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Consequence of shifting carry-on luggage to checked luggage for aircraft weight



 
 
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  #1  
Old August 14th 06, 12:05 AM posted to rec.aviation.piloting
Mxsmanic
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 9,169
Default Consequence of shifting carry-on luggage to checked luggage for aircraft weight

Does the average weight calculation for passengers on commercial
flights include an allowance for their carry-on luggage?

The reason I ask is that, if the carry-on weight is shifted to the
hold, calculations that use an assumed average weight for passengers
and their carry-ons in conjunction with actual weighing for luggage in
the hold may produce estimates of take-off weight that are too high.

For example, if the average passenger has 10 lbs of carry-on and this
is incorporated into the estimated weight used for that passenger, and
he is suddenly required to check the carry-on, the assumed weight will
be too high by 10 lbs. This, combined with the 10 lbs extra of
measured weight in the luggage in the hold, would make the take-off
weight calculation 10 lbs high. Multiply that by hundreds of
passengers, and you have a weight that could be thousands of pounds
off.

Has anyone considered this? A too-high estimate could affect flight
characteristics and might also waste fuel (since more would be loaded
than needed).

--
Transpose mxsmanic and gmail to reach me by e-mail.
  #2  
Old August 14th 06, 12:09 AM posted to rec.aviation.piloting
Emily[_1_]
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 632
Default Consequence of shifting carry-on luggage to checked luggage foraircraft weight

Mxsmanic wrote:
Does the average weight calculation for passengers on commercial
flights include an allowance for their carry-on luggage?

The reason I ask is that, if the carry-on weight is shifted to the
hold, calculations that use an assumed average weight for passengers
and their carry-ons in conjunction with actual weighing for luggage in
the hold may produce estimates of take-off weight that are too high.

For example, if the average passenger has 10 lbs of carry-on and this
is incorporated into the estimated weight used for that passenger, and
he is suddenly required to check the carry-on, the assumed weight will
be too high by 10 lbs. This, combined with the 10 lbs extra of
measured weight in the luggage in the hold, would make the take-off
weight calculation 10 lbs high. Multiply that by hundreds of
passengers, and you have a weight that could be thousands of pounds
off.

Has anyone considered this? A too-high estimate could affect flight
characteristics and might also waste fuel (since more would be loaded
than needed).


Personally, I don't care about weight and balance. I care that I can't
take my contacts out on a transatlantic flight and that the TSA would be
shuffling through company secret information if I were to check it on a
business trip.
  #3  
Old August 14th 06, 12:41 AM posted to rec.aviation.piloting
Terry[_1_]
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 19
Default Consequence of shifting carry-on luggage to checked luggage foraircraft weight

Emily wrote:
Mxsmanic wrote:
Does the average weight calculation for passengers on commercial
flights include an allowance for their carry-on luggage?

The reason I ask is that, if the carry-on weight is shifted to the
hold, calculations that use an assumed average weight for passengers
and their carry-ons in conjunction with actual weighing for luggage in
the hold may produce estimates of take-off weight that are too high.

For example, if the average passenger has 10 lbs of carry-on and this
is incorporated into the estimated weight used for that passenger, and
he is suddenly required to check the carry-on, the assumed weight will
be too high by 10 lbs. This, combined with the 10 lbs extra of
measured weight in the luggage in the hold, would make the take-off
weight calculation 10 lbs high. Multiply that by hundreds of
passengers, and you have a weight that could be thousands of pounds
off.

Has anyone considered this? A too-high estimate could affect flight
characteristics and might also waste fuel (since more would be loaded
than needed).


Personally, I don't care about weight and balance. I care that I can't
take my contacts out on a transatlantic flight and that the TSA would be
shuffling through company secret information if I were to check it on a
business trip.


This is a good point. The TSA apparently doesn't understand that a
person/terrorist can smuggle fluids taped to one's leg, or other part of
the body, or even shove a vial/tube up their butt.
This type of over-reaction is typical of an agency that has no idea of
what to do, or in fact what the mission is.
  #4  
Old August 14th 06, 01:10 AM posted to rec.aviation.piloting
Paul Tomblin
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 690
Default Consequence of shifting carry-on luggage to checked luggage for aircraft weight

In a previous article, Mxsmanic said:
For example, if the average passenger has 10 lbs of carry-on and this
is incorporated into the estimated weight used for that passenger, and
he is suddenly required to check the carry-on, the assumed weight will
be too high by 10 lbs. This, combined with the 10 lbs extra of
measured weight in the luggage in the hold, would make the take-off
weight calculation 10 lbs high. Multiply that by hundreds of
passengers, and you have a weight that could be thousands of pounds
off.


Plus, with all that valuable stuff being checked, the TSA screeners will
steal about 10 pounds worth of stuff per passenger, making the weight
even further off.


--
Paul Tomblin http://xcski.com/blogs/pt/
You cannot run Windows innocently. Guilt of aiding & abetting, at
the very least, is automatic.
-- David P. Murphy
  #5  
Old August 14th 06, 01:39 AM posted to rec.aviation.piloting
Emily[_1_]
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 632
Default Consequence of shifting carry-on luggage to checked luggage foraircraft weight

Terry wrote:
Emily wrote:
Mxsmanic wrote:

snip

Personally, I don't care about weight and balance. I care that I
can't take my contacts out on a transatlantic flight and that the TSA
would be shuffling through company secret information if I were to
check it on a business trip.


This is a good point. The TSA apparently doesn't understand that a
person/terrorist can smuggle fluids taped to one's leg, or other part of
the body, or even shove a vial/tube up their butt.
This type of over-reaction is typical of an agency that has no idea of
what to do, or in fact what the mission is.


I thought about smuggling contact solution in my bra, but figured if I
were to get caught, they'd nail me under the pilot insecurity act. So I
figured I can either lose my certificates or lose my medical after I get
an eye infection. Not sure which is preferable.

You've got a point, though. Maybe someone should suggest to them that
they need to start giving all passengers rectal exams before they board.
  #6  
Old August 14th 06, 01:39 AM posted to rec.aviation.piloting
Crash Lander[_1_]
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 233
Default Consequence of shifting carry-on luggage to checked luggage for aircraft weight

Business class ticket sales will drop! Who's going to fly business class
when they can't do any business up there! (forgetting of course the people
that pay the extra just for the space and service. There are still people
who only use business class so they can continue to work whilst flying.)
Crash Lander

--
I'm not always right,
But I'm never wrong!
"Mxsmanic" wrote in message
...
Does the average weight calculation for passengers on commercial
flights include an allowance for their carry-on luggage?

The reason I ask is that, if the carry-on weight is shifted to the
hold, calculations that use an assumed average weight for passengers
and their carry-ons in conjunction with actual weighing for luggage in
the hold may produce estimates of take-off weight that are too high.

For example, if the average passenger has 10 lbs of carry-on and this
is incorporated into the estimated weight used for that passenger, and
he is suddenly required to check the carry-on, the assumed weight will
be too high by 10 lbs. This, combined with the 10 lbs extra of
measured weight in the luggage in the hold, would make the take-off
weight calculation 10 lbs high. Multiply that by hundreds of
passengers, and you have a weight that could be thousands of pounds
off.

Has anyone considered this? A too-high estimate could affect flight
characteristics and might also waste fuel (since more would be loaded
than needed).

--
Transpose mxsmanic and gmail to reach me by e-mail.



  #7  
Old August 14th 06, 01:40 AM posted to rec.aviation.piloting
Emily[_1_]
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 632
Default Consequence of shifting carry-on luggage to checked luggage foraircraft weight

Paul Tomblin wrote:
In a previous article, Mxsmanic said:
For example, if the average passenger has 10 lbs of carry-on and this
is incorporated into the estimated weight used for that passenger, and
he is suddenly required to check the carry-on, the assumed weight will
be too high by 10 lbs. This, combined with the 10 lbs extra of
measured weight in the luggage in the hold, would make the take-off
weight calculation 10 lbs high. Multiply that by hundreds of
passengers, and you have a weight that could be thousands of pounds
off.


Plus, with all that valuable stuff being checked, the TSA screeners will
steal about 10 pounds worth of stuff per passenger, making the weight
even further off.


Wouldn't it even out then? Maybe that's why they're not worried about it.
  #8  
Old August 14th 06, 03:32 AM posted to rec.aviation.piloting
Ron Lee
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 295
Default Consequence of shifting carry-on luggage to checked luggage for aircraft weight


This is a good point. The TSA apparently doesn't understand that a
person/terrorist can smuggle fluids taped to one's leg, or other part of
the body, or even shove a vial/tube up their butt.
This type of over-reaction is typical of an agency that has no idea of
what to do, or in fact what the mission is.




You've got a point, though. Maybe someone should suggest to them that
they need to start giving all passengers rectal exams before they board.


That will happen when a plot uses that method. I am not looking
forward to that day.

Ron Lee
  #9  
Old August 14th 06, 03:33 AM posted to rec.aviation.piloting
Ron Lee
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 295
Default Consequence of shifting carry-on luggage to checked luggage for aircraft weight

Emily wrote:
Has anyone considered this? A too-high estimate could affect flight
characteristics and might also waste fuel (since more would be loaded
than needed).


Personally, I don't care about weight and balance. I care that I can't
take my contacts out on a transatlantic flight and that the TSA would be
shuffling through company secret information if I were to check it on a
business trip.


Weight and balance was not important to the commuter plane that
crashed in the southeast a few years ago either. Add the reported
control system problem and multiple people died.

Ron Lee
  #10  
Old August 14th 06, 05:10 AM posted to rec.aviation.piloting
BTIZ
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 180
Default Consequence of shifting carry-on luggage to checked luggage for aircraft weight

Personally, I don't care about weight and balance. I care that I can't
take my contacts out on a transatlantic flight and that the TSA would be
shuffling through company secret information if I were to check it on a
business trip.


Wear your glasses. You can carry papers.. don't check company proprietary
information.
BT


 




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