a hazard to themself during the operation and just not desirable members in their minds. All kinds of half-baked legalities are being cited i.e. that the club could get dragged down finacially if a minor would get hurt and a suit be filed by the parents, etc. I can't shake the impression that these guys would like to have a 'good 'ol boy county club with planes'! (Heck, the golf carts are already there!) Therefore my questions: Does your club have a youth/family membership category with reduced dues and/or waived initiation fees? Does your club have a youth program? Have there ever been any legal/insurance issues with minor members in your club? Any input is appreciated. (you may reply privately, if you don't want to discuss this on the net) Ulrich Neumann |
#3
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"Ulrich Neumann" wrote in message om... Hi all, I need your input on an issue that has led to an ongoing, heated debate ever since my son joined our soaring club at age 14. He begun taking lessons and soloed during a youth soaring camp organized by another club this summer. A small but vocal group of members are stricktly against youth- and family memberships. Kids under 18 are considered a liability, a hazard to themself during the operation and just not desirable members in their minds. All kinds of half-baked legalities are being cited i.e. that the club could get dragged down finacially if a minor would get hurt and a suit be filed by the parents, etc. I can't shake the impression that these guys would like to have a 'good 'ol boy county club with planes'! (Heck, the golf carts are already there!) Therefore my questions: Does your club have a youth/family membership category with reduced dues and/or waived initiation fees? Does your club have a youth program? Have there ever been any legal/insurance issues with minor members in your club? Any input is appreciated. (you may reply privately, if you don't want to discuss this on the net) Ulrich Neumann My club supports both youth and family members with discounted joining fees and dues (50%). You are no more likely to be sued by a parent than a widow(er) in the event of an incident. If you are training to approved standards and documenting such training, there should be no issues. If there are holes in that picture, there are other, more serious issues that need tending to. Youth programs can consist of simple support/relief to formalized full-ride, merit/performance based youth programs such as Harris Hill Soaring or Texas Soaring Association, that go beyond simple fee reduction. Youth programs and club planning will be on the club track program on Friday at the 2005 SSA Convention. Frank Whiteley |
#4
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Hi, at my club here in the UK we see things similar to yourself.
We do get a fair amount of youngsters in during the summer months (school or college hols) but they drop off during the term times. One point that seems to fit a fair amount of returnees though is that they went gliding during their youth. So if your guys want to cut off older members in later times, let them carry on. Probably like most hobbies/sports you see the same as we do, a declining youth level and older and older pilots? This point affects even the instructor levels and is a source of much anguish in the sport. I suggest you put some of these "older mentality" guys out to grass! Malcolm... (aged 53 and 3/4's) "Ulrich Neumann" wrote in message om... Hi all, I need your input on an issue that has led to an ongoing, heated debate ever since my son joined our soaring club at age 14. He begun taking lessons and soloed during a youth soaring camp organized by another club this summer. A small but vocal group of members are stricktly against youth- and family memberships. Kids under 18 are considered a liability, a hazard to themself during the operation and just not desirable members in their minds. All kinds of half-baked legalities are being cited i.e. that the club could get dragged down finacially if a minor would get hurt and a suit be filed by the parents, etc. I can't shake the impression that these guys would like to have a 'good 'ol boy county club with planes'! (Heck, the golf carts are already there!) Therefore my questions: Does your club have a youth/family membership category with reduced dues and/or waived initiation fees? Does your club have a youth program? Have there ever been any legal/insurance issues with minor members in your club? Any input is appreciated. (you may reply privately, if you don't want to discuss this on the net) Ulrich Neumann |
#5
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Our club actively supports youth soaring and family memberships. We
recognize that as we look at out young members we are looking at the future of soaring. Our support includes not only discounted membership, but a very active youth scholarship program which is entirely supported by donations, mostly from members, not dues. The club also supports the local CAP cadet soaring program and allows them use of our facilities without charge. The "Soaring Magazine" Milestones column each month also provides a thumbnail sketch of many club's support of youth activity. Skip Guimond |
#6
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#7
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Hi,
A quick note about our club policies. At Memphis Soaring Society all memberships are FAMILY memberships. This means that spouses and children are included in one initiation fee. There is the additional fee for the SSA memberships of the additional family members, but that is small. Our club encourages the sport and glider port as a family activity. We have a small number of youth who are actually flying at this time. In the short time that I have been a member (2.5 years) there have been no incidents where youth has been a factor. With that being said, my spouse has said she has no intent of ever seeing the gliderport. Oh well..... I do think this is a great policy for a club to take. Somewhere deep in the charter of this club it is stated one purpose is to provide flight training for the lowest cost possible. Now from my personal viewpoint. I began flying at 15 (power) and only wish this sort of club had been available. This is an aging sport, we MUST encourage youth soaring or this sport will wither. The affiliation with CAP is well meaning, but most kids do not wish to march in uniform to the barked orders of some wanna-a-be colonel who probably never served a day in his life. (My apologies to some of the few stellar squadrons out there) I think that clubs that promote youth flying are clubs that are working to insure their own futures. (Just a personal opinion) I am going to enclose the url to our club's website if anyone is interested. In closing,,, please forgive me for my self-serving promotion of our club..... To the Ulrich,,, I hope you are able to find encouragement for your son from your organization, after all, it is in THEIR best interest also. and btw....send me your mail address email. I think I never sent you the mylar I promised last year for root seals. Take Care and Fly Safe, Joe Hyde http://www.memphis-soaring.org/ "Ulrich Neumann" wrote in message om... Hi all, I need your input on an issue that has led to an ongoing, heated debate ever since my son joined our soaring club at age 14. He begun taking lessons and soloed during a youth soaring camp organized by another club this summer. A small but vocal group of members are stricktly against youth- and family memberships. Kids under 18 are considered a liability, a hazard to themself during the operation and just not desirable members in their minds. All kinds of half-baked legalities are being cited i.e. that the club could get dragged down finacially if a minor would get hurt and a suit be filed by the parents, etc. I can't shake the impression that these guys would like to have a 'good 'ol boy county club with planes'! (Heck, the golf carts are already there!) Therefore my questions: Does your club have a youth/family membership category with reduced dues and/or waived initiation fees? Does your club have a youth program? Have there ever been any legal/insurance issues with minor members in your club? Any input is appreciated. (you may reply privately, if you don't want to discuss this on the net) Ulrich Neumann |
#8
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Ulrich....
The situation you describe is somthing that many parents and juniors deal with all the time. I was lucky enough to start flying (when 14) at an operation that supported juniors, and all my local clubs have always been like that. My experience in other places, however, hasn't been as great. I've flown at several commercial operations throughout the years, all of them seemingly convinced my sole purpose in attempting to rent their equipment was to break it. Standard procedure when checking out juniors seems to be multiple rope breaks at places I don't consider safe at all (and, as an instructor, would never put a student, pilot getting a BFR or spring checkout, ect. in). At one location, after satisfying their instructor, I was actually complemented. At another, after the 3rd ropebreak in a row this one in a position that was beyond my not safe level (and into my punch the instructor in the face area) I walked away no longer interested in flying there. Incidently, two things came from that. One, the instructor recently ran for the SSA Board on a "pro juniors" position. Its amazing what people will say to try to get elected. Thank god he didnt. Secondly, a pilot was recently killed because of a rope break at that airport. I called a friend, only to find out that the ropebreak occured at the same place and altitude where I had been given an intentional ropebreak. I guess now I'm glad I'm still alive today. In many places, there seems to be an anti-youth culture. I can remember one MAJOR figure in soaring and a prominent author write an article about how he thought DPE's weren't following the PTS as they should be. All of his examples cited juniors who he felt shouldnt be a private pilot, or even a CFIG. I think that on the whole, the majority of pilots across all fields of aviation support youth, but there is a small minority that dosen't. The problem with this is the minority is vocal, and the majority in this country just haven't been doing whats needed to be done to fix the situation. Help is on the way, however. Watch this forumn for in the next few weeks as myself and several others are working to form a major new organization for Junior soaring in the US, and you should be seeing somthing soon. Kevin Christner, CFIG Jantar Std. 2 N932KC |
#9
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"Joseph L. Hyde" wrote in message .. . Hi, A quick note about our club policies. At Memphis Soaring Society all memberships are FAMILY memberships. This means that spouses and children are included in one initiation fee. There is the additional fee for the SSA memberships of the additional family members, but that is small. Our club encourages the sport and glider port as a family activity. We have a small number of youth who are actually flying at this time. In the short time that I have been a member (2.5 years) there have been no incidents where youth has been a factor. With that being said, my spouse has said she has no intent of ever seeing the gliderport. Oh well..... I do think this is a great policy for a club to take. Somewhere deep in the charter of this club it is stated one purpose is to provide flight training for the lowest cost possible. Now from my personal viewpoint. I began flying at 15 (power) and only wish this sort of club had been available. This is an aging sport, we MUST encourage youth soaring or this sport will wither. The affiliation with CAP is well meaning, but most kids do not wish to march in uniform to the barked orders of some wanna-a-be colonel who probably never served a day in his life. (My apologies to some of the few stellar squadrons out there) I think that clubs that promote youth flying are clubs that are working to insure their own futures. (Just a personal opinion) I am going to enclose the url to our club's website if anyone is interested. In closing,,, please forgive me for my self-serving promotion of our club..... To the Ulrich,,, I hope you are able to find encouragement for your son from your organization, after all, it is in THEIR best interest also. and btw....send me your mail address email. I think I never sent you the mylar I promised last year for root seals. Take Care and Fly Safe, Joe Hyde Surprisingly, wear of the uniform was one of the big draws to CAP (according to a survey). My local CAP squadron does scant little, if any, flying. Other squadrons do much better. Explorer Scouting may be an opportunity to organize a youth group with an aviation emphasis. See http://www.learning-for-life.org/exp...ion/index.html Frank Whiteley |
#10
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"Ulrich Neumann" wrote in message
om... Therefore my questions: Does your club have a youth/family membership category with reduced dues and/or waived initiation fees? Does your club have a youth program? Have there ever been any legal/insurance issues with minor members in your club? Any input is appreciated. (you may reply privately, if you don't want to discuss this on the net) snip Most of the Clubs in Region IV - including my own, Skyline - have some kind of youth membershi/involvement with a special membership category/fee structure. One (Tidewater) offers SUBSTANTIAL youth scholarships!!! In addition, there's an active CAP program for youth in gliders, although not every Wing (state) provides instrutcion beyond "Orientation rides". FWIW, the "problem" - at the risk of horrible oversimplification - seems to be a cultural one in which the "boomer" generation (and maybe the younger "boomer echo" generation") is far, far more risk-averse than the generations that currently represent the patriarchs of soaring (like mine - I'm 68 years old.) Frankly, I think this cultural issue is one that we need to get a lot smarter about in soaring if we're to survive . . . but the solution certainly isn't to turn our collective backs on young people, but to figure out how to deliver safe soaring to a short attention span, risk averse population . . . Jim Kellett, Resident Curmudgeon "Facts do not cease to exist because they are ignored ." -Aldous Huxley |
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