Where can I train in a PW-6? Seminole Lake's is down for maintenancefor a couple of months

On Sat, 02 Sep 2017 07:01:38 -0600, BobW wrote:

BTW, what an irony that the PW-5 is getting so many nice reviews NOW,
after over 20 years. In the late 1990's the returning refrain on r.a.s.
was: "Does the PW-5 still suck?" Some of us remember it...

Heh (he chuckles, while contributing to thread drift)...temporary - if
years'-long-lasting - insanity? Short-sighted, too, when considered from
the group health aspect of the sport. Waiting with bated breath to see
how much of it's still around...

An entirely personal view, based on initial impressions:

I had my first flights in both a PW-5 and a Std Libelle on the same day
at the same club (not my home one).

Neither flight was really good for getting a rounded opinion of the
gliders because there was almost no lift, so both were sled rides after a
tow. I thought the PW-5 was nice handling, though I could relate to my
club's boss CFI's comment that it flew a bit like a paper bag. The
Libelle obviously had better performance but both seemed easy enough to
fly. I was in the market for my first glider at the time, so was flying
everything I could get into.

As a result of that day, the Libelle went onto my 'wants' list but the
PW-5 did not, though I was pleased to have flown it. Besides, the PW-5
isn't nearly as pretty as a Libelle.

On reflection and on looking at UK prices, the PW-5 was always a bit
expensive for what it was. It has very similar performance to a Ka-6e but
for a lot more cash, both then and now, and is not as rugged as an SZD
Junior, which has slightly performance. However, I think it is a good
enough glider to act as an alternative to a Junior or an ASK-23 in the
British/European club environment, where these, along with a G102, are
often used as a new pilot's initial single seater and will often be flown
by them up to silver C standard.

I think you'll find that the competition pilots were the PW-5's main
detractors and who can really blame them: stepping out of a contemporary
Standard Class toy to go racing in a much slower machine with a glide
ratio of 32 and no water would be a bit of a shock.


--
martin@ | Martin Gregorie
gregorie. | Essex, UK
org |

On Friday, September 1, 2017 at 5:56:36 AM UTC-5, wrote:
Hi, all.

I have a PW-5 that I bought but have never flown. Since the PW-6 is the 2-place trainer for the PW-5, I was hoping to train in a PW-6 for and hour or so before attempting the PW-5.

I just spoke with Seminole Lake Gliderport (here in Florida) who said that their PW-6 is down for maintenance for a couple of months.

Unfortunately SSA's search engine(as far as I know) doesn't have a search filter to find out which gliderports have a PW-6 available for training.

Does anyone know if there is one in (or near) Florida? or how can I find out where are all the PW-6's available for training in the US?

Ben

Hi Ben, Bob Wander here. Congrats on your PW5 - fun glider. I have a B-1 PW5 and have written up a few notes for pilot friends who have flown it. Send me a private email and I will be happy to send the notes along to you via email. My email address is in the Single Seat glider book that you (!) have already bought.
Safe soaring,
Bob Wander
-End

The PW5 flies nothing like the PW6... not even close.
Being checked out in the PW6 would not qualify you flying the PW5 .
Neither is too difficult but WAY DIFFERENT....

Interesting. I had read that the PW6 was designed to be the 2-place trainer for the PW5. Not so?

Why not just pack it up and head down to Vero Beach his weekend and fly with the Members here at Treasure Coast Soaring Club. We can give you all the help that you need and we are having a great cookout as well. My old friend, Scott Bingham, from The Thermal Research days will be joining us and I will even pay for your first tow. We will also be having a cookout complete with our thermal dogs, a gourmet hot dog with mustard and onions. Hope to see you there. Bob

Thanks for the kind offer, Bob, but (a) I don't have a car that will tow the trailer yet and (b) my fam is here this weekend.

On Sunday, September 3, 2017 at 4:55:47 AM UTC-7, wrote:
The PW5 flies nothing like the PW6... not even close.
Being checked out in the PW6 would not qualify you flying the PW5 .
Neither is too difficult but WAY DIFFERENT....

Interesting. I had read that the PW6 was designed to be the 2-place trainer for the PW5. Not so?
Not so...not even close in handling...Both are nice gliders, the PW6 handles closer to the ASK21 ( nothing like a G103 as it was also suggested prior) in terms of aileron/elevator response but has a heavy rather ineffective rudder- almost impossible to slip, other than that no bad habits ( terribly ineffective wheel brakes through ).
On the other hand the PW5 is a very snappy, quick to respond little glider.
Someone mentioned in this thread a comparison to the Standard Libelle, (I owned one of those too); yes it is closer maybe a little "twitchier" yet but overall a delight to fly.

On Friday, September 1, 2017 at 10:31:47 PM UTC+3, Tom BravoMike wrote:
BTW, what an irony that the PW-5 is getting so many nice reviews NOW, after over 20 years. In the late 1990's the returning refrain on r.a.s. was: "Does the PW-5 still suck?" Some of us remember it...

Let the record show that I've been one of the few people saying nice things about the PW5 in this forum, right from when my club got two of them in the mid 90s.

The PW5 has always been an excellent glass replacement for the much loved (of old) K6. Easy to fly, and plenty good enough to do a 300+ km flight in on a nice day.

People have generally run down the PW5 on one of two grounds:

1) it's allegedly ugly. Definitely it looks a little different to most modern gliders. That's one advantage of the AC4 Russia -- it looks "normal".

2) why buy a 32:1 new glider for the same price you can buy a 30 year old 40+:1 glider? A fair enough question in a declining sport/market. If the sport was growing (as the World Class project hoped to achieve) then the supply of 30 year old gliders would be insufficient.

For a number of years I was one of the few in our club who was happy to fly both the PW5 and the Janus, depending on what the aim of the flight was. Vastly different performance, and vastly different ease of landing in a paddock. Also vastly different ease of flying, with the PW5 being one of the easiest, while many who tried it and embarrassed themselves described the Janus handling as evil (especially the PIOs after takeoff, but control harmony and slow in general).

World Class was a far better idea than the stupidity that is the 13.5m
class
- now turning into another class for the 'rich boys'.

On Mon, 04 Sep 2017 18:50:03 +0000, Paul T
wrote:

World Class was a far better idea than the stupidity that is the 13.5m
class

.... and it failed completely, as predicted by many.
Obviously one of the worst ideas ever in gliding history.

- now turning into another class for the 'rich boys'.
.... but with many nice features (affordable self-launch, godd
performance). People in my club are talking about buying 13.5m class
gliders.

*checks pockets & bank account*

Nope

At 21:09 06 September 2017, Andreas Maurer wrote:
On Mon, 04 Sep 2017 18:50:03 +0000, Paul T
wrote:

World Class was a far better idea than the stupidity that is the 13.5m
class

.... and it failed completely, as predicted by many.
Obviously one of the worst ideas ever in gliding history.

- now turning into another class for the 'rich boys'.
.... but with many nice features (affordable self-launch, godd
performance). People in my club are talking about buying 13.5m class
gliders.




REALLY???? and what are the numbers in 13.5m class? - lower than any
World Class event? The idea to have a relatively affordable ship that could

be used as a first solo ship in clubs, then to compete with on a level
playing
field at an international level was a far better idea than another racing
class
for the rich boys. Trouble is this sport at national and intentional level
is
dominated by spoilt rich boys who turn up their noses at anything less than

40:1.