FLARM and Triathlon

Come on, T8, we can do anything with technology. The platform is already in place. All we need is a new analytical application. Technology is our friend. Embrace it, don't fight it.

BB, where are you?

Chip Bearden
ASW 24 "JB"
U.S.A.

At 17:44 24 December 2015, Tango Eight wrote:
On Wednesday, December 23, 2015 at 7:03:18 PM UTC-5,

wrote:

Yeah, more rules complexities.

There's no conceivable cure here that isn't at least 87 times worse
than
the "disease".

Evan Ludeman / T8

I posted a solution earlier. Much simpler would be a motor rally type
start. After the first day the grid is formed with the fastest the
previous day on the front. Each competitor has an earliest start time,
tied to the start of launching with penalties for starting early. Those
who do not like being leeched get away on time. Assuming 1 hour to
launch the field the gaps between starts would equal 60/n minutes
where n is the number of competitors.

You guys all seem to consider diversion to a thermal that someone else is in or has been in to be evidence of leaching. In the conditions in which I fly it is more likely to be a matter of looking at the same clouds. We often meet up for that reason or because we are following similar tactics.

Leeching: following closely behind another [presumably better] pilot, allowing him/her to make all the decisions about course line and when to stop for/leave thermals, seldom trailing more than 1/4 mile behind the leader or deviating more than 100' in relative altitude. Includes hanging on just above the leader in a thermal waiting for him/her to lead out first. When leeching in the start cylinder, this includes the decision on when and how to start.

Using thermals found by other pilots isn't necessarily leeching. We cheerfully do it all the time. The difference is that those other gliders we use provide information for our own decision-making processes, as described in Jim White's 9 examples in another thread (if you're reading this, you've either read all those other threads or else you're a befuddled triathlete who Googled this post by mistake--click the "Back" button).

I think open FLARM does change the nature of our sport because it provides more information about what's happening farther out than we can see. And, yes, I have concerns about that. On the other hand, I agree with 9B that using that remote information to improve performance is more difficult the farther out it is.

So it's quite possible that much of this protracted debate has been over a term--leeching--about which there is no considerable definition. If so, I offer the above.

I don't like leeching. The problem is that although many pilots share this view, leeching is not illegal. So let's make it so and find a way to enforce it. Then we can put the whole FLARM stealth debate to bed!

Merry Christmas.

Chip Bearden
ASW 24 "JB"
U

Correcting an auto-correct typo:

"So it's quite possible that much of this protracted debate has been over a term--leeching--about which there is no COMMON definition."

Chip Bearden
ASW 24 "JB"
U.S.A.

So let me get this straight? People now want to race to turnpoints, but not race, go anywhere they want, whenever they want, and break up the peloton (gaggle). Not a race, but a race, but not really, sorta? Oh and start anytime you want, or just wait in the start cylinder all afternoon playing dodge em cars? This is all very confusing. It always has and always will be to me. The solution (to what ever problem? we are trying to solve now) is more code in the scoring software to measure tiny details of pilot behavior and reward tiny bonuses or penalties. Oh, that and OLC tasks?

In 100 years are rule book is going to be 1500 pages long.

I honestly think the Chinese are spiking the US water system and "some of us" are beginning to show the early signs of going insane. ;-). Ugg. I'm glad we have wine opened. I think I'll have a glass. Cheers boys. This one is for you!

How about 50% real assigned RACING tasks (no extra distance for going one mile into the turnpoints and reforming the gaggle in the process, and ruining the entire concept of a simple, clean, real race)? ;-). No scoring software required, no formulas, just a stopwatch! Then 50% TATs!

Seriously, take a big step back and re-read the flow of this thread and the remember the RC wants to "simplify the rules..."

Thanks for the Xmas eve entertainment!

Lol!

Merry Christmas!
Happy Holidays!
And a festive FESTIVUS!

At 00:08 26 December 2015, Sean Fidler wrote:
So let me get this straight? People now want to race to
turnpoints, but
no=
t race, go anywhere they want, whenever they want, and break up
the
peloton=
(gaggle). Not a race, but a race, but not really, sorta? Oh and
start
an=
ytime you want, or just wait in the start cylinder all afternoon
playing
do=
dge em cars? This is all very confusing. It always has and
always will
be=
to me. The solution (to what ever problem? we are trying to solve
now)
is=
more code in the scoring software to measure tiny details of pilot
behavio=
r and reward tiny bonuses or penalties. Oh, that and OLC tasks?

In 100 years are rule book is going to be 1500 pages long.

I honestly think the Chinese are spiking the US water system and
"some of
u=
s" are beginning to show the early signs of going insane. ;-).
Ugg. I'm
g=
lad we have wine opened. I think I'll have a glass. Cheers boys.
This
on=
e is for you!

How about 50% real assigned RACING tasks (no extra distance for
going one
m=
ile into the turnpoints and reforming the gaggle in the process,
and
ruinin=
g the entire concept of a simple, clean, real race)? ;-). No
scoring
soft=
ware required, no formulas, just a stopwatch! Then 50% TATs!

Seriously, take a big step back and re-read the flow of this thread
and
the=
remember the RC wants to "simplify the rules..."

Thanks for the Xmas eve entertainment! =20

Lol!

Merry Christmas!
Happy Holidays!
And a festive FESTIVUS!

Sean

I have made suggestions of ways in which the perceived horror of
"leeching" can be avoided and I would be the first to admit they are
far from perfect. The point was to show alternatives to using the
current STEALTH mode on Flarm. I think everyone would have to
agree that STEALTH mode, as it is now is not an option, far too
dangerous and open to litigation if it all goes wrong.
The advance of technology has changed competitions over the years
and will continue to do so. The answer to those advances is not to
try and "uninvent" them but to accept them for what they are and
deal with them.
I am sure that in all forms of racing there are aspects that
competitors do not like, use of pacemakers in athletics and cycling
for example.
If you do not want change to tasks, then don't make them and
accept that "leeching" is now part of racing and make sure you are
better at it than the other guy.

If everyone has Flarm, then no body has an advantage over another by way of leaching. (Oops, my bad - I meant using other glides as "markers"). So get over it.

P9

OK, so I don't give a rats shiny about leeching. I do care that some of you guys are going to be even more heads down in the cockpit fixating on your gadgets. I see this at every contest. Looking down into the cockpits of guys who are clearly futzing about punching buttons rather than looking out.

I guess it will be entertaining at some level to watch the tactical arms race that is going to ensue fr

Who would have thought that a small box mounted in a glider could get us so close to understanding what a Horse Child Breakfast is.
Or is it Dog's Breakfast?
Jim