If this is your first visit, be sure to check out the FAQ by clicking the link above. You may have to register before you can post: click the register link above to proceed. To start viewing messages, select the forum that you want to visit from the selection below. |
|
|
Thread Tools | Display Modes |
#171
|
|||
|
|||
Lancair crash at SnF
"Maxwell" luv2^fly99@cox.^net wrote in
: "Alric Knebel's Rack" wrote in message ... On Fri, 25 Apr 2008 11:06:42 +0000 (UTC), Bertie the Bunyip wrote: It's not so much the loss of altitude that will get you in this manuever. it's the probable loss of control trying to manuever around back towards the field. Firstly, in any emergency that hasnt been drilled, you will have a moment where you will be sitting there with your mouth open in utter disbelief of what has just happened. in fact, even if you have drilled for it you will still have this moment, but if it's been practiced the moment you begine to do something about it will be sooner coming. While you're sitting there wondering what's going on, the speed will be bleeding off. Not good. Nothing you do is useful. You very rarely even come up with a good idea, and when the blind squirrel principal does kick in (astoundingly, you've seem to even defeat random chance with your incompetence), you manage to cock it up so badly that what might have been a useful thing in a normal person's hands turns to low-grade fertilizer. Those are your two claims to fame. Being a complete flake who can't keep even the simplest of things on track for any significant period of time, and being an absolute moron when it comes to understanding what's useful to the piloting community, and implementing it. No, actually he has proven himself a failure and dozens of things, wannabe troll, pilot, motorcycle mechanic, and others. I think it might be fair to label him a "complete" or "master" failure. You can label me what you like, sunshine. You'll never get it. Bertie |
#172
|
|||
|
|||
Lancair crash at SnF
"Bertie the Bunyip" wrote in message .. . Big John wrote in : On Thu, 24 Apr 2008 15:40:55 -0700 (PDT), WingFlaps wrote: On Apr 25, 10:16 am, Stefan wrote: WingFlaps schrieb: (the stall is now damn close -better hope there's no significant wind) ... Now we add in the energy losses from having to accelerate with the wind and to glide speed. Arrrgh! Not the old "turn into downwind" legend again! Better work out your understanding of physics before publicly reasoning about turns. Try reading the statement again, here it is: "Now we add in the energy losses from having to accelerate with the wind and to glide speed." Now perhaps you would like to revise some physics and try to critcise it for us? I await your stumbling analysis of my words with mild amusement. Cheers ***************************************** Long time ago in the 30's I saw on a couple of occasions a Cub take off in a strong head wind 25+ mph and make a 180 degree turn to down wind. They then started losing altitude and mushed into the ground nose high. Any idea why? Pilot's said they had full throttle and proper RPM showed on engines until impact. Wind gradient. As they climbed, the wind would increase and they'd lose some airspeed until they were on the backside of the power curve.same thing would happen if you took off with strong tailwind in the first place. Also, the poorer climb angle even without the wind gradient would cause many to get the nose up a bit too much as well if they were not used to it. Bertie Turn your head 90 degrees and it will change the dynamics of all of it. That's the way wind tunnels work, child. |
#173
|
|||
|
|||
Lancair crash at SnF
Alric Knebel's Rack wrote in news:fuvp16
: On Fri, 25 Apr 2008 11:06:42 +0000 (UTC), Bertie the Bunyip wrote: It's not so much the loss of altitude that will get you in this manuever. it's the probable loss of control trying to manuever around back towards the field. Firstly, in any emergency that hasnt been drilled, you will have a moment where you will be sitting there with your mouth open in utter disbelief of what has just happened. in fact, even if you have drilled for it you will still have this moment, but if it's been practiced the moment you begine to do something about it will be sooner coming. While you're sitting there wondering what's going on, the speed will be bleeding off. Not good. Nothing you do is useful. You very rarely even come up with a good idea, and when the blind squirrel principal does kick in (astoundingly, you've seem to even defeat random chance with your incompetence), you manage to cock it up so badly that what might have been a useful thing in a normal person's hands turns to low-grade fertilizer. Those are your two claims to fame. Being a complete flake who can't keep even the simplest of things on track for any significant period of time, and being an absolute moron when it comes to understanding what's useful to the piloting community, and implementing it. Uh, yeh, sure.. Bertie |
#174
|
|||
|
|||
maxwell crashes agin..
"Maxwell" luv2^fly99@cox.^net wrote in news:3jcRj.58626$QC.41863
@newsfe20.lga: "Bertie the Bunyip" wrote in message .. . Big John wrote in : On Thu, 24 Apr 2008 15:40:55 -0700 (PDT), WingFlaps wrote: On Apr 25, 10:16 am, Stefan wrote: WingFlaps schrieb: (the stall is now damn close -better hope there's no significant wind) ... Now we add in the energy losses from having to accelerate with the wind and to glide speed. Arrrgh! Not the old "turn into downwind" legend again! Better work out your understanding of physics before publicly reasoning about turns. Try reading the statement again, here it is: "Now we add in the energy losses from having to accelerate with the wind and to glide speed." Now perhaps you would like to revise some physics and try to critcise it for us? I await your stumbling analysis of my words with mild amusement. Cheers ***************************************** Long time ago in the 30's I saw on a couple of occasions a Cub take off in a strong head wind 25+ mph and make a 180 degree turn to down wind. They then started losing altitude and mushed into the ground nose high. Any idea why? Pilot's said they had full throttle and proper RPM showed on engines until impact. Wind gradient. As they climbed, the wind would increase and they'd lose some airspeed until they were on the backside of the power curve.same thing would happen if you took off with strong tailwind in the first place. Also, the poorer climb angle even without the wind gradient would cause many to get the nose up a bit too much as well if they were not used to it. Bertie Turn your head 90 degrees and it will change the dynamics of all of it. That's the way wind tunnels work, child. Yeh, sure fjukktard. Bertie |
#175
|
|||
|
|||
Lancair crash at SnF
gregvk wrote in news:Xns9A8DE8C88AADEE817AC3D8380227
@127.0.0.1: Bertie the Bunyip wrote in news:fv3jdr$13s$14 @blackhelicopter.databasix.com: "Maxwell" luv2^fly99@cox.^net wrote in : "Alric Knebel's Rack" wrote in message ... On Fri, 25 Apr 2008 11:06:42 +0000 (UTC), Bertie the Bunyip wrote: It's not so much the loss of altitude that will get you in this manuever. it's the probable loss of control trying to manuever around back towards the field. Firstly, in any emergency that hasnt been drilled, you will have a moment where you will be sitting there with your mouth open in utter disbelief of what has just happened. in fact, even if you have drilled for it you will still have this moment, but if it's been practiced the moment you begine to do something about it will be sooner coming. While you're sitting there wondering what's going on, the speed will be bleeding off. Not good. Nothing you do is useful. You very rarely even come up with a good idea, and when the blind squirrel principal does kick in (astoundingly, you've seem to even defeat random chance with your incompetence), you manage to cock it up so badly that what might have been a useful thing in a normal person's hands turns to low-grade fertilizer. Those are your two claims to fame. Being a complete flake who can't keep even the simplest of things on track for any significant period of time, and being an absolute moron when it comes to understanding what's useful to the piloting community, and implementing it. No, actually he has proven himself a failure and dozens of things, wannabe troll, pilot, motorcycle mechanic, and others. I think it might be fair to label him a "complete" or "master" failure. You can label me what you like, sunshine. You'll never get it. Bertie You fail as a troll because nobody ever responds to your posts. Especially Maxwell. He's waaaaaaay too smart for that. i know. i feel so , foolish... He'd probably kick my ass in a game of hangman as well. Bertie |
#176
|
|||
|
|||
Lancair crash at SnF
On Apr 27, 3:43 pm, Bertie the Bunyip wrote:
Big John wrote : On Thu, 24 Apr 2008 15:40:55 -0700 (PDT), WingFlaps wrote: On Apr 25, 10:16 am, Stefan wrote: WingFlaps schrieb: (the stall is now damn close -better hope there's no significant wind) ... Now we add in the energy losses from having to accelerate with the wind and to glide speed. Arrrgh! Not the old "turn into downwind" legend again! Better work out your understanding of physics before publicly reasoning about turns. Try reading the statement again, here it is: "Now we add in the energy losses from having to accelerate with the wind and to glide speed." Now perhaps you would like to revise some physics and try to critcise it for us? I await your stumbling analysis of my words with mild amusement. Cheers ***************************************** Long time ago in the 30's I saw on a couple of occasions a Cub take off in a strong head wind 25+ mph and make a 180 degree turn to down wind. They then started losing altitude and mushed into the ground nose high. Any idea why? Pilot's said they had full throttle and proper RPM showed on engines until impact. Wind gradient. As they climbed, the wind would increase and they'd lose some airspeed until they were on the backside of the power curve.same thing would happen if you took off with strong tailwind in the first place. Also, the poorer climb angle even without the wind gradient would cause many to get the nose up a bit too much as well if they were not used to it. Bertie I think someone screwed up. As he turned, his airspeed would remain constant and in the turn he would begin to move sideways over the ground, and as he completed the turn his groundspeed would be much higher but his airspeed the same as before. The airplane has lots of time to make the shift in direction and it's not an instantaneous change in vectors. The sideways drift over the ground (which is mentioned here only as a reference for visual flying, not that the airplane cares about the earth's mass) might have caused him to think he was slipping big time, so he pumped in a bunch of rudder, skidding it badly and spun it in. And that's the reason we teach "Illusions Caused by Drift." Dan |
#177
|
|||
|
|||
Lancair crash at SnF
|
#178
|
|||
|
|||
Lancair crash at SnF
yeah but you got creamed in this thread! :-? :/ :') Þ lol
WingFlaps expressed precisely : Stefan was doing quite well actually, |
#179
|
|||
|
|||
Lancair crash at SnF
Just quick addition to Michaels comments about why the 180 turn is
much easier in the sailplane. 1. is we do practice it with some frequency. We seldom get by a Flight review with out doing at least one. 2.Guess what glider pilots typically do for about 50% of their flight. We call it thermalling but it is really a steep (usually 40 to 60 degrees) turn at the minimum sink speed which is usually only a few knots above stall speed, often in gusty conditions.. We also don't have stall warnings (as it would be going off continously during this maneuver) so we know the aerodynamic stall characteristics of the glider in a steep turn intimently. Brian CFIIG/ASEL |
#180
|
|||
|
|||
Lancair crash at SnF
I can see you missed the point entirely. By the way, Vy is never at best glide (it is above that ~69knots in a 172) -perhaps you would like to revise *what determines Vy? My point was to ilustrate the impossible turn with some concrete numbers instead of the handwaving If I read my aerodyamics book correctly my summary is Vy = the Best L/ D Speed Corrected for the affect of the engine running. The Correction is usually small. So Vy is often very close to the Best Glide speed. Brian CFIIG/ASEL |
Thread Tools | |
Display Modes | |
|
|
Similar Threads | ||||
Thread | Thread Starter | Forum | Replies | Last Post |
lancair crash scapoose, OR | gatt | Piloting | 10 | October 26th 06 03:34 PM |
Lancair IV | Dico Reyers | Owning | 6 | October 19th 04 11:47 PM |
Lancair 320 ram air? | ROBIN FLY | Home Built | 17 | January 7th 04 11:54 PM |
Lancair 320/360 kit wanted!!! | Erik W | Owning | 0 | October 3rd 03 10:17 PM |
Lancair IVP | Peter Gottlieb | Home Built | 2 | August 22nd 03 03:51 AM |