Why airplanes fly

On Feb 10, 8:14 am, Bertie the Bunyip wrote:


PKB

Bertie



I get it, you're being ironic. Oh, too cute.

Anyways, just a heads up, I made a few replies to the "Discovery
Flight today...unexpected results" thread that you missed. I know you
love replying to each of my posts, just helping you out man.

buttman wrote in news:b412d3a9-dad1-4045-a465-
:

On Feb 10, 8:14 am, Bertie the Bunyip wrote:


PKB

Bertie



I get it, you're being ironic. Oh, too cute.


Oh boy. an IKYABWAI poast.



Anyways, just a heads up, I made a few replies to the "Discovery
Flight today...unexpected results" thread that you missed. I know you
love replying to each of my posts, just helping you out man.

Oh thanks.

BTW, I'll be reffering back to this poast in about a week.


Bertie

In rec.aviation.student Bertie the Bunyip wrote:
Yes. I've trid it and the home sim feedback systems are a joke. Even
sophisticated sims aren't great this way and I still can't see even the
most sophisticated sims being anything more than an aid in teaching
procedures.

Seems like you ought to be able to get a fairly decent setup by using
bungees to center the stick and having some motors on the bungees. Move
them around to change the center if needed, tighten them to provide more
recentering force at high speed. Anyone know how the real force feedback
systems work and why my idea doesn't?

--
Michael Ash
Rogue Amoeba Software

writes:

Some company (not CH) makes joysticks and a flight yoke that don't use
potentiometers. They work better, apparently. Someone on the sim forum
could probably lead you to a controller that behaves well.

Saitek uses Hall-effect sensors for the two main axes of the joystick in some
models (X52 and X52 Pro), but not usually for the other axes. It makes a
difference.

In rec.aviation.student wrote:
My primary instructor for the PPL has an aerobatic endorsement (or
whatever the technical name is) on her CFI cert. She has been doing
aerobatics for many years. I had used MSFS before taking lessons from
her. On our first flight she acted surprised and wanted to know how
long I'd been flying. It was all straight and level but I understood
things like the how the VOR stuff worked, how to trim, use the radios,
and that the throttle was the up/down control (ie, throttle back to
descend), etc. I told her I'd learned all that in the simulator. Later
she came to my house for dinner once, and for fun she wanted to try
the simulator. She couldn't do it at all, or course, because the
control inputs are completely different as was how you view "the world
outside". So she stalled out trying to land and crashed, she couldn't
do a snap roll "correctly", and the loop was impossible. The whole
time she just laughed her a$$ off.

Nice story. I had a similar experience to yours. Not the part with the
instructor flying the sim, but showing up for lessons with a bunch of sim
flying done first. I was pretty young at the time and hadn't gone as far
with it as you had, and I was flying really primitive sims (anyone
remember Chuck Yeager's Advanced Flight Trainer?) but it had a similar
effect. I was good at simulator-type stuff, had no trouble reading the
instruments or holding altitude while staring at them, but it had really
conditioned me to keep my head down and I had a hard time developing the
habit of looking outside.

--
Michael Ash
Rogue Amoeba Software

Mxsmanic wrote in
:

writes:

Some company (not CH) makes joysticks and a flight yoke that don't
use potentiometers. They work better, apparently. Someone on the sim
forum could probably lead you to a controller that behaves well.

Saitek uses Hall-effect sensors for the two main axes of the joystick
in some models (X52 and X52 Pro), but not usually for the other axes.
It makes a difference.


Good for them. They're wonderful.

Bertie

Michael Ash wrote in news:1202662014.882537@nfs-
db1.segnet.com:

In rec.aviation.student Bertie the Bunyip wrote:
Yes. I've trid it and the home sim feedback systems are a joke. Even
sophisticated sims aren't great this way and I still can't see even the
most sophisticated sims being anything more than an aid in teaching
procedures.

Seems like you ought to be able to get a fairly decent setup by using
bungees to center the stick and having some motors on the bungees. Move
them around to change the center if needed, tighten them to provide more
recentering force at high speed. Anyone know how the real force feedback
systems work and why my idea doesn't?


WEll, tomorrow I'm going to be in a significantly more sophisticated system
than that for about four hours of sweat inducing BS and even they don;'t
feel right. At least with no feel you;re not getting the notion that you're
learning anything by feel.

Bertie

Jay Honeck wrote:


None of them. It was a metaphor, meant to illustrate precisely how bad
Bertie is for this group.

OK, I understood the metaphor, but I misread the statement of yours
quoted below. I thought the phrase, "Although that may well be true"
referred to Hitler and the Jews when in fact you were referring to
Bertie having something of value to contribute. My bad.

"However, saying that Bertie has anything of value to contribute here is
like saying that Hitler made some accurate observations about the Jews.
Although that may well be true, the rest of the source message is so
distasteful as to devalue everything else he might say."

romeomike wrote in news:f3s385-s3o1.ln1
@news.infowest.com:

Jay Honeck wrote:


None of them. It was a metaphor, meant to illustrate precisely how bad
Bertie is for this group.

OK, I understood the metaphor, but I misread the statement of yours
quoted below. I thought the phrase, "Although that may well be true"
referred to Hitler and the Jews when in fact you were referring to
Bertie having something of value to contribute. My bad.

"However, saying that Bertie has anything of value to contribute here is
like saying that Hitler made some accurate observations about the Jews.
Although that may well be true, the rest of the source message is so
distasteful as to devalue everything else he might say."


It's why he's one of my favorite chew toys.
Ones like Anthony are ok for a very quick snack. but a true hypocrite, now
there's a feast.




Bertie

WEll, tomorrow I'm going to be in a significantly more sophisticated system *
than that for about four hours of sweat inducing BS and even they don;'t
feel right. At least with no feel you;re not getting the notion that you're
learning anything by feel.

Bertie

What kind of hoops do they make you jump through on those things?

What are they trying to assess? Systems knowledge? Procedures? CRM?