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Matt Whiting writes:

Getting out and approaching the officer will really tick him/her off.

Why? It's not illegal. And if the officer is competent, it doesn't matter
whether or not he is ticked off.

On May 28, 12:19 pm, Matt Whiting wrote:
chris wrote:
On May 28, 11:15 am, Matt Whiting wrote:
chris wrote:
On May 28, 10:08 am, Mxsmanic wrote:
chris writes:
Maybe that's why our police don't kill people half as often - there's
almost no chance the guy behind the wheel has a gun, so no need to
shoot him if he comes at you???
This is certainly true in France. The average person has no gun, so when you
are stopped by the side of the road, if you open the door or get out of the
car, you don't have to worry about being shot. At the same time, the cops are
reasonably sure that anyone who pulls a gun is a hardened crook, and not an
innocent person exercising his right to carry a firearm. Thus, they don't
have to constantly worry about having to draw and shoot in normal situations,
and they don't have to ask themselves if someone pointing a gun at them is
just a regular guy protecting himself.
Are we saying that in the US you can't get out of the car when pulled
over by the police?? I have been pulled over a few times here and
always got out.. Figured if I was in trouble I shouldn't make him
come to me or I might **** him off even more :-)
It is highly inadvisable to get out of the car. You should remain in
the car, roll down you window and then keep your hands on the steering
wheel.

Getting out and approaching the officer will really tick him/her off.

Matt- Hide quoted text -

- Show quoted text -

Why???

The officer has no idea who is in the car, what they may be high on or
what they may have just done. We had a local police officer killed a
year or so ago when he pulled over a car with three people who had just
robbed a bank. Unfortunately, the call had not yet been dispatched and
he wasn't aware that the robbery had just been committed.

It is safer for the officer if the car occupants remain inside until
they have been identified and a radio check made for any outstanding
warrants.

99 out of 100 stops are routine, but it is the 1% that can get an
officer killed. Having the occupants remain in the car gives them more
control of the situation until they have it scoped out fully.

Matt- Hide quoted text -

- Show quoted text -

I see.. I sort of thought if you sat in your car the police can't see
if you've got a weapon on you until they're right up to your window
but if you get out and stand up they can see your hands are empty. Or
am I talking crap again?

Matt Whiting wrote:
Getting out and approaching the officer will really tick him/her off.

I discovered another thing that tick them off: I was following a friend's
car. Said friend got stopped by a police car (I can't remember why,
missing sticker, or something like that); well, I just stopped
behind them both, thinking that I'll just wait for whatever they were
up to to be over; ooops, big mistake.

--Sylvain

On May 28, 1:51 pm, Sylvain wrote:
Matt Whiting wrote:
Getting out and approaching the officer will really tick him/her off.

I discovered another thing that tick them off: I was following a friend's
car. Said friend got stopped by a police car (I can't remember why,
missing sticker, or something like that); well, I just stopped
behind them both, thinking that I'll just wait for whatever they were
up to to be over; ooops, big mistake.

--Sylvain

Really?? They've obviously got even less of a sense of humour than our
police!!

In article . com,
chris wrote:

There's other ways to defend yourself other than carrying a deadly
weapon.

so you admit that carrying a deadly weapon is indeed one way to
defend yourself.

--
Bob Noel
(goodness, please trim replies!!!)

On 27 May 2007 18:59:51 -0700, chris wrote:

On May 28, 1:51 pm, Sylvain wrote:
Matt Whiting wrote:
Getting out and approaching the officer will really tick him/her off.

I discovered another thing that tick them off: I was following a friend's
car. Said friend got stopped by a police car (I can't remember why,
missing sticker, or something like that); well, I just stopped
behind them both, thinking that I'll just wait for whatever they were
up to to be over; ooops, big mistake.

--Sylvain

Really?? They've obviously got even less of a sense of humour than our
police!!

They have this concern about being shot in the back. Comes from
associating with people whose sense of humor lies in that direction.

Don

"kontiki" wrote

Jeeze, you can't be that ignorant. At times you display amazing
understanding... and other times amazing ignorance.

One could say the same thing about you, in regard to this post, because the
answer is so obvious.

It is called TROLLING ! ! !
--
Jim in NC

On May 28, 4:20 pm, Nomen Nescio wrote:
-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-----

From: chris

From what I've read it sounds like any nut job can carry a concealed
gun..

Legally. NO!
In my state (and most) a license to carry a concealed weapon requires
one to be fingerprinted, photographed, and run through the FBI database.
You are also required to take an approved training course before you
even apply for a license.


That actually sounds reasonable.. Although I would think all of the
above should apply to any firearms license!!!


Are you happy for someone to walk into your work with a gun in

their pocket? Or a bank?

Carrying a LEGAL weapon? Not only do I have no problem with it and
do so often (as does my wife)....... I wish more people would.

How does the bank teller or the security
guard out front know the guy who just walked inside isn't going to
hold up the bank???

AFAIK, they've never even known I was carrying a gun. I'm not exactly
waving it around in the air as I walk into the bank. If I don't know you and
suddenly let you know that I have a gun............You're about to have a BAD
day.

So, I am just curious, what happens when someone who is carrying a
concealed gun accidentally drops it or something, and the public sees
the gun - do they run off screaming like they do on the movies??? And
would the knowledge that random members of the public you are
interacting with, could well be carrying a gun, make you suspicious
and paranoid of your fellow citizen??? I am not trying to have a go
at you guys, but I think this is a fair question!



Must suck to be the police in your country, never knowing if the car
they've pulled over has a guy inside ready to draw his gun on them??

That's true anywhere! When I've been pulled over by the police, the
first thing I do is inform them that I am LEGALLY carrying a concealed
handgun. The usual question is "where?". I tell them and then ask how
they want to handle it. The responses have ranged from "Just keep
your hand away from it" to having the officer remove it from my holster.
I then have to show my license to carry, after which it tends to be a
non-issue. Actually, I think I've gotten out of a ticket a few times since
legally carrying a firearm tends to identify you as one of the "good guys".
I've even had conversations with officers about the gun I carry. A Sig 239
.40 cal with a Crimson Trace laser sight and a custom action job. Hell,
my only worry that some cop may try to confiscate it and keep it for his own
personal weapon. Many of them hate carrying a Glock.


I think that's what our police carry, when they do carry - most often
they are unarmed. There is a Taser trial going on at the moment, but
a good number of the public oppose the Police use of Tasers because
they don't want the police to misuse the Tasers. I think it's silly
really...


Maybe that's why our police don't kill people half as often - there's
almost no chance the guy behind the wheel has a gun, so no need to
shoot him if he comes at you???

How many violent gang members of a, um, diverse racial background
do you have in your country that have prior felony convictions and carry
ILLEGAL firearms? Do you have a lot of brain dead liberals who consider
criminals to be "victims of society" in your country?


In order: 1) Probably quite a few, although you don't tend to hear of
it that often
2) Lots!!!!

There is the odd gang shooting, but it's relatively uncommon.


You might be interested in this linkhttp://www.nraila.org/Legislation/Federal/Read.aspx?id=3047


I had a look at that, but I am inclined not to take a document like
that on the NRA website at face value, so I will do a bit more
digging..

Matt Whiting wrote:
99 out of 100 stops are routine, but it is the 1% that can get an
officer killed. Having the occupants remain in the car gives them
more control of the situation until they have it scoped out fully.

Your stats are way off. Less than 1 in 300,000 stops are likely to get an
officer killed.

The supporting math: 54 officers died nationwide in shootings in _all_
aspects of their work[1] in 2006, including shootings not related to
traffic stops. There were ~16.7 million traffic stops reported nationwide
in 2002[2]. Assuming the stats between 2002 and 2006 did not change
significantly, that yields a rate of less than one death every 300,000
stops. Ironically, according to reference [1]:

"[...] traffic-related incidents claimed the lives of more officers (73)
than shootings (54) or any other cause of death. Of the 73 officers who
died in traffic-related incidents, 47 were killed in automobile crashes, 15
were struck by vehicles, nine died in motorcycle crashes, and two died in
bicycle crashes."

Obligatory aviation content from that same reference:

"Other causes of deaths included job-related illnesses (18), aircraft
crashes (3), beating (1), stabbing (1) and terrorist attack (1). Five of
the officers killed during 2006 were women."

Aircraft killed more cops in 2006 than terrorists! (In the U.S. ....)

[1] http://www.nleomf.org/media/press/LODYearend06.htm
[2] http://www.ojp.usdoj.gov/bjs/pub/pdf/cdsp02.pdf

"Matt Whiting" wrote in message
...
chris wrote:
On May 28, 8:58 am, "Maxwell" wrote:
"Martin Hotze" wrote in message

...

Maybe that's why our police don't kill people half as often - there's
almost no chance the guy behind the wheel has a gun, so no need to
shoot him if he comes at you???

It must suck to be in your country and be defenseless against criminals.

I have a better chance of winning the lottery than being killed by a gun
where I live. The UK had 58 deaths from guns in 2005/6, 25 from handguns in
a population of 60m.

Using this forum's normal measure of extrapolation based on population size
(usually done in respect of pilot certificates etc) we might expect the US
death rate to be about 5 times greater at about 290 deaths in the year.

But then with guns making everyone so safe perhaps that should reduce by
half the number of deaths to 185.

The US by contrast saw 29,569 people killed by gunfire in 2004, a staggering
81/day. (Source: Centre for Disease Control) (sic). Certainly a statistic to
be proud of?

With those odds perhaps everyone should be armed.

Go figure.