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ASW-19 Maximum Weight



 
 
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  #21  
Old October 18th 18, 09:51 PM posted to rec.aviation.soaring
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Default ASW-19 Maximum Weight

On Thursday, October 18, 2018 at 3:56:29 PM UTC-4, Ouroboros wrote:
I'd also like to know why this 805 pound dry weight limit isn't mentioned in the manual. I've now seen three other weight and balance calculations for ASW-19s and none of them compare dry loaded weights to 805 pounds, even though that would be the limiting factor for their max pilot weights.

Kind of ticks me off that such an important number isn't in the manufacturers documentation.


What does the flight manual say for this configuration?
UH
  #22  
Old October 18th 18, 10:19 PM posted to rec.aviation.soaring
Ouroboros
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Default ASW-19 Maximum Weight

Here's a link to a copy of the manual:
https://drive.google.com/file/d/1TUV...w?usp=drivesdk

I only see mention of a maximum all up weight and maximum non lifting parts. The manual does have a table for maximum water ballast carried depending on cockpit load, but again is only limited by max gross and non lifting parts.
  #23  
Old October 19th 18, 01:12 AM posted to rec.aviation.soaring
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Default ASW-19 Maximum Weight

On Thursday, October 18, 2018 at 5:19:34 PM UTC-4, Ouroboros wrote:
Here's a link to a copy of the manual:
https://drive.google.com/file/d/1TUV...w?usp=drivesdk

I only see mention of a maximum all up weight and maximum non lifting parts. The manual does have a table for maximum water ballast carried depending on cockpit load, but again is only limited by max gross and non lifting parts.


The manual(note it is for a 19B) is clear. If you have the weighing info that provides wing weight,in addition to total empty weight, you can determine the max pilot weight for that glider based upon max weight of non lifting components. The manual specifically describes fairly heavy pilot mass in the cockpit.
If it is not a B, there is descriptive info on the Schleicher web site on how to do so. It is not a big deal.
Been There Done That
UH
  #24  
Old October 19th 18, 01:18 AM posted to rec.aviation.soaring
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Posts: 2,124
Default ASW-19 Maximum Weight

On Thursday, October 18, 2018 at 8:12:31 PM UTC-4, wrote:
On Thursday, October 18, 2018 at 5:19:34 PM UTC-4, Ouroboros wrote:
Here's a link to a copy of the manual:
https://drive.google.com/file/d/1TUV...w?usp=drivesdk

I only see mention of a maximum all up weight and maximum non lifting parts. The manual does have a table for maximum water ballast carried depending on cockpit load, but again is only limited by max gross and non lifting parts.


The manual(note it is for a 19B) is clear. If you have the weighing info that provides wing weight,in addition to total empty weight, you can determine the max pilot weight for that glider based upon max weight of non lifting components. The manual specifically describes fairly heavy pilot mass in the cockpit.
If it is not a B, there is descriptive info on the Schleicher web site on how to do so. It is not a big deal.
Been There Done That
UH


Info:
https://www.alexander-schleicher.de/..._TM06AB_E..pdf

Raises max mass of pilot to about 254 lb.

UH
  #25  
Old October 19th 18, 02:37 AM posted to rec.aviation.soaring
Ouroboros
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Posts: 13
Default ASW-19 Maximum Weight

That TN doesn't increase the max weight without water, which is the limiting number for this particular glider and the number that is not in the manual.
  #26  
Old October 19th 18, 12:52 PM posted to rec.aviation.soaring
Jonathan Walker
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Posts: 10
Default ASW-19 Maximum Weight

At 01:37 19 October 2018, Ouroboros wrote:
That TN doesn't increase the max weight without water, which is the
limiting number for this particular glider and the number that is not in
the manual.


Unless I am missing something all you need to know is the particular
gliders actual (not assumed manufactured) weight of the non-lifting parts.

The max pilot (actually payload, pilot / parachute / ballast weights /
onboard snacks etc) weight is then the lower of:

a) Weight of the actual non-lifting parts subtract from the manuals max
non-lifting parts weight of 230kg (507lbs).
Or
b) 115kg (253.4lbs) which the manuals max pilot weight.
Or
c) The max all up weight less the empty weight (very unlikely to come into
play)

This all assumes that the empty CofG limit is inside the manual
limitations.

The max weight without water is not relevant and most new aircraft don't
list it. You know the max non-lifting parts weight (the critical point due
to bending loads), and the max all up weight inc water
(undercarriage/structural and flight stress loads), then the difference has
to be all in the wings. The aircraft doesn't know if the wings weight is
structure or water so is happy to fly!


  #27  
Old October 19th 18, 01:17 PM posted to rec.aviation.soaring
Jonathan Walker
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Posts: 10
Default ASW-19 Maximum Weight

At 11:52 19 October 2018, Jonathan Walker wrote:
At 01:37 19 October 2018, Ouroboros wrote:
That TN doesn't increase the max weight without water, which is the
limiting number for this particular glider and the number that is not in
the manual.


------------
Ill try again and see if it still chops off the end of each sentence!!!
------------

Unless I am missing something all you need to know is the particular
gliders actual (not assumed manufactured) weight of the non-lifting parts.

The max pilot (actually payload, pilot / parachute / ballast weights /
onboard snacks etc) weight is then the lower of:

a) Weight of the actual non-lifting parts subtract from the manuals max
non-lifting parts weight of 230kg (507lbs).
Or
b) 115kg (253.4lbs) which the manuals max pilot weight.
Or
c) The max all up weight less the empty weight (very unlikely to come into
play)

This all assumes that the empty CofG limit is inside the manual
limitations.

The max weight without water is not relevant and most new aircraft don't
list it. You know the max non-lifting parts weight (the critical point due
to bending loads), and the max all up weight inc water
(undercarriage/structural and flight stress loads), then the difference has
to be all in the wings. The aircraft doesn't know if the wings weight is
structure or water so is happy to fly!



  #28  
Old October 19th 18, 01:43 PM posted to rec.aviation.soaring
[email protected]
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Posts: 2,124
Default ASW-19 Maximum Weight

On Friday, October 19, 2018 at 8:00:05 AM UTC-4, Jonathan Walker wrote:
At 01:37 19 October 2018, Ouroboros wrote:
That TN doesn't increase the max weight without water, which is the
limiting number for this particular glider and the number that is not in
the manual.


Unless I am missing something all you need to know is the particular
gliders actual (not assumed manufactured) weight of the non-lifting parts.

The max pilot (actually payload, pilot / parachute / ballast weights /
onboard snacks etc) weight is then the lower of:

a) Weight of the actual non-lifting parts subtract from the manuals max
non-lifting parts weight of 230kg (507lbs).
Or
b) 115kg (253.4lbs) which the manuals max pilot weight.
Or
c) The max all up weight less the empty weight (very unlikely to come into
play)

This all assumes that the empty CofG limit is inside the manual
limitations.

The max weight without water is not relevant and most new aircraft don't
list it. You know the max non-lifting parts weight (the critical point due
to bending loads), and the max all up weight inc water
(undercarriage/structural and flight stress loads), then the difference has
to be all in the wings. The aircraft doesn't know if the wings weight is
structure or water so is happy to fly!


This is a full description of where I was leading. Well stated.
UH
  #29  
Old October 19th 18, 03:31 PM posted to rec.aviation.soaring
Dan Marotta
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Posts: 4,601
Default ASW-19 Maximum Weight

What about the weight of the horizontal stabilizer?Â* Given that it
produces negative lift and contributes to the bending loads on the main
spar, is it considered a lifting part or part of the non lifting components?

On 10/19/2018 5:52 AM, Jonathan Walker wrote:
At 01:37 19 October 2018, Ouroboros wrote:
That TN doesn't increase the max weight without water, which is the
limiting number for this particular glider and the number that is not in
the manual.

Unless I am missing something all you need to know is the particular
gliders actual (not assumed manufactured) weight of the non-lifting parts.

The max pilot (actually payload, pilot / parachute / ballast weights /
onboard snacks etc) weight is then the lower of:

a) Weight of the actual non-lifting parts subtract from the manuals max
non-lifting parts weight of 230kg (507lbs).
Or
b) 115kg (253.4lbs) which the manuals max pilot weight.
Or
c) The max all up weight less the empty weight (very unlikely to come into
play)

This all assumes that the empty CofG limit is inside the manual
limitations.

The max weight without water is not relevant and most new aircraft don't
list it. You know the max non-lifting parts weight (the critical point due
to bending loads), and the max all up weight inc water
(undercarriage/structural and flight stress loads), then the difference has
to be all in the wings. The aircraft doesn't know if the wings weight is
structure or water so is happy to fly!



--
Dan, 5J
  #30  
Old October 19th 18, 03:57 PM posted to rec.aviation.soaring
Jonathan Walker
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 10
Default ASW-19 Maximum Weight

At 14:31 19 October 2018, Dan Marotta wrote:
What about the weight of the horizontal stabilizer?Â* Given that it
produces negative lift and contributes to the bending loads on the main
spar, is it considered a lifting part or part of the non lifting
components?


All except the wings are non-lifting parts in terms of the weight
scheduled.


On 10/19/2018 5:52 AM, Jonathan Walker wrote:
At 01:37 19 October 2018, Ouroboros wrote:
That TN doesn't increase the max weight without water, which is the
limiting number for this particular glider and the number that is not

in
the manual.

Unless I am missing something all you need to know is the particular
gliders actual (not assumed manufactured) weight of the non-lifting

parts.

The max pilot (actually payload, pilot / parachute / ballast weights /
onboard snacks etc) weight is then the lower of:

a) Weight of the actual non-lifting parts subtract from the manuals max
non-lifting parts weight of 230kg (507lbs).
Or
b) 115kg (253.4lbs) which the manuals max pilot weight.
Or
c) The max all up weight less the empty weight (very unlikely to come

into
play)

This all assumes that the empty CofG limit is inside the manual
limitations.

The max weight without water is not relevant and most new aircraft

don't
list it. You know the max non-lifting parts weight (the critical point

due
to bending loads), and the max all up weight inc water
(undercarriage/structural and flight stress loads), then the difference

has
to be all in the wings. The aircraft doesn't know if the wings weight

is
structure or water so is happy to fly!



--
Dan, 5J


 




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