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IFR use of handheld GPS



 
 
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  #131  
Old May 7th 06, 11:08 PM posted to rec.aviation.ifr
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Default IFR use of handheld GPS

Authorization to conduct any GPS operation under IFR requires that:
a) GPS navigation equipment used must be FAA-approved and the installation
must be done in accordance with FAA requirements
i) Approval for the use of the GPS for IFR operations, and any
limitations, will be found in the airplane's POH (also called
the FAA-approved Airplane Flight Manual) and the airplane's
logbook
ii) VFR and hand-held GPS systems are not authorized for IFR
navigation, for instrument approaches, or as a principle
instrument flight references. During IFR operations, they
may be considered only an aid to situational awareness.



This seems fairly clear to me.....



Shh...don't let the facts get in the way of ones mindset.


A primary reason that handheld/VFR GPS units are not acceptable for
VFR use is that they not not include an integrity capability. That is
essential for IFR ops.

Ron Lee

  #132  
Old May 7th 06, 11:39 PM posted to rec.aviation.ifr
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Default IFR use of handheld GPS


Newps wrote:
Dane Spearing wrote:


Authorization to conduct any GPS operation under IFR requires that:
a) GPS navigation equipment used must be FAA-approved and the installation
must be done in accordance with FAA requirements
i) Approval for the use of the GPS for IFR operations, and any
limitations, will be found in the airplane's POH (also called
the FAA-approved Airplane Flight Manual) and the airplane's
logbook
ii) VFR and hand-held GPS systems are not authorized for IFR
navigation, for instrument approaches, or as a principle
instrument flight references. During IFR operations, they
may be considered only an aid to situational awareness.



This seems fairly clear to me.....



Shh...don't let the facts get in the way of ones mindset.


That's not fact. As far as I can tell, the advisory circular that the
"fact" supposedly came from was paraphrased by some written test
preparation materials. That is what you quoted. Not fact. See the
original message from Dane. Neither the AC nor POHs say anything about
handhelds.

  #133  
Old May 7th 06, 11:53 PM posted to rec.aviation.ifr
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Default IFR use of handheld GPS


Ron Lee wrote:

A primary reason that handheld/VFR GPS units are not acceptable for
VFR use is that they not not include an integrity capability. That is
essential for IFR ops.

Ron Lee


Sure, sounds good, but then if the FAA regulated by reason, NDB
approaches would have been made illegal long ago. I would bet many
more people have been injured and killed because of crappy ADFs and
just plain inaccurate old technology than by using a handheld GPS unit
while flying enroute. Even VORs don't have much for "integrity
monitoring," just that dumb little flag. I've seen many inaccurate VOR
readings and some outright failures without the flag showing red.

I've also seen handheld GPSs fail, too. But, in general, they are
probably more accurate and dependable than VOR and ADF.

Peter

  #134  
Old May 8th 06, 12:04 AM posted to rec.aviation.ifr
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Default IFR use of handheld GPS


"Ron Lee" wrote in message
...

A primary reason that handheld/VFR GPS units are not acceptable for
VFR use is that they not not include an integrity capability. That is
essential for IFR ops.


This is like a religion with you people. It's strictly a matter faith that
use of handheld GPS during IFR enroute flight in US controlled airspace is
illegal and/or unsafe.


  #135  
Old May 8th 06, 12:09 AM posted to rec.aviation.ifr
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Default IFR use of handheld GPS

In article . net,
"Steven P. McNicoll" wrote:

"Ron Lee" wrote in message
...

A primary reason that handheld/VFR GPS units are not acceptable for
VFR use is that they not not include an integrity capability. That is
essential for IFR ops.


This is like a religion with you people. It's strictly a matter faith that
use of handheld GPS during IFR enroute flight in US controlled airspace is
illegal and/or unsafe.


It depends on what you're using it for. A handheld GPS and a ham sandwich
are both useful objects, but using either one for the other's intended
purpose can be dangerous.
  #136  
Old May 8th 06, 12:22 AM posted to rec.aviation.ifr
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Default IFR use of handheld GPS


Roy Smith wrote:

It depends on what you're using it for. A handheld GPS and a ham sandwich
are both useful objects, but using either one for the other's intended
purpose can be dangerous.


Well, there are those stories of the open-cockpit airmail pilots using
cigars to time approaches. Don't know about ham sandwiches though. I
suppose if you're Steve Fossett, and your sandwich starts getting
moldy, you're about to run outa gas.

  #137  
Old May 8th 06, 12:31 AM posted to rec.aviation.ifr
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Default IFR use of handheld GPS

In article .com,
wrote:
That's not fact. As far as I can tell, the advisory circular that the
"fact" supposedly came from was paraphrased by some written test
preparation materials. That is what you quoted. Not fact. See the
original message from Dane. Neither the AC nor POHs say anything about
handhelds.


Section 1-1-19-d of the AIM addresses the general requirements
for conducting any GPS operations under IFR. Section 1-1-19-d1a
explicitly states (and I quote):

"Visual flight rules (VFR) and hand-held GPS systems are not authorized
for IFR navigation, instrument approaches, or as a principal instrument
flight reference."

It appears that the Gleim written test prep materials I cited in my previous
posting took much of their material from the AIM and not the AC. The AIM,
however, also does cite AC 20-138.

Again, this seems fairly clear to me.

-- Dane
  #138  
Old May 8th 06, 12:44 AM posted to rec.aviation.ifr
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Default IFR use of handheld GPS


"Dane Spearing" wrote in message
...

Section 1-1-19-d of the AIM addresses the general requirements
for conducting any GPS operations under IFR. Section 1-1-19-d1a
explicitly states (and I quote):

"Visual flight rules (VFR) and hand-held GPS systems are not authorized
for IFR navigation, instrument approaches, or as a principal instrument
flight reference."

It appears that the Gleim written test prep materials I cited in my
previous
posting took much of their material from the AIM and not the AC. The AIM,
however, also does cite AC 20-138.

Again, this seems fairly clear to me.


Faith is a mysterious thing.


  #139  
Old May 8th 06, 02:28 AM posted to rec.aviation.ifr
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Posts: n/a
Default IFR use of handheld GPS


"Roy Smith" wrote in message
...
In article . net,
"Steven P. McNicoll" wrote:

"Ron Lee" wrote in message
...

A primary reason that handheld/VFR GPS units are not acceptable for
VFR use is that they not not include an integrity capability. That is
essential for IFR ops.


This is like a religion with you people. It's strictly a matter faith
that
use of handheld GPS during IFR enroute flight in US controlled airspace
is
illegal and/or unsafe.


It depends on what you're using it for. A handheld GPS and a ham sandwich
are both useful objects, but using either one for the other's intended
purpose can be dangerous.


If not nutritious.



  #140  
Old May 8th 06, 02:33 AM posted to rec.aviation.ifr
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Posts: n/a
Default IFR use of handheld GPS


"Steven P. McNicoll" wrote in message
ink.net...

"Dane Spearing" wrote in message
...

Section 1-1-19-d of the AIM addresses the general requirements
for conducting any GPS operations under IFR. Section 1-1-19-d1a
explicitly states (and I quote):

"Visual flight rules (VFR) and hand-held GPS systems are not authorized
for IFR navigation, instrument approaches, or as a principal instrument
flight reference."

It appears that the Gleim written test prep materials I cited in my
previous
posting took much of their material from the AIM and not the AC. The
AIM,
however, also does cite AC 20-138.

Again, this seems fairly clear to me.


Faith is a mysterious thing.


Careful, Steven. If they determine that you are an infidel then they may
petition the Pope to excommunicate you.


 




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