Boy Who Flew With Condors - Dick Johnson? Other Comments

Old thread but I'm enjoying the movie. I stood up after a 5:35 flight and was happy to walk away from the Pilatus. Was 54 at the time, but my wife and I were training for triathlons and in pretty good shape. Took 3 water bottles with me, poured the last over my head too.

Boy who flew with condors youtube:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OqHXiaMhSIo

On Wednesday, March 30, 2016 at 5:39:40 AM UTC-4, wrote:
Old thread but I'm enjoying the movie.

How little has changed in 50 years.

At 09:39 30 March 2016, wrote:
Old thread but I'm enjoying the movie. I stood up after a 5:35 flight
and
=
was happy to walk away from the Pilatus. Was 54 at the time, but
my wife
a=
nd I were training for triathlons and in pretty good shape. Took 3
water
b=
ottles with me, poured the last over my head too.

At 16:47 30 March 2016, Jonathan St. Cloud wrote:
Boy who flew with condors youtube:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OqHXiaMhSIo

More on "Boy Who Flew with the Condors." On Chris Jury, yes, as
mentioned, he flew and was the son of a TWA Captain. And yes,
sadly lost in a powered aircraft accident. Never met either, although
we were all circulating in the sport as youngsters about the same
time...I was East Coast, they West.
The movie was one of the reasons, as opinioned by Paul Schweizer,
that helped the late sixties surge in the sport. Other two were the
National Geographic article on the Reno 1966 Nationals, and Bob
Buck's articles in Air Facts Magazine/Reader's Digest.
On low saves, why couldn't you from 200 feet...if you really have to
try it? Hopefully you make a good call on what's smart...what's
not...for both the concept as well as how you, aircraft and weather
fit into the equation on that day, at that time. Chatted with a pilot at
the 1973 Liberal Nationals, the evening after he'd thermaled away
from 50 feet in an ASW-12. Yup...50 feet. Not off the wall, really, as
over a West Kansas section, not field, he ran into the lift on low final
and continued in a shallow bank knowing if it all quit he'd just level
out and land...stubble field. Well, finally coming around in a wide
360 he was 100 feet, and the process continued until thousands of
feet and on his way! Was flying the meet in our Libelle, and on
discussing it with him, remembering it a relatively calm day and it
actually all made sense! Simpler times, few gadgets, more stick
think. Do it today, wiser, older, and less sharp? Why?
On long cockpit sits in a 1-26, or any of those upright gliders of the
day, we didn't know any better, so did it. We were flying, man!
Marfa 1967, in a 1-23, averaged about 6+ hours a day for eight in
a row, with a couple pushing 8 hours. Of course I was 18, had a lot
of foam jammed between the chute and small of the back, but last
day was convinced I had a wound on my butt. Back still hurts
today...but wouldn't have traded the opportunity for the world!
Diamond C? We called them whatever. Three diamonds, diamond
badge, diamond C, etc. Figured when you earned it, you could call it
what you wished. Saw some who put diamonds on a Silver badge,
for the heck of it...could do it on a C badge if ya wanted...ya earned
it and the three diamonds told the story. Bronze C...back in '60's
didn't exist, so C Badge was same as today's Bronze C. Later, with
better gliders, stretched it out a bit. Unbelievable motivation when,
on landing in a 2-22 with C-Badge duration your instructor handed
you a C Badge, as Bernie Carris did to me in 1964 at Schweizers in
Elmira. Badges are still marvelous tools today, that if properly
presented and mentored, both compliments and encourages! RB-
Buck

On Wednesday, March 30, 2016 at 8:30:10 PM UTC-7, Robert Buck wrote:
At 16:47 30 March 2016, Jonathan St. Cloud wrote:
Boy who flew with condors youtube:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OqHXiaMhSIo

More on "Boy Who Flew with the Condors." On Chris Jury, yes, as
mentioned, he flew and was the son of a TWA Captain. And yes,
sadly lost in a powered aircraft accident. Never met either, although
we were all circulating in the sport as youngsters about the same
time...I was East Coast, they West.
The movie was one of the reasons, as opinioned by Paul Schweizer,
that helped the late sixties surge in the sport. Other two were the
National Geographic article on the Reno 1966 Nationals, and Bob
Buck's articles in Air Facts Magazine/Reader's Digest.
On low saves, why couldn't you from 200 feet...if you really have to
try it? Hopefully you make a good call on what's smart...what's
not...for both the concept as well as how you, aircraft and weather
fit into the equation on that day, at that time. Chatted with a pilot at
the 1973 Liberal Nationals, the evening after he'd thermaled away
from 50 feet in an ASW-12. Yup...50 feet. Not off the wall, really, as
over a West Kansas section, not field, he ran into the lift on low final
and continued in a shallow bank knowing if it all quit he'd just level
out and land...stubble field. Well, finally coming around in a wide
360 he was 100 feet, and the process continued until thousands of
feet and on his way! Was flying the meet in our Libelle, and on
discussing it with him, remembering it a relatively calm day and it
actually all made sense! Simpler times, few gadgets, more stick
think. Do it today, wiser, older, and less sharp? Why?
On long cockpit sits in a 1-26, or any of those upright gliders of the
day, we didn't know any better, so did it. We were flying, man!
Marfa 1967, in a 1-23, averaged about 6+ hours a day for eight in
a row, with a couple pushing 8 hours. Of course I was 18, had a lot
of foam jammed between the chute and small of the back, but last
day was convinced I had a wound on my butt. Back still hurts
today...but wouldn't have traded the opportunity for the world!
Diamond C? We called them whatever. Three diamonds, diamond
badge, diamond C, etc. Figured when you earned it, you could call it
what you wished. Saw some who put diamonds on a Silver badge,
for the heck of it...could do it on a C badge if ya wanted...ya earned
it and the three diamonds told the story. Bronze C...back in '60's
didn't exist, so C Badge was same as today's Bronze C. Later, with
better gliders, stretched it out a bit. Unbelievable motivation when,
on landing in a 2-22 with C-Badge duration your instructor handed
you a C Badge, as Bernie Carris did to me in 1964 at Schweizers in
Elmira. Badges are still marvelous tools today, that if properly
presented and mentored, both compliments and encourages! RB-
Buck

You would like my book Rob.

gary kemp

On low saves, why couldn't you from 200 feet...if you really have to
try it? Hopefully you make a good call on what's smart...what's
not...for both the concept as well as how you, aircraft and weather
fit into the equation on that day, at that time. Chatted with a pilot at
the 1973 Liberal Nationals, the evening after he'd thermaled away
from 50 feet in an ASW-12. Yup...50 feet. Not off the wall, really, as
over a West Kansas section, not field, he ran into the lift on low final
and continued in a shallow bank knowing if it all quit he'd just level
out and land...stubble field. Well, finally coming around in a wide
360 he was 100 feet, and the process continued until thousands of
feet and on his way! Was flying the meet in our Libelle, and on
discussing it with him, remembering it a relatively calm day and it
actually all made sense! Simpler times, few gadgets, more stick
think.

I was newly into the sport at the time of the 1973 Liberal Nationals (which
occurred roughly coincident with achieving my license), and did my best to
pick the brains of my officemate, who was that ASW-12 pilot, upon his return
from a portion of the country to which I'd not then been. That particular save
was one of his vignettes from the contest. Lacking then the experience and
knowledge to be able to put the tale into any sensible perspective, I enjoyed
it as best I could and more or less promptly (well, except for the "height
warnings" inherent to the telling of the tale) forgot about it until now! I,
too, seem to remember it was told without bravado, but more a sense of
amazement at the differences to be (occasionally) found between soaring in the
mountains of Maryland and the plains of western Kansas.

With the perspective of years and improved geographic knowledge/experience, I
can better appreciate the tale now. Thin margins are thin margins, and always
to be seriously respected by Joe Pilot, but I've never seen in them a need to
universally, rigidly, apply someone else's sense of "safe" to the pilot world
at large. My lowest save was from 650' agl (Texas, above a WW-II field) and
lowest pattern entry ~400 feet (Texas, huge, disked half-section), and the
former was much tougher due to the 20+ knot wind roiling things up, whereas
the nearly-sunset latter was pretty much a breeze-free, "close your eyes and
wait" sort of approach to a pre-ordained safe touchdown (so long as flying
speed was maintained). I also witnessed a save from ~400' agl from the
downwind-to-base turn (Texas, again), and except for the height agl, it was
pretty much as described by the ASW-12 pilot...not "obviously and
TV-dramatically" dodgy at all due to its being prudently performed...though
distinctly unusual to vicariously experience because of the - by then
well-understood - thin margin. My anxiety meter was glad I knew who that
(conservative, prudent) pilot was, having by then seen many dodgier patterns
at each of my hop-scotched home fields.

I've sometimes tried to imagine my reaction to "The Boy Who Flew With Condors"
had I seen it before becoming a participant in the sport!

Bob W.

There are many tails of Wally Scott thermaling away from a 200 foot auto tow.

On Thursday, March 31, 2016 at 7:08:57 AM UTC-7, BobW wrote:
On low saves, why couldn't you from 200 feet...if you really have to
try it? Hopefully you make a good call on what's smart...what's
not...for both the concept as well as how you, aircraft and weather
fit into the equation on that day, at that time. Chatted with a pilot at
the 1973 Liberal Nationals, the evening after he'd thermaled away
from 50 feet in an ASW-12. Yup...50 feet. Not off the wall, really, as
over a West Kansas section, not field, he ran into the lift on low final
and continued in a shallow bank knowing if it all quit he'd just level
out and land...stubble field. Well, finally coming around in a wide
360 he was 100 feet, and the process continued until thousands of
feet and on his way! Was flying the meet in our Libelle, and on
discussing it with him, remembering it a relatively calm day and it
actually all made sense! Simpler times, few gadgets, more stick
think.

I was newly into the sport at the time of the 1973 Liberal Nationals (which
occurred roughly coincident with achieving my license), and did my best to
pick the brains of my officemate, who was that ASW-12 pilot, upon his return
from a portion of the country to which I'd not then been. That particular save
was one of his vignettes from the contest. Lacking then the experience and
knowledge to be able to put the tale into any sensible perspective, I enjoyed
it as best I could and more or less promptly (well, except for the "height
warnings" inherent to the telling of the tale) forgot about it until now! I,
too, seem to remember it was told without bravado, but more a sense of
amazement at the differences to be (occasionally) found between soaring in the
mountains of Maryland and the plains of western Kansas.

With the perspective of years and improved geographic knowledge/experience, I
can better appreciate the tale now. Thin margins are thin margins, and always
to be seriously respected by Joe Pilot, but I've never seen in them a need to
universally, rigidly, apply someone else's sense of "safe" to the pilot world
at large. My lowest save was from 650' agl (Texas, above a WW-II field) and
lowest pattern entry ~400 feet (Texas, huge, disked half-section), and the
former was much tougher due to the 20+ knot wind roiling things up, whereas
the nearly-sunset latter was pretty much a breeze-free, "close your eyes and
wait" sort of approach to a pre-ordained safe touchdown (so long as flying
speed was maintained). I also witnessed a save from ~400' agl from the
downwind-to-base turn (Texas, again), and except for the height agl, it was
pretty much as described by the ASW-12 pilot...not "obviously and
TV-dramatically" dodgy at all due to its being prudently performed...though
distinctly unusual to vicariously experience because of the - by then
well-understood - thin margin. My anxiety meter was glad I knew who that
(conservative, prudent) pilot was, having by then seen many dodgier patterns
at each of my hop-scotched home fields.

I've sometimes tried to imagine my reaction to "The Boy Who Flew With Condors"
had I seen it before becoming a participant in the sport!

Bob W.

And of Dick Johnson wafting away from hanger top height, in a Skylark 4 I believe..

R Buck, thanks for the post. It also brought back many good old memories. That movie was one of the major influencers when I was a 14 year old kid learning in the 2-22. I felt I was in heaven the day I solo'd in the 1-26! 40 years later I ended up acquiring that self same 1-26 serial number 225 and am reworking all the badges.

As to low thermalling, I've made saves routinely from 200 ft. Its not the dangerous big deal that many make it out to be, and in the "old days" of flying low performance ships, its something of an essential skill needed if you intend to get anywhere xc. The issue is not "turns at low levels", its improper turns. I turn 8 to 14 hours a day, all day long at below 200 ft with an insainly high wing loading (2000 lbs of fertilizer) and I do it safely. Those that make arbitrary rules about thermalling are missing and stunting a natural progression of soaring education that should occur. Most that make these rules have never learned themselves.

Yes its a good starting place rule for new students. As a cfi-g I also discourage newby's and pilots with undeveloped airmanship from low saves. But at the same time we work and work and work on proper turning and recognizing "feeling" and knowing exactly what is happening in every portion of the turn, so when they find themselves in a "bind", they're not in a freak out sense of anxiety, they turn properly and either make a save or land out, neither of which is a big deal to the guy who is prepared.