First Visit to Minden questions

Hi,

I'm a flat land glider pilot with 70 glider hours of which 35 are in a
standard Cirrus. I'm doing a week trip to Minden this winter as a
familiarization and glider checkout adventure. SoaringNV.

There is almost endless info available on the web, and I'll get help
from an instructor, but here are a few random questions.

Unless there is wave, I'm thinking of just getting high tows maybe 6k
AGL. This will put me near the Pine Nut range, or a little above the
big ridge to the west. If there is no lift I won't be able to wander
much.

1. At this altitude, with flight durations of a half hour, should I be
contacting NorCal? Or is that something that one does when the flight
is higher, longer duration, or closer to Reno?

2. How much wind does it take against these ridges to hold altitude
using ridge lift?

3. Off topic, but I might drive from Minden to visit Williams Soaring
Center. I was raised in Vermont driving to ski areas, but the
Sierra's seem pretty intense. Any recommended route? Any way to
check driving conditions and to know if my rental "economy" car will
suffice?

4. Any other advice welcome.

.... Aaron

3. Off topic, but I might drive from Minden to visit Williams Soaring
Center. *I was raised in Vermont driving to ski areas, but the
Sierra's seem pretty intense. *Any recommended route? *Any way to
check driving conditions and to know if my rental "economy" car will
suffice?

4. Any other advice welcome.

... Aaron

Always check road conditions over the Sierras, 80 is a nice, wide
super highway over the Sierras. If there is snow closures take 70
which is lower, brings you out at Oroville, just East of Williams.

Hi Aaron,

SoaringNV will answer all your questions about flying in the area.
Unless you are flying above 18,000 feet in a wave window, you will not
need to interact with NorCal.

I live in Sacramento and have been driving over the Sierra to fly in
the winter for twenty years. My advice, rent a four wheel drive
vehicle. Conditions change rapidly in the mountains. The Sierra are
not the little mole hills that you have on the east coast. Highways
50 and 80 are the major trans-sierra routes. With four wheel drive I
have never been blocked from crossing the mountains, even in the
middle of mild snow storms.

Enjoy.

Guy

Aaron,

You probably know this, but on the off chance you don't understand why
the previous two posters were stressing driving in snow in the Sierras
to someone raised in ski country back East, google the Donner Party.

-John

On Dec 30, 9:30 am, akiley wrote:
Hi,

I'm a flat land glider pilot with 70 glider hours of which 35 are in a
standard Cirrus. I'm doing a week trip to Minden this winter as a
familiarization and glider checkout adventure. SoaringNV.

[.. snip ..]

3. Off topic, but I might drive from Minden to visit Williams Soaring
Center. I was raised in Vermont driving to ski areas, but the
Sierra's seem pretty intense. Any recommended route? Any way to
check driving conditions and to know if my rental "economy" car will
suffice?

4. Any other advice welcome.

... Aaron

On Dec 30, 6:30*am, akiley wrote:
Hi,

I'm a flat land glider pilot with 70 glider hours of which 35 are in a
standard Cirrus. *I'm doing a week trip to Minden this winter as a
familiarization and glider checkout adventure. *SoaringNV.

There is almost endless info available on the web, and I'll get help
from an instructor, but here are a few random questions.

Unless there is wave, I'm thinking of just getting high tows maybe 6k
AGL. *This will put me near the Pine Nut range, or a little above the
big ridge to the west. *If there is no lift I won't be able to wander
much.

1. At this altitude, with flight durations of a half hour, should I be
contacting NorCal? *Or is that something that one does when the flight
is higher, longer duration, or closer to Reno?

2. How much wind does it take against these ridges to hold altitude
using ridge lift?

3. Off topic, but I might drive from Minden to visit Williams Soaring
Center. *I was raised in Vermont driving to ski areas, but the
Sierra's seem pretty intense. *Any recommended route? *Any way to
check driving conditions and to know if my rental "economy" car will
suffice?

4. Any other advice welcome.

... Aaron

Aaron

Soaring NV will explain the jet routes into Reno. No contact is
required local to Minden, but if you get above 12,000' you should
monitor their freq. Reno tower is friendly and very familiar with our
ops. Ridge soaring takes 10 knots of wind. Occasionally an east wind
sets up allowing an easy run up and down the Carson Range with a view
of Lake Tahoe. A strong west wind will allow soaring above the
Heavenly Ski area. The Pinenut mountains are more difficult to ridge
soar and require thermals to jump the gaps. You can hold on Mt Siegel
(Pinenuts) all day with a light west wind.

Rent a little 4x4 and avoid the chain gang.

Rick Walters

At 15:59 30 December 2011, guy wrote:
Hi Aaron,

SoaringNV will answer all your questions about flying in the area.
Unless you are flying above 18,000 feet in a wave window, you will not
need to interact with NorCal.

I live in Sacramento and have been driving over the Sierra to fly in
the winter for twenty years. My advice, rent a four wheel drive
vehicle. Conditions change rapidly in the mountains. The Sierra are
not the little mole hills that you have on the east coast. Highways
50 and 80 are the major trans-sierra routes. With four wheel drive I
have never been blocked from crossing the mountains, even in the
middle of mild snow storms.

Enjoy.

Guy
arron,
if your used to flat lands,and go to minden there is an alitude
difference ,so be prepared to have oxygen on be fore take off,they surply
encomomisers,so oxygen lasts ok,if in the famous minden wave you will
climb quicker than uk wave at least,and over 10k before you know!,i
certainly beneifited from early oxygen,enjoy minden,best gliding holiday
ever,
john [uk]

On Dec 30, 11:56*am, Rick Walters wrote:
On Dec 30, 6:30*am, akiley wrote:



Hi,

I'm a flat land glider pilot with 70 glider hours of which 35 are in a
standard Cirrus. *I'm doing a week trip to Minden this winter as a
familiarization and glider checkout adventure. *SoaringNV.

There is almost endless info available on the web, and I'll get help
from an instructor, but here are a few random questions.

Unless there is wave, I'm thinking of just getting high tows maybe 6k
AGL. *This will put me near the Pine Nut range, or a little above the
big ridge to the west. *If there is no lift I won't be able to wander
much.

1. At this altitude, with flight durations of a half hour, should I be
contacting NorCal? *Or is that something that one does when the flight
is higher, longer duration, or closer to Reno?

2. How much wind does it take against these ridges to hold altitude
using ridge lift?

3. Off topic, but I might drive from Minden to visit Williams Soaring
Center. *I was raised in Vermont driving to ski areas, but the
Sierra's seem pretty intense. *Any recommended route? *Any way to
check driving conditions and to know if my rental "economy" car will
suffice?

4. Any other advice welcome.

... Aaron

Aaron

Soaring NV will explain the jet routes into Reno. No contact is
required local to Minden, but if you get above 12,000' you should
monitor their freq. Reno tower is friendly and very familiar with our
ops. Ridge soaring takes 10 knots of wind. Occasionally an east wind
sets up allowing an easy run up and down the Carson Range with a view
of Lake Tahoe. A strong west wind will allow soaring above the
Heavenly Ski area. The Pinenut mountains are more difficult to ridge
soar and require thermals to jump the gaps. You can hold on Mt Siegel
(Pinenuts) all day with a light west wind.

Rent a little 4x4 and avoid the chain gang.

Rick Walters

Thanks for the advice Rick,

The Pine Nut ridge also seems like it might not yield much altitude to
get back to Minden, especially if you're working a headwind and not
much above the ridge.

Is there any hope of a weak thermal or two in January? ... akiley

On Dec 30, 11:49*am, jcarlyle wrote:
Aaron,

You probably know this, but on the off chance you don't understand why
the previous two posters were stressing driving in snow in the Sierras
to someone raised in ski country back East, google the Donner Party.

-John

On Dec 30, 9:30 am, akiley wrote:

Hi,

I'm a flat land glider pilot with 70 glider hours of which 35 are in a
standard Cirrus. *I'm doing a week trip to Minden this winter as a
familiarization and glider checkout adventure. *SoaringNV.

[.. snip ..]

3. Off topic, but I might drive from Minden to visit Williams Soaring
Center. *I was raised in Vermont driving to ski areas, but the
Sierra's seem pretty intense. *Any recommended route? *Any way to
check driving conditions and to know if my rental "economy" car will
suffice?

4. Any other advice welcome.

... Aaron

Yes, thanks for the tip. I drove with family from the bay area to
Truckee several years back. I still have a bag of chains in the
cellar we had to purchase. Probably a good thing to take with
me. ... Aaron

On Dec 30, 1:49 pm, akiley wrote:
Yes, thanks for the tip. I drove with family from the bay area to
Truckee several years back. I still have a bag of chains in the
cellar we had to purchase. Probably a good thing to take with
me. ... Aaron

You're welcome, Aaron. I was going to let Minden locals give you
advice, but maybe I can be of some help since I'm another flatland
pilot (PHL area) who went to Minden last March for 10 days (read - I
don't know nothin' much about mountain flying).

The advice above to get on oxygen before takeoff is very wise -
walking around at 4,700 feet when you're used to 200 feet is
"interesting", flying solo at 8 to 9,000 feet in very strong
turbulence (especially on tow) is even more so. Don't do it with a
built in handicap!

As far as thermals in winter at Minden, I don't know the right answer
to that. Certainly I was thermalling in something at 8,000 feet that
felt like small, turbulent thermals, but since they didn't move with
the wind I guess they were rotor related. One technique I used to
climb in them was to make a small circle with a steep downwind bank
and a shallow upwind bank. Another was to make a small figure 8
perpendicular to the wind and centered on the lift, again with steep
downwind banks and shallow upwind banks. This all occurred in the
vicinity of Minden on a wave day.

My main focus was learning how to get into the wave, and using it for
doing a Diamond climb. After that, I was taught the rudiments of using
the wave for doing XC, which I put into practice on a memorable solo
flight up and down the Carson Range and out to the Pine Nuts. My visit
was a lot of fun, and yours will be too, as long as you listen very
carefully to the instructors and heed all of their warnings. It's way
different than flat land flying.

One thing you probably know about, but won't fully appreciate until
you've been there, is the cold. After a climb to 27,000 feet I
couldn't feel my feet. Pretty much the same thing happened after my 3
hour XC flight, although I never went above 15,000 feet. I had on silk
socks, 2 pairs of wool socks, and moon boots made of thick closed cell
foam. Bring lots and lots of warm stuff, but you will definitely be
very cold!

-John

One thing you probably know about, but won't fully appreciate until
you've been there, is the cold. After a climb to 27,000 feet I
couldn't feel my feet. Pretty much the same thing happened after my 3
hour XC flight, although I never went above 15,000 feet. I had on silk
socks, 2 pairs of wool socks, and moon boots made of thick closed cell
foam. Bring lots and lots of warm stuff, but you will definitely be
very cold!

-John

Thanks again. All helpful. I'm in fairly good shape and don't smoke,
but 59 years old living at 800 feet I will probably want O2 in my
hotel room.

It would be great if I luck out and get a wave day, or even enough
ridge lift to stay up long enough to freeze.

I sometimes use those disposable packets that you put in your boots.
They keep some of your toes warm for a while. I also hear that fresh
socks right before you launch helps a lot.

SSA magazine just came out with a great article on wave flying
Minden. Aaron