If there were 25 million active GA pilots...

"Tom S." wrote in message
...

What if you shutdown both electrical systems and the smoke only increases?

If it is a non-electrical fire that is a separate issue.

But by having only electric gyros it becomes much harder to deal with an
electrical fire.

Airliners have fire-suppression systems which make this situation less
likely than a GA airplane.

I cannot imagine flying an electric-only airplane with no vacuum backup.

--
Richard Kaplan, CFII

www.flyimc.com

"C J Campbell" wrote in message
...

You know, a lot of pilots do not know that dual bus electrical systems with
backup alternators are better than vacuum pumps which are virtually
guaranteed to fail before TBO.

How about one electric AI and one vacuum AI? That is the best of both
worlds.
--
Richard Kaplan, CFII

www.flyimc.com

Richard Kaplan wrote:

How about one electric AI and one vacuum AI? That is the best of both
worlds.

Which one do you believe when they don't agree? "The man with no watch knows
what time it is. The man with two is never sure."

George Patterson
To a pilot, altitude is like money - it is possible that having too much
could prove embarassing, but having too little is always fatal.

"G.R. Patterson III" wrote:

"The man with no watch knows what time it is. The man with two is never sure."
^^
Should be "one".

George Patterson
To a pilot, altitude is like money - it is possible that having too much
could prove embarassing, but having too little is always fatal.

"G.R. Patterson III" wrote in message
...
How about one electric AI and one vacuum AI? That is the best of both
worlds.

Which one do you believe when they don't agree?

One hopes that a look at the vacuum gauge and the ammeter would help you
with that. Of course, if the instrument itself has failed, you have to fall
back on the traditional cross-check techniques, but that would be a
possibility anyway. Besides, it's much more common for the power source
(vacuum or electric) to fail than for the instrument itself to.

Pete

("G.R. Patterson III" wrote)
"The man with no watch knows what time it is. The man with two is never
sure."
^^
Should be "one".

The man's broken watch is 100% accurate - twice a day.

--
Montblack

"Richard Kaplan" wrote in message
s.com...



"Tom S." wrote in message
...

What if you shutdown both electrical systems and the smoke only
increases?

If it is a non-electrical fire that is a separate issue.

I know...I was just pulling your crank :~)


But by having only electric gyros it becomes much harder to deal with an
electrical fire.
....

I cannot imagine flying an electric-only airplane with no vacuum backup.

The real "best of both worlds" is a dual bus electrical system with a vacuum
for backup/redundancy.

I wonder how soon that arrangement might make it's way into the lower
echelon of GA aircraft now that miniaturization is becoming so prevalent.

Tom
--
"Federal personnel data show that just 434 civilian federal workers were
fired for poor performance in 2001. Just 210 non-defense workers,
or 1 in 5,000, were fired for poor performance. Firing rates were
similarly low in prior years, and are low across all agencies."

NOTE: "Poor performance" is pretty much limited to sexual harassment, theft,
assault, and other criminal actions. Even that is not often enough for a
federal
employment termination.

In article , "Montblack"
wrote:

("G.R. Patterson III" wrote)
"The man with no watch knows what time it is. The man with two is
never
sure."
^^
Should be "one".

The man's broken watch is 100% accurate - twice a day.


there are exceptions to that...

--
Bob Noel

"Tom S." wrote in message
...


The real "best of both worlds" is a dual bus electrical system with a
vacuum
for backup/redundancy.

Yes, I agree completely.

Unfortunately, Cirrus seems to be leading the way without vacuum systems and
I do not think this is a good idea.

To some extent this has parallels with Cirrus installing the ballistic
parachute and using that as an excuse to not perform spin testing.

Similarly this reminds me of the discussion I had with a Cirrus rep at
Oshkosh about their TKS de-icing system option. The rep said it was
"Certified for Inadvertent Icing" which he said was a step between
non-approved deicing equipment and known-icing approval. I say that is
nonsesnse -- what they probably have is an STC approved on a "does no harm"
basis and you could get a tuna fish sandwich on the copilot seat approved
under the same terms. It is not known-ice.

I think Cirrus has some great ideas for safety but I am not certain the
execution is optimum or complete on a number of them.

--
Richard Kaplan, CFII

www.flyimc.com

"G.R. Patterson III" writes:

How about one electric AI and one vacuum AI? That is the best of both
worlds.

Which one do you believe when they don't agree? "The man with no watch knows
what time it is. The man with two is never sure."

You let the other instruments vote one of the AI's off the island.


All the best,


David