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#21
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F-35, not F-22, to Protect U.S. Airspace
T.L. Davis wrote in
: [snip] The one all purpose carry on weapon still allowed is the big heavy cowboy belt buckle. Slip off the belt and raise hell. Sorry for the rant and the unrealistic scenario, but it just blows my mind that only slightly more than a dozen fighters were on station. Might as well phase out NORAD altogether except for missile defense and retaliation. Your Peace Dividend at work. If we'd managed to put the pieces we had together in time the hijacked flights would never have left the ground so what Continental AD posture was is kind of a secondary consideration. IBM |
#22
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F-35, not F-22, to Protect U.S. Airspace
Peter Skelton wrote in
: [snip] Could I humbly sugggest that you look into muslim populations before you spew your tripe? The US has a larger Muslim population than any European country but Russia. On a per cant basis it is near the European median. Oh really? And we have the same sort of exurban ghettos populated by pig ignorant hill tribesmen from gawd only knows where ( outside of Dearbornistan and al-Hamtramck of course ). Different demographic and despite your claims nowhere near the numbers. I dare say al-Qanada has, at some 600,000, or so a higher Mooselimb population (percentagewise) than does the US. IBM |
#23
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F-35, not F-22, to Protect U.S. Airspace
Jack Linthicum wrote in
: On Feb 2, 9:51*pm, Ian B MacLure wrote: 150flivver wrote in news:359a3711-b5ea-4741- : On Feb 2, 3:08*am, hcobb wrote: On Feb 2, 6:45 am, 150flivver wrote: Exactly how was the Air Force supposed to prevent 9/11? *I guess t he Air Force wasn't prepared to prevent the banking crisis or global warming either. Which service is it that's supposed to at least intercept hostile aircraft in American skies? Perhaps this also should be handed over to the USMC? -HJC 9/11 was a criminal act conducted by foreign criminals. *Calling it * * * * It was an act of war by a non-state actor. We quite prope rly * * * * took it at face value and opened hostilities on the actor s * * * * and their supporters. war doesn't make it so. *Law enforcement is something I don't want th e military involved in. *The FBI and CIA dropped the ball on this one, not the Air Force. *Shooting down airliners filled with hostages/ citizens is something the Soviet Union would do, not what the USA does. * * * * The FBI and CIA had been knecapped by Jamie Gorelick at K lintoon's * * * * behest. It was more than your career was worth to ask inc onvenient * * * * questions or, god forbid, share information. Many of the necessary * * * * dots were already plotted. They just could not legally be connected * * * * and it took an enormous effort against determined Dhimmic rap * * * * opposition to change that situation. * * * * IBM IIRC Clinton left office in January 2001, the FBI and CIA continued their feud that says "I won't tell you anything you can use", and FBI Funny you should mention that cause theres a PBS show on right now about what was known about the 9/11 and how the FBI who had agents assigned to the CIA unit tracking Bin Laden could not legally be told what the CIA knew. So far all the narrative takes place well prior to mid January 2001. telephone taps that should have been tied to that "Osama bin Ladin wants to do harm to the US" line in the PDB. As near as I can tell that division still exists, perhaps expanded by the NSA being able to say "I know something you don't". We now have an extra level of DNI to Up until about two eeks ago any FedGov agency practicing that sort of dog in the manger routine would ahve found themsleves assigned to sorting through jihadi trash heaps in Indian country. Now that Soetaro is calling the shots who knows? add to the various inter service and interagency versions of that same attitude. I would bet that more useful intelligence gets stuffed into burn bags than gets into the PDB. And yet the air over Pakistan is filed with the remains of recently deceased al-Qaeda leaders. IBM |
#24
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F-35, not F-22, to Protect U.S. Airspace
On Feb 3, 10:47*pm, Ian B MacLure wrote:
Jack Linthicum wrote : On Feb 2, 9:51*pm, Ian B MacLure wrote: 150flivver wrote in news:359a3711-b5ea-4741- : On Feb 2, 3:08*am, hcobb wrote: On Feb 2, 6:45 am, 150flivver wrote: Exactly how was the Air Force supposed to prevent 9/11? *I guess t he Air Force wasn't prepared to prevent the banking crisis or global warming either. Which service is it that's supposed to at least intercept hostile aircraft in American skies? Perhaps this also should be handed over to the USMC? -HJC 9/11 was a criminal act conducted by foreign criminals. *Calling it * * * * It was an act of war by a non-state actor. We quite prope rly * * * * took it at face value and opened hostilities on the actor s * * * * and their supporters. war doesn't make it so. *Law enforcement is something I don't want th e military involved in. *The FBI and CIA dropped the ball on this one, not the Air Force. *Shooting down airliners filled with hostages/ citizens is something the Soviet Union would do, not what the USA does. * * * * The FBI and CIA had been knecapped by Jamie Gorelick at K lintoon's * * * * behest. It was more than your career was worth to ask inc onvenient * * * * questions or, god forbid, share information. Many of the necessary * * * * dots were already plotted. They just could not legally be *connected * * * * and it took an enormous effort against determined Dhimmic rap * * * * opposition to change that situation. * * * * IBM IIRC Clinton left office in January 2001, the FBI and CIA continued their feud that says "I won't tell you anything you can use", and FBI * * * * Funny you should mention that cause theres a PBS show on right * * * * now about what was known about the 9/11 and how the FBI who had * * * * agents assigned to the CIA unit tracking Bin Laden could not legally * * * * be told what the CIA knew. So far all the narrative takes place * * * * well prior to mid January 2001. telephone taps that should have been tied to that "Osama bin Ladin wants to do harm to the US" line in the PDB. As near as I can tell that division still exists, perhaps expanded by the NSA being able to say "I know something you don't". We now have an extra level of DNI to * * * * Up until about two eeks ago any FedGov agency practicing that sort * * * * of dog in the manger routine would ahve found themsleves assigned * * * * to sorting through jihadi trash heaps in Indian country. Now that * * * * Soetaro is calling the shots who knows? add to the various inter service and interagency versions of that same attitude. I would bet that more useful intelligence gets stuffed into burn bags than gets into the PDB. * * * * And yet the air over Pakistan is filed with the remains of recently * * * * deceased al-Qaeda leaders. * * * * IBM Yeah, but talk to anybody who has been in DC, cultures never change. I remember when JFK wanted to dismember the CIA and strew it to the winds over what it said about Cuba. i.e. they'd love us, rise up, we'd be heroes (hmmm where have I heard that recently??). Go read the seminal papers in political science on groupthink. there is a reason they are still assigned 20 plus years later in graduate school. I read them as an under grad, later after I decided to go back for a PhD. bureaucracies really get entrenched. one reason is they self select for people that agree with the current mindset. pick an idea. fight mafia in the USAF, anything. cultures are difficult to change. you can't fire everybody. maybe in a generation after all the old farts retire, you can get something done. there is probably a reason it took a good 20 plus years to get the IRA to get to the peace table. much as I admire the military, its not the solution to all the problems. though its easier to go to a military solution. |
#25
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F-35, not F-22, to Protect U.S. Airspace
Ian B MacLure wrote:
Peter Skelton wrote in : [snip] Could I humbly sugggest that you look into muslim populations before you spew your tripe? The US has a larger Muslim population than any European country but Russia. On a per cant basis it is near the European median. Oh really? Yes ! Really ! .........have a boo at this page.... http://www.factbook.net/muslim_pop.php And we have the same sort of exurban ghettos populated by pig ignorant hill tribesmen from gawd only knows where ( outside of Dearbornistan and al-Hamtramck of course ). Different As opposed to those lovely *fascist* 'Right To Work States', esposed by so many lovely Southerners etal . demographic and despite your claims nowhere near the numbers. I dare say al-Qanada has, at some 600,000, Canada .... pop. 31, 592,805 muslim pop. 1.5% = 473,892 ....oops wrong again ! or so a higher Mooselimb population (percentagewise) than does the US. US pop. 278,058,881 muslim pop. 3.5%= 9,732,061 You have us beat by a ratio of 2 to 1, dildo ! Enjoy ! cheers....Jeff IBM |
#26
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F-35, not F-22, to Protect U.S. Airspace
"Jeffrey Hamilton" wrote in message ... Canada ... pop. 31, 592,805 muslim pop. 1.5% = 473,892 ...oops wrong again ! or so a higher Mooselimb population (percentagewise) than does the US. US pop. 278,058,881 muslim pop. 3.5%= 9,732,061 You have us beat by a ratio of 2 to 1, dildo ! Enjoy ! Hah! We're number 1! Glenn D. |
#27
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F-35, not F-22, to Protect U.S. Airspace
On Tue, 03 Feb 2009 22:47:06 -0600, Ian B MacLure
wrote: Funny you should mention that cause theres a PBS show on right now about what was known about the 9/11 and how the FBI who had agents assigned to the CIA unit tracking Bin Laden could not legally be told what the CIA knew. So far all the narrative takes place well prior to mid January 2001. Ayup. The FBI and CIA always had separate spheres of influence but, IIRC, the legal prohibition on sharing information dates to the '70s when "anti-war activists" got the Congress to forbid exchanges of information. I'm sure they thought they were dealing with an abuse of power stemming from Viet Nam War era activities; just one more demonstration of the Law of Unintended Consequences. It remains to be seen what kind of "change" the new guy will put in place in DC. So far he is a Master of the Media and Sultan of Soundbites. The substance of anything is yet to be known. |
#28
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F-35, not F-22, to Protect U.S. Airspace
On Feb 4, 3:19*pm, Bill Kambic wrote:
On Tue, 03 Feb 2009 22:47:06 -0600, Ian B MacLure wrote: * * * * * *Funny you should mention that cause theres a PBS show on right * * * * * *now about what was known about the 9/11 and how the FBI who had * * * * * *agents assigned to the CIA unit tracking Bin Laden could not legally * * * * * *be told what the CIA knew. So far all the narrative takes place * * * * * *well prior to mid January 2001. Ayup. *The FBI and CIA always had separate spheres of influence but, IIRC, the legal prohibition on sharing information dates to the '70s when "anti-war activists" got the Congress to forbid exchanges of information. *I'm sure they thought they were dealing with an abuse of power stemming from Viet Nam War era activities; just one more demonstration of the Law of Unintended Consequences. It remains to be seen what kind of "change" the new guy will put in place in DC. *So far he is a Master of the Media and Sultan of Soundbites. *The substance of anything is yet to be known. example http://www.csmonitor.com/2001/1217/p2s1-usgn.html |
#29
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F-35, not F-22, to Protect U.S. Airspace
[Horse**** snipped] According to the Pew Forum on Religion and Public Life Mooselimbs of all kinds are 0.6% of the US population about one/third the Jewish or Mormon slice. You can spin it any way you like but the bottom line is that the US has nowhere near the kind of Mooselimb demographic that Eurabia has. The US for instance did not for instance import Mooselimbs as cheap labo(u)r. In short we may have them but they aren't generally susceptible to the same kind of issues that makes oh say Fwance the Car-B-Que capital of the World. Nor are US Mooselimbs multi-generational strangers in a strange land as in Germany. To be sure there are some recent immigrants who'd like to have it that way but time isn't on their side and cultural assimilation will proceed apace. I know people who have converted to and from Islam. Its one of many choices they make in life. To digress a little, there is, in the Imperial valley of Kalifornia, a numerous clan of Mohammeds all Catholic. A couple of generations ago their forebear immigrated from the Punjab and eventually married a local Hispanic woman with the stated result. And you completely ignored one very important component of the US Mooselimb population. African Americans either of the Nation of Islam or orthodox persuasion represent something like 1/3 of the Mooselimb population. I have issues with the NoI as racists but but they aren't terribly dangerous except at times to themselves unfortunately. Not like having a population nearly all closely connected with some fetid Jihadistan or other as is the case in Eurabia. IBM |
#30
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F-35, not F-22, to Protect U.S. Airspace
On Tue, 03 Feb 2009 22:40:46 -0600, Ian B MacLure
wrote: Peter Skelton wrote in : [snip] Could I humbly sugggest that you look into muslim populations before you spew your tripe? The US has a larger Muslim population than any European country but Russia. On a per cant basis it is near the European median. Oh really? And we have the same sort of exurban ghettos populated by pig ignorant hill tribesmen from gawd only knows where ( outside of Dearbornistan and al-Hamtramck of course ). Different demographic and despite your claims nowhere near the numbers. It seems you are ignorant and too stupid to look stuff up when challenged. I dare say al-Qanada has, at some 600,000, or so a higher Mooselimb population (percentagewise) than does the US. Canada's Muslim population is aobut half the US's on a per capita basis. Peter Skelton |
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