$640.00 to fill the tanks...

"Bob Moore" wrote in message
. 121...
Morgans wrote
or as you say, "middleast" or whatever the h*ll that is.

From Wikipedia:
The Middle East is a loosely defined term for the historical and cultural
subregion of Africa-Eurasia traditionally held to be countries or regions
in Southwest Asia together with Egypt. In other contexts, the region can
include other parts of North Africa and/or Central Asia.

Note the smushed spelling.
--
Jim in NC

Skylune wrote:
We do subsidize GA in the USA however. Ah, priorities and politics.....

No, we don't. Actually we collect up GA taxes and hold them in account
to make the deficit look smaller.

-Robert

john smith wrote:
Insurance paid $3700, we owe $1200 (20% of the total bill).

You could also have elected to buy a more expensive policy that covered
more, you selected a policy that paid 80% based on the cost of the
policy and what you would get for it. Personally, I just carry a
catastrophic policy and pay everything out of pocket with pre-tax
dollars using an HSA. I'm saving a ton of money over my previous PPOs
and HMOs and if I ever do get really sick, the catastrophic policy
kicks in.

-Robert

Jay Honeck wrote:
Exactly. And it is sad to say, but public (government) schools are
doing a fine job of insuring new generations will go forth with
limited understanding of the real power of economic freedom and
just how precious it is to maintain.


Actually -- so far -- the schools in Iowa City have done a pretty good
job of teaching the free-market system to my kids. Of course, this is
done with an undertone of self-consciousness -- as if they are somehow
ashamed to live in a capitalist system -- and there is always the
message that capitalism needs to be reigned in lest it go crazy and
crush the weak and weary.

Luckily, the kids spend many hours each week in the "real world",
working at the hotel. There, they can see life as it really is, in bold
relief -- sometimes in ways that their school teachers could never
dream of...

True. It is unfortunate, but unionized teachers are about as insulated
from the real world as it gets. Only politicians are more insulated.

Matt

Jay Honeck wrote:

Actually -- so far -- the schools in Iowa City have done a pretty good
job of teaching the free-market system to my kids. Of course . . .
. . . . there is always the
message that capitalism needs to be reigned in lest it go crazy and
crush the weak and weary.

Well, I should think you'd want them taught "the facts of life". The
final sentence above is pretty much an emperically proven fact, is it
not?

I'm not putting down the free market system or capitalism in saying
this; not at all. I believe the underlying laws of free market
economics are demonstrated economic (and/or psychological) principles,
more or less as valid, universal, reliable, and inescapable as the laws
of physics that I know a fair amount about.

And I'm also in full agreement with, was it Churchill?, who supposedly
once said something like: "Democratic capitalism is not a particularly
good social or economic system. It's just substantially better than any
other social system that mankind has come up with." True enough, then
and now.

But when Free Market Economics turns into, not a set of economic laws to
help shape our broader policy making, but into an ideology, a economic
theology, before which we're all supposed to bow down -- that's bad news.

When FME becomes an economic religion which, as interpreted by its
acolytes and ayatollahs is supposed to reign dominant over every other
consideration in our lives, then indeed a lot of crushing of the weak,
the weary, the unfortunate, the innocent -- not to mention a lot of
exploitation of them and others -- is certain to result.

In article .com,
"Robert M. Gary" wrote:

john smith wrote:
Insurance paid $3700, we owe $1200 (20% of the total bill).

You could also have elected to buy a more expensive policy that covered
more, you selected a policy that paid 80% based on the cost of the
policy and what you would get for it. Personally, I just carry a
catastrophic policy and pay everything out of pocket with pre-tax
dollars using an HSA. I'm saving a ton of money over my previous PPOs
and HMOs and if I ever do get really sick, the catastrophic policy
kicks in.

We picked the policy we have based on what we could afford out of pocket.
Our family is normally healthy, spending less than $2000 annually on out
of pocket medical expenses. Eyeglasses for the family being the biggest
expense each year.
This medical emergency was completely unforeseen so the insurance cost
has already paid for itself.

AES wrote:
Jay Honeck wrote:


Actually -- so far -- the schools in Iowa City have done a pretty good
job of teaching the free-market system to my kids. Of course . . .
. . . . there is always the
message that capitalism needs to be reigned in lest it go crazy and
crush the weak and weary.


Well, I should think you'd want them taught "the facts of life". The
final sentence above is pretty much an emperically proven fact, is it
not?

I'm not putting down the free market system or capitalism in saying
this; not at all. I believe the underlying laws of free market
economics are demonstrated economic (and/or psychological) principles,
more or less as valid, universal, reliable, and inescapable as the laws
of physics that I know a fair amount about.

I think part of the problem is that no economy is ever completely
capitalistic. For one thing, many "costs" aren't easily quantifiable or
assigned to the entity that created those costs. That is one reason
that "pure" capitalism tends to not be very nice to the environment.
The costs of pollution historically haven't been borne by the polluters.
I realize that Germany, as one example, is trying to change this with
their "cradle to grave" responsibility that a company bears for its
products. I suspect that this will have a profound effect over time.
If the makers of things that pollute have to bear all of those costs,
then capitalism is still very effective, even at preventing pollution.

So, I still think capitalism is a pretty good system, the problem is
that we seldom truly practice capitalism, and I don't think it is even
possible to do so.


Matt

Robert M. Gary wrote:
Show me who qualifies for medicaid and can afford to fly at the same
time.

If you can afford to fly, you are paying for your health care whether
you live in the U.S. or in Europe. In Europe you give the gov't money
to pay for your healthcare, in the U.S. you give the insurance company
money to pay for your healthcare.
In both cases, if you don't have money, the gov't picks up the tab.
-Robert


An American pays more tax dollars to NOT get universal healthcare
compared to what a Canadian pays.

I'd rather have aviation subsidized than some woman with ten kids on
welfare. Socialists suck.

Actually, NPR did a piece today on the 10th anniversary of welfare
reform. Even the socialists they interviewed had to grudgingly admit
that the reform program, passed by the Republicans in 1996 (and signed
into law by Bill Clinton) has been a resounding success, with welfare
roles down 60%.

Best of all, according to NPR being on "welfare" has been stigmatized
once again, even in the inner cities, where it had become a
multi-generational way of life. People are ashamed of being on the
public dole, and are working their way out of poverty, instead of
Jonesing when their checks were late.

These are all good things.

Childhood immunizations. There are no children turned away without
immunization anywhere in America. There *are*, however, millions of
criminally stupid parents who don't GET their children immunized.

Honestly, you have to pass a test to drive a car, but there is no
"minimum requirement" for reproducing. Imagine what a lovely world it
could be, if only some basic skills were required of every human before
they had children?
--
Jay Honeck
Owner/Innkeeper/Webmaster
www.AlexisParkInn.com
"Your Aviation Destination

Jay Honeck wrote:

Best of all, according to NPR being on "welfare" has been stigmatized
once again, even in the inner cities, where it had become a
multi-generational way of life. People are ashamed of being on the
public dole, and are working their way out of poverty, instead of
Jonesing when their checks were late.

Wow, I really don't see that in my area of the country. AT ALL. What I
see are hundreds, even thousands of people who moved here after a
certain natural disaster and never went home. They're using public aid,
and don't seem to want that to change.

Childhood immunizations. There are no children turned away without
immunization anywhere in America. There *are*, however, millions of
criminally stupid parents who don't GET their children immunized.

Me personally, I wish I hadn't been immunized. I'm not sure, when I was
a child, that vaccines were safe. We certainly didn't know as much as
we do now. I'm all about risk awareness, and a baby can't choose, and
parents are blinded by, well, paranoia. My mother still thinks I'm
going to die every time I get in a plane, so would one really expect her
to research vaccines? Nope. Course, I don't remember bring up
immunizations, so I'll stop there.

Honestly, you have to pass a test to drive a car, but there is no
"minimum requirement" for reproducing. Imagine what a lovely world it
could be, if only some basic skills were required of every human before
they had children?

As someone smarter than many people in the world, I say yes. As a
libertarian, I unfortunately have to say no. Reproduce as you like,
just don't use my money to take care of the results.