"bush flying" in the suburbs?

zatatime wrote:

If this does not cover the issue, I'll try to find time to call the
State DOT for clarification of what statute applies. I only know from
practical knowledge that it is not allowed.

I'm probably reading it wrong.

George Patterson
The desire for safety stands against every great and noble enterprise.

On Thu, 09 Dec 2004 01:52:31 GMT, "G.R. Patterson III"
wrote:



zatatime wrote:

If this does not cover the issue, I'll try to find time to call the
State DOT for clarification of what statute applies. I only know from
practical knowledge that it is not allowed.

I'm probably reading it wrong.

George Patterson
The desire for safety stands against every great and noble enterprise.

Not too sure about that. I did miss the "government" comment
preceeding my snip. No promises, but I'll try to follow up to get the
reg #.

z

wrote:
Among other aircraft I've been looking at the Zenith Air STOL CH 801
lately, which attracted my attention purely as an inexpensive and eaily
built plane to cart my family around. http://www.zenithair.com

But the advertised 390-ft fully-loaded ground roll got me fantasizing
about all the convenient places I could land with a STOL bush plane.
Somebody give me a reality check -- even in relatively densely
populated suburbs, there are a number of large open fields suitable for
a bush plane. As it happens there is one such within walking distance
of my parents' house in the northern D.C. suburbs, and there are other
flattish largish open spaces near other places I visit. Has anybody on
these newsgroups had any luck convincing random private landowners to
let them land on their unimproved property? Anybody even tried? Are
there likely to be local ordinances prohibiting intentional off-airport
landings in the suburbs? Lets just leave aside for the moment the
pesky little question of whether I'm qualified for this kind of
adventuring...



Don't the federal regulation forbid dropping under 500ft AGL over
someone else's property? I think the law is that anything below 500 is
the airspace of the private property owner (trying to remember the
details of an AOPA article I read a LONG time ago), and you would be
hard pressed to land anywhere in a suburb without crossing low over
someone who would take issue.

--
http://www.ernest.isa-geek.org/
"This is by far the hardest lesson about freedom. It goes against
instinct, and morality, to just sit back and watch people make
mistakes. We want to help them, which means control them and their
decisions, but in doing so we actually hurt them (and ourselves)."

Several years ago, when I lived in the north end of San Bernardino,
California, my father-in-law used to land on a concrete slab left over from
a WWII Army supply depot. It was about a mile and a half from the house,
just of the east side of Interstate-15 We had scoped the place out, cleared
some brush, and sunk some anchors for tie downs. He lived and flew in Alaska
and the plane was a C-170B with big flaps and huge mains.
Pop would fly over the house and rack the throttle a couple times to get
my attention, then head for the patch. By the time I got there he'd be
tieing the plane down.
One late evening, right at twilight, we went through the drill. I helped
him finish up the tie-downs and just as we started to unload... Headlights,
spotlights, and cops -- sheriff, Highway patrol, city cops, and we found out
in a few minutes the FBI and DEA -- appeared from every direction!
Fortunately, none of them unholstered their pistols but a few had
shotguns pointed in the air. One guy, turned out to be DEA, asked Pop if
they could look in the airplane. I almost wet myself when the old man
answered, "Not unless you tell me what you think you're looking for." After
about ten minutes of hassling back and forth... Pop was a hard-core
conservative, if you haven't figured that out yet... he opened the door and
let them inspect his cargo. He was even polite enough to warn them that his
30.06 and 44Mag were hot loaded, as was his Armalite folded rifle that was
wrapped up in his parka. He was actually bluffing about that. He never
carried the guns loaded in the airplane.
Somebody in the neighborhood alerted the cops. Surely we had to be
smuggling something. Especially when the busybody watched us carry all the
gear out of the airplane and stuff it into the Wagoneer. Especially when
they saw the .06 in the open.
Then, came my turn. The DEA guy walked over to me and asked if he could
look into the Jeep. I could see the old man grinning at me over the agent's
shoulder. With a mouth full of cotton and pucker-factor creeping over the
nine mark, I managed to croak, "Not unless you tell me what you think you're
looking for." Every cop within hearing distance burst out laughing,
including the DEA agent. He shook his head and walked away.
The old concrete slab is long gone. A housing development went in there.
I moved away. The old man and N2310D disappeared into the mountains
somewhere between Anchorage and North Way. Every time I drive into San
Berdoo I remember that night.

"Ernest Christley" wrote in message
. com...
Don't the federal regulation forbid dropping under 500ft AGL over someone
else's property?

Not even close.

I think the law is that anything below 500 is the airspace of the private
property owner

Property owners have no right of ownership of any sort with respect to the
airspace above their property.

Don't the federal regulation forbid dropping under 500ft AGL over someone
else's property?

Not even close.

The regs generally forbid flying an airplane less than 500 feet from
any structure or vessel, except for takeoff and landing.

Jose
--
Freedom. It seemed like a good idea at the time.
for Email, make the obvious change in the address.

"Jose" wrote in message
m...
The regs generally forbid flying an airplane less than 500 feet from any
structure or vessel, except for takeoff and landing.

So what? Those regulations don't apply in congested areas (such as those
described by Ernest), and they don't apply during takeoffs and landings in
any case (the specific situation this entire thread is about).

Where is this? My kids would probably get a big kick out of something like
that...

Newps wrote in news:3N2dnbVgu59cGircRVn-
:

We have a guy here that has a 1500 pound thing he hangs from his
Jetranger each Christmas. It is Santa in his sleigh and a couple of
reindeer. There's about a thousand lights being run from the generator
bungied to the skids. He flies without any lights on the copter and the
route is published in the paper on Dec 23 each year. His whole flight
takes him a couple hours.

On Thu, 09 Dec 2004 04:28:43 GMT, "Casey Wilson" wrote:

Several years ago, when I lived in the north end of San Bernardino,
California, my father-in-law used to land on a concrete slab left over from
a WWII Army supply depot.....

Neat story, Casey, thanks.

Ron Wanttaja

"Peter Duniho" wrote:

I think the law is that anything below 500 is the airspace of the
private
property owner

Property owners have no right of ownership of any sort with respect
to the
airspace above their property.

Yes they do. A property owner has rights to airspace for any
reasonable use thereof under common law, where FAA's 500' reference
may be irrelevant. One example is erection of an antenna tower on
your property. FAA rules under Part 77 on obstructions apply only to
a potential obstruction to public-use airports and to otherwise
navigational airspace -- at least 500' for the latter, but not to
private strips at all. So if such a tower under 500' AGL poses a
hazard to aircraft for an adjoining private airfield, the rights of
the antenna owner's property may just be superior under common law.
Of course, to be decided in a court of common pleas, or by Judge Judy,
or at minimum a rather good "arguendo" exercise under individual State
law as to "neighbor law" in a law school class!

Fred F.