Ethanol Powered Aircraft

And the reason why I don't think anything really ever *will*
be done (until possibly a catastrophe occurs of course) is
because we are a nation of factions with little cohesion. Our
leaders are a bunch of old farts, out of touch with reality,
obsessed with politcal correctness and willing to sell their
souls to get re-elected.

No, the reason why nothing will be done is that those who could do
something about any given problem actually benefit by the existence of
that problem. They benefit by actions that prolong the problem while
offering noises about a solution.

As for nuclear power, I am more concerned about the results of
ineptitude. Make a mistake with coal and it's unfortunate. Make a
mistake with uranium and it's tragic. And ineptitude can include both
technical, design, security, and logic.

Jose
--
The monkey turns the crank and thinks he's making the music.
for Email, make the obvious change in the address.

Jose wrote:
No, the reason why nothing will be done is that those who could do
something about any given problem actually benefit by the existence of
that problem. They benefit by actions that prolong the problem while
offering noises about a solution.

Well that's true also, but that doesn;t make my assertions any less true.

On Wed, 23 Aug 2006 09:47:12 -0700, "RST Engineering"
wrote:


Boy, but you sure did hit on a bunch of my pet peeves Jim:-))
Remember I quit work at age 47 and went back to college full time to
earn a degree in CS (minors in math and art)

(PLEASE don't take this as a political rant. A scientific or engineering
rant perhaps.)

I guess I'd have to say mine is aimed at the average individual on the
street.


Roger ...

What we need is a national leader with the balls of a Kennedy who said in
1961 that "we will send man to the moon by the end of this decade (the easy
part) and bring him back to earth safely (the hard part).

While that wasn't something that really HELPED the economy, or that gave us

I do think in the long run it did make a substantial boost for the
economy from the technological gains alone, let alone the "spin offs".

immediate technical gains (teflon and Tang notwithstanding), we did it for
the same reason that Isabella hocked the crown jewels and gave Columbus his
marching orders. It was something that had never been done before ... man's
insatiable desire to know what is over the far hill.

A generation of us who were drifting rudderless all of a sudden had a

While we now have several generations in that boat. When I was taking
a college Anthropology class (Sociology) the Prof remarked about an
article she had read that stated people were no where nearly as
success oriented as those of several generations prior. She wanted to
know if any of us agreed with that. Only two of us did. Of course I
was probably older than the prof so she asked me why I thought that
today's (It was 1989) people were not as success oriented at those of
earlier generations.

I said that the average individual's idea of success oriented was
getting a degree, or just a good job, working 8 hours, go home, prop
their feet up in front of the TV and have a beer while watching "the
game". The whole back row stood up and complained. (they were mostly
our sports players). They had absolutely no idea as to what success
oriented meant. They had confused it with successfully reaching their
goal. I told the prof, "I rest my case". She had a bit of a problem
keeping a straight face, but then proceeded to explain to the rest of
the class the definition of "success oriented".

pointer. Tens of thousands of us who weren't sure what we would be doing
that August started poring over college catalogs to see what sort of a major
program would put us on-line with our new national goal. Somehow I finagled
a triple major in electronic physics, math, and aerospace studies, which
coupled with my ham ticket and college airline job fixing radars and other
microwave gear put me right down the localizer to have a teeny tiny part in
the Apollo landing radar.

Today the trend is to avoid the sciences as well as the technical.
Then people complain AND blame the schools when their kids who aren't
suited for advanced education aren't prepared to step out into a good
paying job. They come out unable to continue into college but with no
technical background and the parents blame the system instead of
taking responsibility for where their kids are headed.

Unpaid overtime wasn't an option, it was expected. We had a deadline. We
beat Kennedy's challenge by five months.

I was still paid overtime back then.


And now are you all telling me that if we had somebody that said that if we
don't solve our energy problem that we are all going to be sitting around
our campfires in the dark in a hundred years that we couldn't solve that
problem?

No, but :-)) First we have to convince both the public and
government leaders there is a problem that can't be ignored for a few
more generations. Problems of a size that Band-Aid will not cure.
Both are still in denial and are just blaming the big corporations or
believing in junk science.


Are you telling me that a generation of the finest and cleverest amongst our
young couldn't pick up the traces that we dropped almost forty years ago and
pull that wagon across the finish line ahead of schedule?

Two problems: We have to convince enough of them who are not already
believers to get busy and we need to prevent the older generations
from holding them back. Encouragement would be nice, but not holding
them back would be a big step.


Are you telling me that if we took all the trillion$ we are ****ing down one
rathole after another and turned it to making the magnetic Klein bottle to
hold the fusion energy genie that we couldn't do it on time and within
budget?

Now there's one of the main kickers. The owners of all those "rat
holes" through which the money is sliding are going to fight to get
bigger "rat holes" rather than spend the money on something to which
they have no connection even if it is far more useful, or even
essential.

The fusion energy genie is a slippery little bugger isn't it? To me
it seems like a big computer, a bit of chaos theory, and some super
conductors should be able to do it. Certainly that is an over
simplification but I think it conveys the general idea. It would seem
that some one could figure out how to contain that very slippery
critter that is developing its own magnetic field inside another
magnetic field. Of course that's like trying to push like poles on
two very strong magnets together that are moving and changing strength
continually.


I think not. It takes a single charismatic leader with a vision and a
purpose. I hope (s)he appears before we are too far behind the power curve
to recover.


Knowledgeable, honest, and charismatic leaders are as rare as the
proverbial "hens teeth" and appear to be in short supply be they
Liberal or Conservative.

People would prefer to have "faith" in some one watching over them so
they don't have to be responsible. We have built up a tremendous
inertia where the general population relies on support in one form or
another. Getting them to step in and take responsibility is a big leap
and the chasm is getting wider every day.

We are looking at the requirements for a multi tiered program
consisting of alternative energy sources, advancements in technology,
education and acceptance of reality that we really do have a problem,
and conservation at the individual level.

It's a bit sobering to see that conservation at the individual level
could make the US independent of foreign oil, yet the average
individual blames big industry for high prices and polluting the
atmosphere. OTOH those individuals are calling for more oil
refineries instead of using less.


Jim



Now all we need to do is develop a fusion reactor that works well and
develops useful power, something that has been eluding us for many
decades..

73

Roger Halstead (K8RI & ARRL life member)
(N833R, S# CD-2 Worlds oldest Debonair)
www.rogerhalstead.com

It's a bit sobering to see that conservation at the individual level
could make the US independent of foreign oil, yet the average
individual blames big industry for high prices and polluting the
atmosphere. OTOH those individuals are calling for more oil
refineries instead of using less.


And driving their letters to the editor complaining about it to the local
newspaper in their SUVs.

Jim

I said that the average individual's idea of success oriented was
[...]
She had a bit of a problem
keeping a straight face, but then proceeded to explain to the rest of
the class the definition of "success oriented".

Seems the question is being begged here. You can define "success
oriented" and then discuss whether people fit or don't fit it, or you
can state that people fit it, and discuss what "success oriented" means
to different folks.

But to do both at the same time is oiling an eel.

Today the trend is to avoid the sciences as well as the technical.

.... and embrace superstition.

The fusion energy genie is a slippery little bugger isn't it?

The solution is itself a bigger problem, IMHO. Suppose we could contain
the genie. We'd also know how not to contain it. We'd know how to not
contain it on command. This technology would be all over the place, and
ten years later, when all the glamor is gone, would be run like NASA in
the early "The Space Shuttle is just a truck" days, or worse, like the
present day bus sytem.

Another big difference between the moon shot and energy sources is that
with the moon shot, we DID something, we GOT something, we could point
to it and say "I had a part in that". With the energy thing, all we'd
get back is what we already have... just cheaper and without ruining
stuff nobody seems to care about anyway. That's a hard sell.

Jose
--
The monkey turns the crank and thinks he's making the music.
for Email, make the obvious change in the address.

On Thu, 24 Aug 2006 19:45:04 -0700, "RST Engineering"
wrote:


It's a bit sobering to see that conservation at the individual level
could make the US independent of foreign oil, yet the average
individual blames big industry for high prices and polluting the
atmosphere. OTOH those individuals are calling for more oil
refineries instead of using less.


And driving their letters to the editor complaining about it to the local
newspaper in their SUVs.

Hummers!



Jim

Roger Halstead (K8RI & ARRL life member)
(N833R, S# CD-2 Worlds oldest Debonair)
www.rogerhalstead.com

On Thu, 24 Aug 2006 19:45:04 -0700, "RST Engineering"
wrote:


It's a bit sobering to see that conservation at the individual level
could make the US independent of foreign oil, yet the average
individual blames big industry for high prices and polluting the
atmosphere. OTOH those individuals are calling for more oil
refineries instead of using less.


And driving their letters to the editor complaining about it to the local
newspaper in their SUVs.

One Irate gal answered one of my letters to the editor by saying she
couldn't cut back on her driving any more as she'd done all she could
do what with all the activities in which the kids had to participate.
She was making about 5 round trips a day.

BTW I send my letters to the editor via e-mail. With my Internet bill
I'm not sure it's cheaper but it does save energy.:-))

73


Jim

Roger Halstead (K8RI & ARRL life member)
(N833R, S# CD-2 Worlds oldest Debonair)
www.rogerhalstead.com

On Thu, 24 Aug 2006 22:28:24 -0400, "Roger (K8RI)"
wrote in
:

It's a bit sobering to see that conservation at the individual level
could make the US independent of foreign oil, yet the average
individual blames big industry for high prices and polluting the
atmosphere. OTOH those individuals are calling for more oil
refineries instead of using less.



"We need an energy policy that encourages consumption"
-- George W. Bush.


"Conservation may be a sign of personal virtue, but it is not a
sufficient basis for a sound, comprehensive energy policy."
-- Vice President Dick Cheney

In article ,
Larry Dighera wrote:

"Conservation may be a sign of personal virtue, but it is not a
sufficient basis for a sound, comprehensive energy policy."

note the word "sufficient"

--
Bob Noel
Looking for a sig the
lawyers will hate

On Fri, 25 Aug 2006 02:49:15 -0400, Roger
wrote:
Hummers!

Yeah, but they are the H2s, so they're not *real* Hummers, just
posers...