2-33 to 1-26

People have mentioned spins when discussing the 1-26 both here and in previous
threads over the last couple of years. I got my rating in the 2-33, then spent
some hours in the 1-26, and have also recently had a handful of flights in the
Grob 103A.

I mentioned to the CFIGs/DPEs where I fly the comments made by people on this
group about the 1-26 spinning easily--this was met with various reactions,
though NO ONE agreed that the 1-26 spins "easily".

Those comments, accurate or not, prompted me to get at least some specific spin
training in the 2-33. I am 110 lbs, and usually put 40 to 60 more in the front
seat of the 2-33 when I fly it solo (and before anyone says anything, yes, I'm
one of the weirdos who, despite having my license for a year, still walks away
with a huge grin after flying the 2-33! sue me!!), but when we did the spin
training, I didn't add any weight, and the CFIG is around 185. It took some
doing to make it spin ... by that I mean that seeing what we had to do with the
controls, how long we had to wait, and the multitude of glaring signs that were
visible, audible, and perceivable by feel before it went into a spin, it's hard
to imagine how, in **that** aircraft, the signs of the impending stall alone
could be missed. I realize that's not the case for all aircraft, however.

The comment was made here on RAS: "We teach people in the 2-33 and then put
them into a 1-26 that spins at the drop of a hat with virtually little or no
spin training ... shame on us!" In the hours I've flown the 1-26 (summers in AZ
include some great-but-turbulent weather), I have not *unintentionally* come
close to stalling it, and no, I have not chosen to spin it on purpose.

To those who have stressed the importance of spin training *when talking about
flying the 1-26*, I would like to know specifics -- are you saying it stalls
and spins with little or no warning? If so, I'd like to hear details of
specific instances where this has actually happened to you ... not just the
blanket warning that applies to being aware of stalls and spins in *any*
aircraft...I'm assuming we always have that in mind.

Anyone? (Thanks in advance.)

D.A.L wrote:
All good advice except for the one mentioning spin recovery...'Be sure
you know proper spin recovery...'. You should know the signs of spin
entry and avoid one!

My one and only unintentional spin was on my first flight in a 1-26
(also my first flight in a single seat glider). I was thermalling and my
first sign of spin entry was noticing that the ground and the air had
swapped places. I may be better at recognizing warning signs now :-) but
it was quick. Recovery was a no brainer.

Tony V.
http://home.comcast.net/~verhulst/SOARING

On 19 Feb 2004 07:26:30 -0700, (Mark James Boyd)
wrote:

Next, at least for the PW-5, the trim in the middle of
the range means that on tow the glider will (for some CGs)
lift off too soon. Put the trim fairly far forward,
or have someone about your size/weight fly it and determine
the best initial trim. Safeside for trim a little too
nose down.

Good point, and not limited to just the PW-5.

Personal view: like everybody else, I set a known or guessed approach
speed trim for the day if I'm taking a winch launch. However, for an
aero tow I prefer an even more nose-heavy trim. I find I have better
control at lift off and during the initial climb-out if the glider is
nose heavy enough to need a little back pressure to maintain vertical
station behind the tug. In particular, this avoids the pop-up that can
be a precursor to PIO.

Disclaimer: this works for me, but ymmv.


--
martin@ : Martin Gregorie
gregorie : Harlow, UK
demon :
co : Zappa fan & glider pilot
uk :

Martin Gregorie wrote in message . ..

Trim? In a 1-26?

On 19 Feb 2004 17:20:17 -0800, (Lennie the
Lurker) wrote:

Martin Gregorie wrote in message . ..

Trim? In a 1-26?

I've seen one once. Never flown one. Couldn't possibly comment.


--
martin@ : Martin Gregorie
gregorie : Harlow, UK
demon :
co : Zappa fan & glider pilot
uk :

Martin Gregorie wrote in message . ..
On 19 Feb 2004 17:20:17 -0800, (Lennie the
Lurker) wrote:

Martin Gregorie wrote in message . ..

Trim? In a 1-26?

I've seen one once. Never flown one. Couldn't possibly comment.

Actually, Lennie has a good point. In typical Schweizer fashion, the
trim in a 1-26 is usually (always?) a joke.

Fortunately, unlike the 2-33, the 1-26 pretty much doesn't need much
trimming due to it's light elevator forces.

Just in case, it's worth checking that the trim control is in the full
forward position prior to takeoff, especially if the pilot is light
and you are not familiar with that particular 1-26 (since they may
vary quite a lot!).

Still a fun little glider to fly, all things considered.

Kirk

Kirk Stant wrote:
Martin Gregorie wrote in message . ..

On 19 Feb 2004 17:20:17 -0800, (Lennie the
Lurker) wrote:


Martin Gregorie wrote in message . ..

Trim? In a 1-26?

I've seen one once. Never flown one. Couldn't possibly comment.


Actually, Lennie has a good point. In typical Schweizer fashion, the
trim in a 1-26 is usually (always?) a joke.

I don't know if the 2-32 is typical, but when I was training in 2-32s, I
really noticed if the trim wasn't set properly. Sure, I could still fly
the glider, but it was very distracting.

Jeremy

It's posible to adjust the trim mechanism to make it work better, I have
done some spring changes to make mine work very well. It's kinda tough
because you have to take the nose cone off and fiddle around a lopt, and
it's not really that big of a deal - the only time I like to use the trim is
on tow when the towpilot get a bit frisky and forgets its a 1-26 on the end
of the rope and we're bouncing off 70 mph.

Otherwise, the stick forces are so light, it's no big deal, besides, you're
mostly conentrating on where you are going to find that next thermal.

Jim

"Kirk Stant" wrote in message
om...
Martin Gregorie wrote in message
. ..
On 19 Feb 2004 17:20:17 -0800, (Lennie the
Lurker) wrote:

Martin Gregorie wrote in message
. ..

Trim? In a 1-26?

I've seen one once. Never flown one. Couldn't possibly comment.

Actually, Lennie has a good point. In typical Schweizer fashion, the
trim in a 1-26 is usually (always?) a joke.

Fortunately, unlike the 2-33, the 1-26 pretty much doesn't need much
trimming due to it's light elevator forces.

Just in case, it's worth checking that the trim control is in the full
forward position prior to takeoff, especially if the pilot is light
and you are not familiar with that particular 1-26 (since they may
vary quite a lot!).

Still a fun little glider to fly, all things considered.

Kirk

Yes, there is trim in a 1-26. Just not a tremendous amount. Usually full
forward is about best L/D, and full back is a good thermaling speed. ( if
the trim is set well)

I have made the transition the other way. I originally trained in a L-23
then transitioned to a 1-26. After over 200 hours in a 1-26 I took a check
flight in a 2-33 while visiting another club. The 1-26 is much lighter on
the controls, and much more responsive. The 2-33 is much more like a truck.
Just use a light hand on the controls. By the time you get off tow and make
a few turns you will get a big smile on your face and see how much fun the
little bird is. I usually fly my pattern at about 50 mph. This and keeping
the yaw string straight will take care of all of the things that have been
written about spins on this thread. I have not found the 1-26 to have any
tendency toward spinning. I have done some spins at altitude intentionally
and recovery is quite quick and conventional. The point is that you do not
want to spin ANY ship in the pattern.

The model of 1-26 that you are going to fly will make a difference in the
amount of spoiler that you will have. I started in an E model with both
upper and lower surface spoilers (our club ship), and now own a B model, top
only so less spoiler, but it still comes down fine. The bird also slips
very well.

Before you ever fly the bird however the first thing that you should do is
to spend 1/2 the amount of a tow to join the 1-26 Association.
www.126association.org The Association supports the 1-26 and sponsors
the 1-26 Championships each year. The last few years a badge camp has also
been included at the Championships.

Once you get some flights in the little bird you will find it to be a
delight. Then consider chasing your badges in the 1-26. At least make sure
that you get your silver in it, however all your badges through diamond are
possible in the 1-26 and are encouraged by die hard 1-26ers.

Hope this helps.

Kevin R. Anderson
Soar 192
Eastern VP 1-26 Association



"Jeremy Zawodny" wrote in message
...
Kirk Stant wrote:
Martin Gregorie wrote in message
. ..

On 19 Feb 2004 17:20:17 -0800, (Lennie the
Lurker) wrote:


Martin Gregorie wrote in message
. ..

Trim? In a 1-26?

I've seen one once. Never flown one. Couldn't possibly comment.


Actually, Lennie has a good point. In typical Schweizer fashion, the
trim in a 1-26 is usually (always?) a joke.

I don't know if the 2-32 is typical, but when I was training in 2-32s, I
really noticed if the trim wasn't set properly. Sure, I could still fly
the glider, but it was very distracting.

Jeremy