Minimum rates of climb/descent for VFR

WingFlaps wrote in
:

On Feb 16, 9:52Â*am, Bertie the Bunyip wrote:
WingFlaps wrote
innews:b3a149c7-a9b9-4be1-b6fe-b9450
:



On Feb 16, 4:14Â*am, Mark Hansen wrote:
On 02/15/08 01:53, WingFlaps wrote:

On Feb 15, 9:19�am, Gig 601XL Builder wrgiac...@REMOVEgmail.
com

wrote:
WingFlaps wrote:
On Feb 15, 12:31 am, "John" wrote:
No there are no regulations for climb or descent rates for
VFR fligh
t.

Err I don't think that's 100% correct but it will do for MX.

Cheers

Please then for my benefit point me to such a regulation.

Certainly. Vne is a limit that must not be exceeded (there are
others). This sets a limit on how fast you can legally descend
(remember pilots must fly within operating limits). You must
also not use ascent or descent rate that put you in conflict
with ATC unless you have got clearance. When NORDO you cannot
ascend or descend into controlled space except as part of a
flight plan.

What? You believe that an aircraft with no radio is not allowed to
enter controlled airspace without being on a flight plan?

Can you please provide a reference to that regulation?

Â* Â* Â* Â* Â* Â* Â* Â* Â* Â*

Â* Â* Â* Â* Â* Â* Â* Â* Â* Â*
Â* Â* Â* Â* Â*The descent rate at
or below 500' must be zero or negative except at an aerodrome or
within a LFZ. You can probably now see other examples. Pilots
should think outside the box ;-)

An towered airport is controlled airspace so:

Unless otherwise authorized or required by ATC, no person may
operate an aircraft to, from, through, or on an airport having an
operational control tower unless two-way radio communications are
maintained between that aircraft and the control tower.
Communications must be established prior to 4 nautical miles from
the airport, up to and including 2,500 feet AGL. However, if the
aircraft radio fails in flight, the pilot in command may operate
that aircraft and land if weather conditions are at or above basic
VFR weather minimums, visual contact with the tower is maintained,
and a clearance to land is received. If the aircraft radio fails
while in flight under IFR, the pilot must comply with §91.185.

Flown nordo into controlled fields loads of times..

Not usually a prob. No flight plan either. Just called the tower by
phone before i departed or flew as a flight of two.


Yes, in my thinking that call to the tower established a plan.

Hmm, dunno. I suppose it does. You'd have to ask an ATC type how they'd
classify it, but it's a clearance into the zone at least.


bertie

WingFlaps wrote in
:

On Feb 16, 10:11*am, Bertie the Bunyip wrote:
"Steven P. McNicoll" wrote
innews:13rbva412cl4s
:



You shouldn't be playing with your daddy's computer.

Sorry, but this lame is so past it's sell by date I just couldn't let
it g
o
by without comment.

Since there has been so much interest in trolling and what it is and
ins't

these days here's a bit of a primer for those interested in the
subject. Any post slyly left to bait an unwitting fjukkwit is
technically a troll. So, just about everybody who has ever posted on
usenet has trolled at one time or another in whatever modest way.
This is a good thing sometimes.

Keep up the good work, rattle their cages free from the prattle of
mediocrity!


Thanks. i intend to!

Bertie

On 02/15/08 12:33, WingFlaps wrote:
On Feb 16, 4:14 am, Mark Hansen wrote:
On 02/15/08 01:53, WingFlaps wrote:



On Feb 15, 9:19�am, Gig 601XL Builder
wrote:
WingFlaps wrote:
On Feb 15, 12:31 am, "John" wrote:
No there are no regulations for climb or descent rates for VFR flight.

Err I don't think that's 100% correct but it will do for MX.

Cheers

Please then for my benefit point me to such a regulation.

Certainly. Vne is a limit that must not be exceeded (there are
others). This sets a limit on how fast you can legally descend
(remember pilots must fly within operating limits). You must also not
use ascent or descent rate that put you in conflict with ATC unless
you have got clearance. When NORDO you cannot ascend or descend into
controlled space except as part of a flight plan.

What? You believe that an aircraft with no radio is not allowed to
enter controlled airspace without being on a flight plan?

Can you please provide a reference to that regulation?


An towered airport is controlled airspace so:

Actually, your statement was much broader than "Class D airspace". It
was "controlled airspace".

But I can see from your response that it's of no value to argue the
point with you - so I won't.


--
Mark Hansen, PP-ASEL, Instrument Airplane, USUA Ultralight Pilot
Cal Aggie Flying Farmers
Sacramento, CA

wrote in
:

On Feb 15, 9:02 am, Bertie the Bunyip wrote:
Mxsmanic wrote
:

Steven P. McNicoll writes:

The 250 KIAS speed limit can be waived but very seldom is.

It cannot be waived by ATC, but the FAA can waive it--not something
it's likely to do in real time for individual flights, though.

Wrong again fjukktad.


He's right, you're the fjukktad. (Whatever that is.) The 250 KIAS
rule can be waived by the Administrator but not by ATC.

Nope

Bertie

On Feb 15, 6:31 pm, Bertie the Bunyip wrote:
wrote in news:17f19905-7814-446d-9800-
:

On Feb 15, 8:23 am, Bertie the Bunyip wrote:

All da time in da USA!

Nope.

Yep.


Prove it.


For many heavies, min clean speed on takeoff is often over 250 knots and
they have permission to exceed 250 every time they need to.

Yes, but that's done in accordance with the regulation, not under a
waiver from it.

Nope


Yup:


§ 91.117 Aircraft speed.

(a) Unless otherwise authorized by the Administrator, no person may
operate an aircraft below 10,000 feet MSL at an indicated airspeed of
more than 250 knots (288 m.p.h.).

(b) Unless otherwise authorized or required by ATC, no person may
operate an aircraft at or below 2,500 feet above the surface within 4
nautical miles of the primary airport of a Class C or Class D airspace
area at an indicated airspeed of more than 200 knots (230 mph.). This
paragraph (b) does not apply to any operations within a Class B
airspace area. Such operations shall comply with paragraph (a) of this
section.

(c) No person may operate an aircraft in the airspace underlying a
Class B airspace area designated for an airport or in a VFR corridor
designated through such a Class B airspace area, at an indicated
airspeed of more than 200 knots (230 mph).

(d) If the minimum safe airspeed for any particular operation is
greater than the maximum speed prescribed in this section, the
aircraft may be operated at that minimum speed.

[Doc. No. 18334, 54 FR 34292, Aug. 18, 1989, as amended by Amdt. 91-
219, 55 FR 34708, Aug. 24, 1990; Amdt. 91-227, 56 FR 65657, Dec. 17,
1991; Amdt. 91-233, 58 FR 43554, Aug. 17, 1993]

On Feb 15, 8:04 pm, Bertie the Bunyip wrote:
wrote :



On Feb 15, 9:02 am, Bertie the Bunyip wrote:
Mxsmanic wrote
:

Steven P. McNicoll writes:

The 250 KIAS speed limit can be waived but very seldom is.

It cannot be waived by ATC, but the FAA can waive it--not something
it's likely to do in real time for individual flights, though.

Wrong again fjukktad.

He's right, you're the fjukktad. (Whatever that is.) The 250 KIAS
rule can be waived by the Administrator but not by ATC.

Nope



Yup:


§ 91.117 Aircraft speed.

(a) Unless otherwise authorized by the Administrator, no person may
operate an aircraft below 10,000 feet MSL at an indicated airspeed of
more than 250 knots (288 m.p.h.).

(b) Unless otherwise authorized or required by ATC, no person may
operate an aircraft at or below 2,500 feet above the surface within 4
nautical miles of the primary airport of a Class C or Class D airspace
area at an indicated airspeed of more than 200 knots (230 mph.). This
paragraph (b) does not apply to any operations within a Class B
airspace area. Such operations shall comply with paragraph (a) of this
section.

(c) No person may operate an aircraft in the airspace underlying a
Class B airspace area designated for an airport or in a VFR corridor
designated through such a Class B airspace area, at an indicated
airspeed of more than 200 knots (230 mph).

(d) If the minimum safe airspeed for any particular operation is
greater than the maximum speed prescribed in this section, the
aircraft may be operated at that minimum speed.

[Doc. No. 18334, 54 FR 34292, Aug. 18, 1989, as amended by Amdt. 91-
219, 55 FR 34708, Aug. 24, 1990; Amdt. 91-227, 56 FR 65657, Dec. 17,
1991; Amdt. 91-233, 58 FR 43554, Aug. 17, 1993]

On Feb 15, 9:21 pm, wrote:

Nope

Yup:

§ 91.117 Aircraft speed.

(a) Unless otherwise authorized by the Administrator...

Any possibility the Administrator has delegated it internally within
FAA?

F--

wrote in
:

On Feb 15, 8:04 pm, Bertie the Bunyip wrote:
wrote
innews:0f15696b-ff1a-486f-8ae3-5aff769cbf76@j
28g2000hsj.googlegroups.com:



On Feb 15, 9:02 am, Bertie the Bunyip wrote:
Mxsmanic wrote
:

Steven P. McNicoll writes:

The 250 KIAS speed limit can be waived but very seldom is.

It cannot be waived by ATC, but the FAA can waive it--not
something it's likely to do in real time for individual flights,
though.

Wrong again fjukktad.

He's right, you're the fjukktad. (Whatever that is.) The 250 KIAS
rule can be waived by the Administrator but not by ATC.

Nope



Yup:



Nope.






§ 91.117 Aircraft speed.

(a) Unless otherwise authorized by the Administrator, no person may
operate an aircraft below 10,000 feet MSL at an indicated airspeed of
more than 250 knots (288 m.p.h.).

(b) Unless otherwise authorized or required by ATC, no person may
operate an aircraft at or below 2,500 feet above the surface within 4
nautical miles of the primary airport of a Class C or Class D airspace
area at an indicated airspeed of more than 200 knots (230 mph.). This
paragraph (b) does not apply to any operations within a Class B
airspace area. Such operations shall comply with paragraph (a) of this
section.

(c) No person may operate an aircraft in the airspace underlying a
Class B airspace area designated for an airport or in a VFR corridor
designated through such a Class B airspace area, at an indicated
airspeed of more than 200 knots (230 mph).

(d) If the minimum safe airspeed for any particular operation is
greater than the maximum speed prescribed in this section, the
aircraft may be operated at that minimum speed.

[Doc. No. 18334, 54 FR 34292, Aug. 18, 1989, as amended by Amdt. 91-
219, 55 FR 34708, Aug. 24, 1990; Amdt. 91-227, 56 FR 65657, Dec. 17,
1991; Amdt. 91-233, 58 FR 43554, Aug. 17, 1993]

wrote in
:

On Feb 15, 6:31 pm, Bertie the Bunyip wrote:
wrote in news:17f19905-7814-446d-9800-
:

On Feb 15, 8:23 am, Bertie the Bunyip wrote:

All da time in da USA!

Nope.

Yep.


Prove it.


For many heavies, min clean speed on takeoff is often over 250
knots an
d
they have permission to exceed 250 every time they need to.

Yes, but that's done in accordance with the regulation, not under a
waiver from it.

Nope


Yup:


Nope


Bertie

§ 91.117 Aircraft speed.

(a) Unless otherwise authorized by the Administrator, no person may
operate an aircraft below 10,000 feet MSL at an indicated airspeed of
more than 250 knots (288 m.p.h.).

(b) Unless otherwise authorized or required by ATC, no person may
operate an aircraft at or below 2,500 feet above the surface within 4
nautical miles of the primary airport of a Class C or Class D airspace
area at an indicated airspeed of more than 200 knots (230 mph.). This
paragraph (b) does not apply to any operations within a Class B
airspace area. Such operations shall comply with paragraph (a) of this
section.

(c) No person may operate an aircraft in the airspace underlying a
Class B airspace area designated for an airport or in a VFR corridor
designated through such a Class B airspace area, at an indicated
airspeed of more than 200 knots (230 mph).

(d) If the minimum safe airspeed for any particular operation is
greater than the maximum speed prescribed in this section, the
aircraft may be operated at that minimum speed.

[Doc. No. 18334, 54 FR 34292, Aug. 18, 1989, as amended by Amdt. 91-
219, 55 FR 34708, Aug. 24, 1990; Amdt. 91-227, 56 FR 65657, Dec. 17,
1991; Amdt. 91-233, 58 FR 43554, Aug. 17, 1993]

wrote in news:7f03c718-a3d3-4093-8c09-97088b1c8fb1
@n77g2000hse.googlegroups.com:

On Feb 15, 9:21 pm, wrote:

Nope

Yup:

§ 91.117 Aircraft speed.

(a) Unless otherwise authorized by the Administrator...

Any possibility the Administrator has delegated it internally within
FAA?



Oh for god sakes, don't help him!

He's doing fine on his own.


Bertie