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#61
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Jon Kraus wrote: It looks like the Challenger skidded off the runway and crashed into a warehouse at TEB. Yesterday, NPR news stated that the mayor is pushing for reducing the number of flights at TEB and installing "foam crash barriers" at the ends of the runway. No mention of the fact that the deceleration produced by barriers like that would have killed everyone on board this aircraft had they been in place. George Patterson He who would distinguish what is true from what is false must have an adequate understanding of truth and falsehood. |
#62
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Runways are selected to assure the ability to accelerate to V1 and then stop with maximum braking. You are committed to fly passing V1, but that assumes that the plane will fly. Quite often Vr is faster than V1... |
#63
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"George Patterson" wrote in message ... Jon Kraus wrote: It looks like the Challenger skidded off the runway and crashed into a warehouse at TEB. Yesterday, NPR news stated that the mayor is pushing for reducing the number of flights at TEB and installing "foam crash barriers" at the ends of the runway. No mention of the fact that the deceleration produced by barriers like that would have killed everyone on board this aircraft had they been in place. I suspect his point is not to protect the pax and crew as much as to protect the people in the buildings and roads around the airport. That building the Challenger crashed into happened to be empty, but during working hours that one alone has more than 200 people in it. Doesn't take away from the lack of imagination in thinking that foam will solve any perceived problems with the airport, but might explain where he is coming from. |
#64
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Blueskies wrote:
Runways are selected to assure the ability to accelerate to V1 and then stop with maximum braking. Isn't it the other way round: The runway length defines v1? Stefan |
#65
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George Patterson wrote:
No mention of the fact that the deceleration produced by barriers like that would have killed everyone on board this aircraft had they been in place. Maybe, maybe not, I don't know. But if that plane would have hit a school bus full of kids when crossing the road and/or that warehouse would not have happened to be empty at that time, I bet the airport would already be closed right now. Stefdan |
#66
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"Bob Moore" wrote in message . 121... "kage" wrote Vr is normally higher than V1 (but not always), it cannot be less than V1. Isn't that a "mutually exclusive" statement. I guess V1 and Vr could be the same, I've never seen that. B-727-200...V1 and Vr were normally the same. If Vr is the same as some other "V" speed it is usually the same as V2. I don't see how that can be considering the "speed increment" required by the following from FAR Part 25: (c) V2, in terms of calibrated airspeed, must be selected by the applicant to provide at least the gradient of climb required by §25.121(b) but may not be less than- (2) VR plus the speed increment attained (in accordance with §25.111(c)(2)) before reaching a height of 35 feet above the takeoff surface; Bob Moore ATP B-727 B-707 PanAm (retired) Vr and V2 are always the same in a Falcon 50, a part 25 airplane. Go figure! I never got to fly something big. Best, Karl ATP BE-300 CE-500 LR-Jet DA-50 Helicopter |
#67
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I wouldn't shoot so fast- TEB is a pretty major artery in the NYC area. It
handles probably more than half of the bizjet traffic into Manhattan and in case it isn't obvious, the people who fly in those jets are, shall we say, influential? This is not some little country strip supporting weekend Cub flights. Besides, if they close TEB the traffic will just have to move to somewhere else, and the NY/NJ Port Authority has enough trouble dealing with the traffic at EWK, LGA, and JFK as it is. "Stefan" wrote in message ... George Patterson wrote: No mention of the fact that the deceleration produced by barriers like that would have killed everyone on board this aircraft had they been in place. Maybe, maybe not, I don't know. But if that plane would have hit a school bus full of kids when crossing the road and/or that warehouse would not have happened to be empty at that time, I bet the airport would already be closed right now. Stefdan |
#68
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"George Patterson" wrote in message ... Yesterday, NPR news stated that the mayor is pushing for reducing the number of flights at TEB and installing "foam crash barriers" at the ends of the runway. No mention of the fact that the deceleration produced by barriers like that would have killed everyone on board this aircraft had they been in place. Why not just pile up a bunch of barrels of gasoline? It'd cost a lot less, stop the plane just as quick, and would be totally self-cleaning. -cwk. |
#69
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"Stefan" wrote in message ... Blueskies wrote: Runways are selected to assure the ability to accelerate to V1 and then stop with maximum braking. Isn't it the other way round: The runway length defines v1? Stefan Well, yea, gross takeoff weight and density altitude, etc control define V1, so you could look at a runway then decide the max weight allowable for that day. You need to be sure that the runway is long enough to accel to V1 then stop... |
#70
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"Stefan" wrote in message ... George Patterson wrote: No mention of the fact that the deceleration produced by barriers like that would have killed everyone on board this aircraft had they been in place. Maybe, maybe not, I don't know. But if that plane would have hit a school bus full of kids when crossing the road and/or that warehouse would not have happened to be empty at that time, I bet the airport would already be closed right now. Stefdan I don't think so... |
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