RTB

Returned home late last night from a trip to the Dayton airshow. One
seemingly minor incident raised my curiousity.

A two plane detachment of F-117s were sent to the show. As is quite
typical one aircraft departed intending to provide flybys at other
regional shows before returning to Dayton for a final flyby and landing.

Shortly after departing however he experienced a loss of one engine.
Aircraft recovered at Dayton. I wonder why he would RTB to a civilian
field when WRI-PAT is so near. With this aircraft considered to be a
high value asset wouldn't the increased security of a major military
airfield have made more sense?

So a question for all is what criteria would have been applied here?
Ed, being USAF do you have any comments. Should note here that
monitoring the frequencies there were no other systems failures mentioned.






ACC USN ret.
NKX, BIKF, NAB, CV-63, NIR
67-69 69-71 71-74 77-80 80-85
&
74-77

Founder: RAMN (rec.aviation.military.naval)

On Mon, 18 Jul 2005 08:00:59 -0400, Jim wrote:

Shortly after departing however he experienced a loss of one engine.
Aircraft recovered at Dayton. I wonder why he would RTB to a civilian
field when WRI-PAT is so near.

I'm betting he returned to the airfield that already had personnel trained
to generate and recover F-117s there.

--

-Jeff B. (who's only guessing)
zoomie at fastmail fm

On Mon, 18 Jul 2005 14:19:31 GMT, Yeff wrote:

On Mon, 18 Jul 2005 08:00:59 -0400, Jim wrote:

Shortly after departing however he experienced a loss of one engine.
Aircraft recovered at Dayton. I wonder why he would RTB to a civilian
field when WRI-PAT is so near.

I'm betting he returned to the airfield that already had personnel trained
to generate and recover F-117s there.

Sounds like the answer to me. Limited number special purpose aircraft
have some peculiar support requirements and might need some specially
trained support personnel.



Ed Rasimus
Fighter Pilot (USAF-Ret)
"When Thunder Rolled"
www.thunderchief.org
www.thundertales.blogspot.com

Ed Rasimus wrote:
On Mon, 18 Jul 2005 14:19:31 GMT, Yeff wrote:


On Mon, 18 Jul 2005 08:00:59 -0400, Jim wrote:


Shortly after departing however he experienced a loss of one engine.
Aircraft recovered at Dayton. I wonder why he would RTB to a civilian
field when WRI-PAT is so near.

I'm betting he returned to the airfield that already had personnel trained
to generate and recover F-117s there.


Sounds like the answer to me. Limited number special purpose aircraft
have some peculiar support requirements and might need some specially
trained support personnel.



Ed Rasimus
Fighter Pilot (USAF-Ret)
"When Thunder Rolled"
www.thunderchief.org
www.thundertales.blogspot.com

True but those people were but 10-20 miles away. Working at an AF
hangar with AF tools and support would seem to me the wiser option.
After all if an engine change out were required would that not be easier
all around at an AF facility compared to a borrowed civilian one?

Jim wrote:
Ed Rasimus wrote:

On Mon, 18 Jul 2005 14:19:31 GMT, Yeff wrote:


On Mon, 18 Jul 2005 08:00:59 -0400, Jim wrote:


Shortly after departing however he experienced a loss of one engine.
Aircraft recovered at Dayton. I wonder why he would RTB to a
civilian field when WRI-PAT is so near.


I'm betting he returned to the airfield that already had personnel
trained
to generate and recover F-117s there.



Sounds like the answer to me. Limited number special purpose aircraft
have some peculiar support requirements and might need some specially
trained support personnel.


Ed Rasimus
Fighter Pilot (USAF-Ret)
"When Thunder Rolled"
www.thunderchief.org
www.thundertales.blogspot.com


True but those people were but 10-20 miles away. Working at an AF
hangar with AF tools and support would seem to me the wiser option.
After all if an engine change out were required would that not be easier
all around at an AF facility compared to a borrowed civilian one?

I bet his field selection was at least partly based on whatever
caused the engine failure (oil related, fuel related, fod, other,
unknown?), what was in between him and each facility (ie, populated
areas), historical experience of F-117 engine failures, he was
already at Dayton anyway so he stuck with a workable "plan A,"
command climate (written directives and unwritten preferences of the
squadron CO and chain of command)... etc.

PIC decision making stuff - I know, pretty general answer (I'm not
trying to sound sarcastic).

Hey Jim,

I had so so time on Saturday. With the lack of flying and the weather, it
was medicore. I thought the Thunderbirds did ok, they were kinda sloppy on
few demos though.

I had a cool experince though. I shook a hand of a Tuskegee Airman. I also
thanked him for his service. I couldn't talk to him though, their tent was
full of people that wanted to talk to them.

It was cool though. Did the weather improved any on Sunday Jim?

Erik

On Mon, 18 Jul 2005 19:11:47 GMT, "Erik \"Falcon\" Glascoe"
wrote:

Hey Jim,

I had so so time on Saturday. With the lack of flying and the weather, it
was medicore. I thought the Thunderbirds did ok, they were kinda sloppy on
few demos though.

I had a cool experince though. I shook a hand of a Tuskegee Airman. I also
thanked him for his service. I couldn't talk to him though, their tent was
full of people that wanted to talk to them.

It was cool though. Did the weather improved any on Sunday Jim?

Erik


While I was serving on the Board of Trustees of the Pikes Peak Library
District, I often had occasion to meet Lt. Col (ret) Clarence Shivers,
one of the Tuskegee Airmen. He and his wife, Peggy were great
supporters of the library and quite successful in business as well.
They established a foundation to support the library and the arts in
the Colorado Springs area. Great folks who give back to their
community in a big way.


Ed Rasimus
Fighter Pilot (USAF-Ret)
"When Thunder Rolled"
www.thunderchief.org
www.thundertales.blogspot.com

I lived in Englewood Colorado for 3 years, loved it, hated the weather. I
heard the times over there now are difficult. Is that true? With the
housing and such.

Forgive me for a dumb question, but, are you a "Thud" Pilot?

Erik

"Erik "Falcon" Glascoe" wrote in message
. 63.158...
I lived in Englewood Colorado for 3 years, loved it, hated the weather. I
heard the times over there now are difficult. Is that true? With the
housing and such.

What was wrong with the weather?

Glenn D.

What was wrong with the weather?

Glenn D.



I moved there from Ohio in 86. Never experinced snow like in Colorado in
Ohio. After the blizzard I'll see sunny skies on the next day. Weather in
Colorado was weird for this Buckeye. Especially when I was going to high
school there, I was like "They want me to go thru that in my electric
wheelchair??" I still dunno how I went thru those winter storms without
being stuck. Guess I was lucky.

Erik