enola gay and military aviation -serious

JMO:

The Enola Gay and Bockscar are valuable in that they remind us of how any
war becomes a vicious cycle, the upgrading of weapons as the war occurs, and
the willingness of even the "good guys" to justify increased atrocities to
win that war. Atrocities by good guys often occur when the proponent
becomes frustrated and/or tired. The dropping of the bombs was not the
first of atrocities committed by the good guys in that the Brits were quite
happy to massacre German innocents to win the war. The US generally
resisted such tactics until the B-29's had difficulties in high altitude
strategic bombing over Japan. Then they turned the B-29's into dump trucks
and adopted the Brit strategy. There is no question that the Japanese and
Germans committed far worse atrocities but they were the bad guys under
anyones definition. The only legitimate military targets were industry and
military. The good guys should have stuck to that.

To me, there are good guys and bad guys, and the good guys should never
become the bad guys. The massacre of innocents is never justified if
civilization wishes to retain its values. The problem is history. I think
society eventually will look back 100 years from now and shudder at the
horror of it all and that will be the lesson of the war. Maybe it will do
some good, but it will not be a good showing for the "greatest generation"
in this regard.

I personally think we should show a picture of the bomb with the Enola Gay
as well as pictures of the women, children, and old people who were burnt
up and terribly burned by the flash and radiation. I don't think it is
something that we should be proud of. I think we should acknowledge we did
what we did. To me the dropping of nuclear bombs is similar to Dachau, it
should be preserved as a reminder of how horrible war and or racial/ethnic
hatred becomes when it is allowed full rein. Both are symbols of atrocities
committed for somewhat different reasons, but both a product of war and/or
hatred.

I don't think military aviation can be honestly discussed unless there is a
recognition that warplanes are killing machines and sometimes the killing is
justified, sometimes not, sometimes its a grey area. The use of B-29's to
bomb strategic or tactical targets was certainly justfied, the firebombing
and nukes were not, both should be acknowledged and remembered (the same
goes for the Lanc).

I think it should also be realized by the techies in the group that the
smart bombs of today, which appear to be so good at protecting innocents by
enabling the military to strike effectively at military targets, can be, if
a situation gets out of hand, be equally effective in killing innocents when
wielded by frustrated and/or tired "good guys".

Al

To me the dropping of nuclear bombs is similar to Dachau, it
should be preserved as a reminder of how horrible war and or racial/ethnic
hatred becomes when it is allowed
full rein. Both are symbols of atrocities
committed for somewhat different reasons, but both a product of war and/or
hatred.

You cannot honestly compare Dachau to Hiroshima. Although Dachau was
technically only a concentration camp I assume you equate with the death camps
like Auschwitz-Birkenau. The entire reason for the bombs was entirely
different from the Final Solution of the Jewish Problem. If Hitler had won the
war he would not have stopped the camps but would have continued until every
last Jew, Gypsy and Slav under his control was dead. He wouldn't have stopped
there as Catholics and Christians of all sorts would have been next. When the
war ended we did not continue to kill Japanese in an effort to destroy their
race.

Any discussion of racial attitudes in the Pacific during WW2 has got to include
the Japanese point of view as well. They were then and remain today incredibly
racist and chauvinistic and those attitudes permeated every aspect of their war
making and administration of occupied territories. I will feel a lot more
sympathy for Japanese victims of WW2 when the entire nation acknowledges that
they started a war of aggression in China ten years before Pearl Harbor that
was rife with racist attrocities and that such attrocities were continued
throughout their war effort until VJ Day.

That being said the NASM is still obviously running scared from the last time
they exhibited the Enola Gay with an obviously anti American pro Japanese text.
This time they have erred with too much caution. The Enola Gay and the bomb
are inextricably linked and one cannot be understood without the other. The
NASM should have had the guts to display the aircraft and the bomb together
with a description of the results and estimates of Japanese and Allied lives
saved by the ending of the war. Both the Enola Gay and the Bomb are excellent
examples of American technology and ingenuity harnessed to single and worthy
cause. The American way of war is to approach it not as glorious but as a
piece of work to be done as efficiently and quickly as possible. The world is a
much better place because the US developed and used the weapon first. Had the
Japanese or German militarists developed them and used them first they would
not have hesitated to use them again and again.

John Dupre'

....start of mild rant...

On equating dropping the A-bomb with Dachau:
This type of liberal revisionist history drives me batty.
- The purpose of the Nazi use of the concentration camps was genocide -
to eliminate entire "undesirable" segments of the population, including
Jews, homosexuals, gypsies, etc. No military goal or purpose.
- The purpose of dropping the A-bomb (whether or not you agree with the
statistics used to make the decision) was to shorten the war and save
lives, both military and civilian, on both sides - both Japanese and Allied.
To attempt to equate the two does serious disservice to all the Allies
who fought and died in WWII as well as make yourself look seriously bonkers.

The only legitimate military targets were industry and military.
In case you've never bothered to research, both A-bomb cities were
legitimate targets; both had industrial and military targets in them, as
did Dresden. Get your facts right before you made such statements.

as well as pictures of the women, children, and old people who were burnt
up and terribly burned by the flash and radiation.
How about pictures of the women, children and old people who had been
killed by the Japanese during the past ten years or so? If you're going
to try and say we should only show the damage done by the bomb on the
Japanese populous, then you are being even more one-sided that what you
claim is being done in the current exhibit.
There is neither space nor it is appropriate to include perhaps a
million words and a few thousand pictures detailing everything that led
up to the abombing, including the Japanese atrocities, as part of the
Enola Gay exhibit. If you want all that, read any reasonable history of
WWII.

the firebombing and nukes were not [justified]
Another liberal revisionist history concept with no basis in reality.
You are just as dead from a bullet, a grenade or a dumb iron bomb as you
are from a firebomb or an A-bomb. There are just as many permanent
disabilities from a bullet, a grenade or a dumb iron bomb as from a
firebomb or an A-bomb. I had an uncle who was permanently disabled from
gas in WWI and a grandfather was was permanently disabled from a sniper
in the Battle of the Bulge; don't try and tell me that the only
legitimate victims were those in firebombings or A-bomb attacks.

a situation gets out of hand, be equally effective in killing
innocents when
wielded by frustrated and/or tired "good guys".
And whereas I agree a smart bomb is still a bomb, I do not agree with
your assumption that there were no legitimate military uses for either
firebombings or the A-bombs and that we only did each because we became
"frustrated" and "tired" and so became bad guys.

I suggest if you really believe we are such "bad guys" you can go and
live in North Korea or China for a few years; perhaps that will change
your views.

....end of mild rant...