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Flying with Parachutes



 
 
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  #71  
Old August 16th 18, 12:45 AM posted to rec.aviation.soaring
Charlie Quebec
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Posts: 253
Default Flying with Parachutes

Liberty eh? Like free speech zones? Like Guantanamo bay? Like children in cages?
I have to say I’m all for Americans taking risks though, raises the worlds average IQ.
  #72  
Old August 31st 18, 01:00 AM posted to rec.aviation.soaring
[email protected]
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Posts: 22
Default Flying with Parachutes

On Friday, August 10, 2018 at 8:22:54 PM UTC-4, John Huthmaker wrote:
I'm just starting out with soaring. Simple question for you guys. How many of you fly with an emergency parachute? It looks like they cost around $2000 online. Pretty steep price; although the cost is insignificant if it saves your life. Is this something I should be looking to purchase?


I own my own glider and parachute and usually fly with the chute. I am also a licensed jumpmaster (or was) with a few hundred jumps, so I'm pretty comfortable jumping out of planes. I feel WAY safer wearing the chute (in gliders and planes), and I've had no comfort issues with it. I may not survive the accident (canopy jams, too low to bail out, etc.) but at least I'll have something to keep my mind occupied while I'm going down and won't feel totally helpless to save myself.

Be aware that I've had two riggers now tell me that they will not repack any rig that is more than 20 years old. There is a new legal(?) standard going around on that. A rigger showed me the printout of it, but I forgot what legal body is endorsing it. It's not official yet, but riggers are worried about being sued because of it.

A new square canopy and container is going to cost me $3-5k apparently. Ugh! Gotta pay to play.

  #73  
Old August 31st 18, 03:32 AM posted to rec.aviation.soaring
[email protected]
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Posts: 478
Default Flying with Parachutes

There are riggers packing 20+ year old parachutes. Shipping is cheap compared to a new parachute. Of course if you can afford going square it is smart.
  #74  
Old August 31st 18, 03:58 AM posted to rec.aviation.soaring
JS[_5_]
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Posts: 624
Default Flying with Parachutes

On Thursday, August 30, 2018 at 7:32:15 PM UTC-7, wrote:
There are riggers packing 20+ year old parachutes. Shipping is cheap compared to a new parachute. Of course if you can afford going square it is smart.


Yet to see the 20-year rule on paper, other than something like "paraphernalia won't pack our own chutes beyond 20 years" which is their option but not a rule.

A friend just donated two 20-year-old chutes to our pilot mentoring group. I saw them opened, and the containers, harnesses and chutes looked well taken care of. Picked them up from inspection and repack a couple of days later.
This was a great donation, since the pilots learning XC do not have parachutes and the mentors fly XC with their own.
Jim
  #75  
Old August 31st 18, 04:18 PM posted to rec.aviation.soaring
Dan Marotta
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Posts: 4,601
Default Flying with Parachutes

I got my square with container and bag for about $2,700.Â* If interested,
talk with Rigging Innovations (I'm not connected in any way).Â* I'm
extremely happy with my choice and did seven jumps to be comfortable
with the type.

On 8/30/2018 6:00 PM, wrote:
On Friday, August 10, 2018 at 8:22:54 PM UTC-4, John Huthmaker wrote:
I'm just starting out with soaring. Simple question for you guys. How many of you fly with an emergency parachute? It looks like they cost around $2000 online. Pretty steep price; although the cost is insignificant if it saves your life. Is this something I should be looking to purchase?

I own my own glider and parachute and usually fly with the chute. I am also a licensed jumpmaster (or was) with a few hundred jumps, so I'm pretty comfortable jumping out of planes. I feel WAY safer wearing the chute (in gliders and planes), and I've had no comfort issues with it. I may not survive the accident (canopy jams, too low to bail out, etc.) but at least I'll have something to keep my mind occupied while I'm going down and won't feel totally helpless to save myself.

Be aware that I've had two riggers now tell me that they will not repack any rig that is more than 20 years old. There is a new legal(?) standard going around on that. A rigger showed me the printout of it, but I forgot what legal body is endorsing it. It's not official yet, but riggers are worried about being sued because of it.

A new square canopy and container is going to cost me $3-5k apparently. Ugh! Gotta pay to play.


--
Dan, 5J
  #76  
Old August 31st 18, 04:22 PM posted to rec.aviation.soaring
Dan Marotta
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Posts: 4,601
Default Flying with Parachutes

I believe the FAA rule is that there's no life limit on a parachute
unless it is unairworthy (by inspection) or the manufacturer specifies a
life limit at certification.Â* If your rigger won't inspect/pack your
chute due to age, find another rigger.Â* My previous round parachute was
42 years old when I removed it from service and bought a square rig.

On 8/30/2018 8:58 PM, JS wrote:
On Thursday, August 30, 2018 at 7:32:15 PM UTC-7, wrote:
There are riggers packing 20+ year old parachutes. Shipping is cheap compared to a new parachute. Of course if you can afford going square it is smart.

Yet to see the 20-year rule on paper, other than something like "paraphernalia won't pack our own chutes beyond 20 years" which is their option but not a rule.

A friend just donated two 20-year-old chutes to our pilot mentoring group. I saw them opened, and the containers, harnesses and chutes looked well taken care of. Picked them up from inspection and repack a couple of days later.
This was a great donation, since the pilots learning XC do not have parachutes and the mentors fly XC with their own.
Jim


--
Dan, 5J
  #77  
Old August 31st 18, 08:29 PM posted to rec.aviation.soaring
[email protected]
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Posts: 22
Default Flying with Parachutes

On Friday, August 31, 2018 at 11:22:54 AM UTC-4, Dan Marotta wrote:
I believe the FAA rule is that there's no life limit on a parachute
unless it is unairworthy (by inspection) or the manufacturer specifies a
life limit at certification.Â* If your rigger won't inspect/pack your
chute due to age, find another rigger.Â* My previous round parachute was
42 years old when I removed it from service and bought a square rig.

On 8/30/2018 8:58 PM, JS wrote:
On Thursday, August 30, 2018 at 7:32:15 PM UTC-7, wrote:
There are riggers packing 20+ year old parachutes. Shipping is cheap compared to a new parachute. Of course if you can afford going square it is smart.

Yet to see the 20-year rule on paper, other than something like "paraphernalia won't pack our own chutes beyond 20 years" which is their option but not a rule.

A friend just donated two 20-year-old chutes to our pilot mentoring group. I saw them opened, and the containers, harnesses and chutes looked well taken care of. Picked them up from inspection and repack a couple of days later.
This was a great donation, since the pilots learning XC do not have parachutes and the mentors fly XC with their own.
Jim


--
Dan, 5J


Thanks, Dan. Philosophically I agree with you, as I have jumped many old but airworthy rigs over the years.

All: I'm wondering if this is just a way for the parachute manufacturers to extract more money from us. I finally found the letter given to me by the skydiving center here in Miami. It is just an OPINION from National Parachute Industries, but it has enough weight to it that it has scared both my Miami rigger and my Pennsylvania rigger into refusing to repack it...so I need the name of a good rigger who will, if you know one.

  #78  
Old August 31st 18, 08:47 PM posted to rec.aviation.soaring
[email protected]
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Posts: 478
Default Flying with Parachutes

On Friday, August 31, 2018 at 3:29:34 PM UTC-4, wrote:
On Friday, August 31, 2018 at 11:22:54 AM UTC-4, Dan Marotta wrote:
I believe the FAA rule is that there's no life limit on a parachute
unless it is unairworthy (by inspection) or the manufacturer specifies a
life limit at certification.Â* If your rigger won't inspect/pack your
chute due to age, find another rigger.Â* My previous round parachute was
42 years old when I removed it from service and bought a square rig.

On 8/30/2018 8:58 PM, JS wrote:
On Thursday, August 30, 2018 at 7:32:15 PM UTC-7, wrote:
There are riggers packing 20+ year old parachutes. Shipping is cheap compared to a new parachute. Of course if you can afford going square it is smart.
Yet to see the 20-year rule on paper, other than something like "paraphernalia won't pack our own chutes beyond 20 years" which is their option but not a rule.

A friend just donated two 20-year-old chutes to our pilot mentoring group. I saw them opened, and the containers, harnesses and chutes looked well taken care of. Picked them up from inspection and repack a couple of days later.
This was a great donation, since the pilots learning XC do not have parachutes and the mentors fly XC with their own.
Jim


--
Dan, 5J


Thanks, Dan. Philosophically I agree with you, as I have jumped many old but airworthy rigs over the years.

All: I'm wondering if this is just a way for the parachute manufacturers to extract more money from us. I finally found the letter given to me by the skydiving center here in Miami. It is just an OPINION from National Parachute Industries, but it has enough weight to it that it has scared both my Miami rigger and my Pennsylvania rigger into refusing to repack it...so I need the name of a good rigger who will, if you know one.


Contact Don for a repack http://parachuteshop.com/
And this why he deserves support
http://parachuteshop.com/service_life_limits.htm
  #79  
Old August 31st 18, 08:53 PM posted to rec.aviation.soaring
John Huthmaker
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Posts: 24
Default Flying with Parachutes

On Friday, August 31, 2018 at 12:29:34 PM UTC-7, wrote:
On Friday, August 31, 2018 at 11:22:54 AM UTC-4, Dan Marotta wrote:
I believe the FAA rule is that there's no life limit on a parachute
unless it is unairworthy (by inspection) or the manufacturer specifies a
life limit at certification.Â* If your rigger won't inspect/pack your
chute due to age, find another rigger.Â* My previous round parachute was
42 years old when I removed it from service and bought a square rig.

On 8/30/2018 8:58 PM, JS wrote:
On Thursday, August 30, 2018 at 7:32:15 PM UTC-7, wrote:
There are riggers packing 20+ year old parachutes. Shipping is cheap compared to a new parachute. Of course if you can afford going square it is smart.
Yet to see the 20-year rule on paper, other than something like "paraphernalia won't pack our own chutes beyond 20 years" which is their option but not a rule.

A friend just donated two 20-year-old chutes to our pilot mentoring group. I saw them opened, and the containers, harnesses and chutes looked well taken care of. Picked them up from inspection and repack a couple of days later.
This was a great donation, since the pilots learning XC do not have parachutes and the mentors fly XC with their own.
Jim


--
Dan, 5J


Thanks, Dan. Philosophically I agree with you, as I have jumped many old but airworthy rigs over the years.

All: I'm wondering if this is just a way for the parachute manufacturers to extract more money from us. I finally found the letter given to me by the skydiving center here in Miami. It is just an OPINION from National Parachute Industries, but it has enough weight to it that it has scared both my Miami rigger and my Pennsylvania rigger into refusing to repack it...so I need the name of a good rigger who will, if you know one.


I'm speaking from a non expert side, but have spoken to a rigger who is going to help me find a parachute, and has provided the insight to this exact question.

As you mentioned, the 20 year lifecycle is a guideline brought to you by the manufacturers of the parachutes. It is most definitely a way of keeping a sustainable income coming in. As such the FAA doesnt view this as any sort of requirement.

On the other hand, in the European Union, they do consider the 20 year cycle as law. And if you combine those two scenarios together, it turns out there is a very good second hand market in the US for previously European owned parachutes. I'm anticipating spending ~$500-$600 for a basically never used parachute. Sure it may be 15+ years old. But as long as it inspects as mint condition, it'll be just as good as anything that is considered brand new.

You are also correct that some riggers wont pack them for whatever reason. In that case you just have to find a rigger who will. I've already worked that out, so I dont think this is going to be a problem for me.

I'm hoping to find a softie with a square parachute. Ideally one that has the cushion you can sit on.
  #80  
Old August 31st 18, 09:18 PM posted to rec.aviation.soaring
John Foster
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Posts: 354
Default Flying with Parachutes

Is there any general consensus of which brand of parachute is better than others, or are they all about the same? Any thoughts regarding the MARS ATL-15 parachutes offered through wingsandwheels.com? They seem a little more affordable for a new chute.
 




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