class C and B comms on sectionals?

My stuff came from the 11/01/2001 Chicago Sectional so revisions are
possible.

But I would have to question your statement: "Milwaukee's varies with runway
usage. Sometimes it's along runway 7/25, sometimes it's along runway 1/19".

How often would a pilot know the active runway prior to calling Approach? I
just don't see anything other than a fixed point being used for this
purpose.

"Steven P. McNicoll" wrote in message
hlink.net...

"Bill Denton" wrote in message
...

The split for the Madison Class C is East and West.

The split for the Milwaukee Class C is Southeast and Northwest.


Milwaukee's split, like Madison's, is along the extended runway
centerline.
Madison's is fixed along runway 18/36, but Milwaukee's varies with runway
usage. Sometimes it's along runway 7/25, sometimes it's along runway
1/19.

"Bill Denton" wrote in message
...
[...]
But I would have to question your statement: "Milwaukee's varies with
runway
usage. Sometimes it's along runway 7/25, sometimes it's along runway
1/19".

How often would a pilot know the active runway prior to calling Approach?

Seattle has a similar situation. Before calling Approach, you listen to the
ATIS, because the sector divisions (some of them) depend on which direction
the traffic is flowing.

So the answer to your question is: listen to the ATIS. It's not like they
are keeping the active runway secret until you actually talk to them.
"Seattle Approach, Cessna 12345, 20 miles west, 2000', pssst what runway are
you guys using?"

Pete

Thanks for the info...


"Peter Duniho" wrote in message
...
"Bill Denton" wrote in message
...
[...]
But I would have to question your statement: "Milwaukee's varies with
runway
usage. Sometimes it's along runway 7/25, sometimes it's along runway
1/19".

How often would a pilot know the active runway prior to calling
Approach?

Seattle has a similar situation. Before calling Approach, you listen to
the
ATIS, because the sector divisions (some of them) depend on which
direction
the traffic is flowing.

So the answer to your question is: listen to the ATIS. It's not like they
are keeping the active runway secret until you actually talk to them.
"Seattle Approach, Cessna 12345, 20 miles west, 2000', pssst what runway
are
you guys using?"

Pete

"Peter Duniho" wrote in message
...

Someone else answered that. You don't need a VOR receiver to
be able to know where a VOR radial is, when flying VFR.


No navigation equipment is required for VFR entry of Class B or C airspace.
How does one know where a VOR radial is without using any navigation
equipment?

"Bill Denton" wrote in message
...

But I would have to question your statement: "Milwaukee's varies
with runway usage. Sometimes it's along runway 7/25, sometimes
it's along runway 1/19".


Well, that's the way it is. It's specified that way in the Letter of
Agreement between Milwaukee approach and Chicago Center. I'm familiar with
the letter because I was a controller at Chicago Center.



How often would a pilot know the active runway prior to
calling Approach?


A pilot would know the active runway upon listening to the ATIS. If he does
that before he calls approach then he knows the active runway prior to
calling approach.



I just don't see anything other than a fixed point being used for this
purpose.


Believe what you wish.

"Steven P. McNicoll" wrote in message
news
No navigation equipment is required for VFR entry of Class B or C
airspace.

So? What's that got to do with this thead?

How does one know where a VOR radial is without using any navigation
equipment?

Look at your chart. When you can see out the window, this is a much more
reliable way of identifying a VOR radial than using the actual radio (which
is permitted to have as much as 6 degrees of error anyway).

Pete

Thanks for the info!


"Steven P. McNicoll" wrote in message
. net...

"Bill Denton" wrote in message
...

But I would have to question your statement: "Milwaukee's varies
with runway usage. Sometimes it's along runway 7/25, sometimes
it's along runway 1/19".


Well, that's the way it is. It's specified that way in the Letter of
Agreement between Milwaukee approach and Chicago Center. I'm familiar
with
the letter because I was a controller at Chicago Center.



How often would a pilot know the active runway prior to
calling Approach?


A pilot would know the active runway upon listening to the ATIS. If he
does
that before he calls approach then he knows the active runway prior to
calling approach.



I just don't see anything other than a fixed point being used for this
purpose.


Believe what you wish.

"Peter Duniho" wrote in message
...

So? What's that got to do with this thead?


It was a response to the statement, "You don't need a VOR receiver to be
able to know where a VOR radial is, when flying VFR." You don't see the
connection?



Look at your chart. When you can see out the window, this is a
much more reliable way of identifying a VOR radial than using
the actual radio (which is permitted to have as much as 6 degrees
of error anyway).


Please explain how it's done.

I don't have an operational problem with using the chart and I know
that approach control won't go crazy if I somehow manage to use the
wrong frequency.

My issue is being told by a designated examiner something that a:
doesn't make sense and b: she can't back up with a source

It's not the radials that's the problem, it's the selected starting
point from where the bearings in the legend should extend. Claiming
that the bearings should extend from anything other than the primary
airport for the airspace seems crazy to me.

Apart from the fact that some airports don't have VORs, even if it
does, your not flying to a VOR, you're flying to the airport and the
airport and VOR don't necessarily have to be co-located so to me, the
reference point naturally should be the airport and not any nav-aid
that happens to be in the area.

But like I said, I'd like to find a proper source where I can read
about these charts.


On 2004-04-24 12:33:25 -0400, "Steven P. McNicoll"
said:


"Peter Duniho" wrote in message
...

Someone else answered that. You don't need a VOR receiver to
be able to know where a VOR radial is, when flying VFR.


No navigation equipment is required for VFR entry of Class B or C airspace.
How does one know where a VOR radial is without using any navigation
equipment?

"Magnus" wrote in message
...

I don't have an operational problem with using the chart and I know
that approach control won't go crazy if I somehow manage to use the
wrong frequency.

My issue is being told by a designated examiner something that a:
doesn't make sense and b: she can't back up with a source


Indicators that she's quite probably mistaken.