GAO Report: GA Security Threat

Thomas Borchert wrote:

Robert,


One of them told me that his study of history included a curriculum
which reached the point of Hitler's rise to Chancellor of the Weimar
Republic. Next day, they were talking about Konrad Adenauer. [1]
Skipped that embarrassing war altogether.



This story has no basis in fact, at all. It is simply impossible that
you have experienced that, unless it was during the 50s - where we
didn't have Gesamtschulen. You're either a liar or you have been lied
to - sorry!

Okay, lessee, you, from the country that censored references to the
NSDAP, were not lied to, but we were.

And your proof is that he used the wrong term (in a different language)
for the school.

I'm sure this makes perfect sense to you . . .

I think he was talking about the Jap stragglers in Guam, Saipan and around Naha
and other places who took to the jungle and continued the war for years after
the surrender.

Warren

I felt safer in the middle of a Japanesse city at midnight (I was a
Provost Marshal as an additonal duty and we kept a presence 24/7) than
I do at high noon in Wshington, D.C.

Big John

On Wed, 19 Nov 2003 09:00:02 -0800, "Rich S."
wrote:

"Thomas Borchert" wrote in message
...

Yes. The point: If what's happening in Iraq is "winning a war", then
the definitions of "winning" must have changed dramatically since I
last checked.

You must be too young to remember when the Allies won WWII. Many Germans and
Japanese fought and killed Allied troops long after the war. Reconstruction
of the defeated countries and reformation of their governments and
infrastructure took years and a tremendous financial commitment. Much of
that investment was never repaid, even though the major Axis powers are now
well in the black.

It seems to me that you need to turn off the TV and spend some time studying
the real world.

Regards,
Rich S.

In 1946, off the Uss Princeton, I RON at Orote airfield, Guam and a Jap put a
few rounds into camp there. Didnt hit anybody but scuttlebut had it, there had
been some casulties previously.

Warren,


Sure, there were a few Japanese soldiers on various Pacific islands who
preferred to live like hermits than to come home to the humiliation of
defeat. But I have never seen any info that they killed any significant
number of occupying troops. The situation in Iraq appears to be very
different from the situation in Japan or Germany after WWII ended.

--
Kevin Horton RV-8 (finishing kit)
Ottawa, Canada
http://go.phpwebhosting.com/~khorton/rv8/
e-mail: khorton02(_at_)rogers(_dot_)com

"Whunicut" wrote in message
...
In 1946, off the Uss Princeton, I RON at Orote airfield, Guam and a Jap
put a
few rounds into camp there. Didnt hit anybody but scuttlebut had it, there
had
been some casulties previously.

Warren,


Sure, there were a few Japanese soldiers on various Pacific islands who
preferred to live like hermits than to come home to the humiliation of
defeat. But I have never seen any info that they killed any significant
number of occupying troops. The situation in Iraq appears to be very
different from the situation in Japan or Germany after WWII ended.

--
Kevin Horton RV-8 (finishing kit)
Ottawa, Canada

Warren..........

I think the operative term here is his use of the word "significant". It
wasn't his ass that got shot with a 7.7, so it ain't significant.

Rich S.

On Thu, 20 Nov 2003 18:01:35 +0100, Thomas Borchert
wrote:

This story has no basis in fact, at all.

I asked them what they studied of WWII. They said almost nothing.

It is simply impossible that
you have experienced that, unless it was during the 50s - where we
didn't have Gesamtschulen. You're either a liar or you have been lied
to - sorry!

I think my witness was in a Realschule in the '80's, and his integrity
was pretty much unimpeachable. What possible reason could he have had
for lying to me, when the question was meant to compare each other's
education, and the political feeling at the time was not nearly as
negative as it is today?

In turn, he seemed rather taken aback that I, in our studies of
European history in the public schools (such as it was), spent so much
time looking over WWII and the events leading up to it.

I also didn't find any Germans who could actually identify the
pictures on the coins of the Republic, except for a single 80-year-old
woman who remarked that she thought it was Adenauer.

Rob

--
[You] don't make your kids P.C.-proof by keeping them
ignorant, you do it by helping them learn how to
educate themselves.

-- Orson Scott Card

On Thu, 20 Nov 2003 22:25:25 GMT, Robert Perkins
wrote:

This story has no basis in fact, at all.

I asked them what they studied of WWII. They said almost nothing.

Urp! Should have written: "They said, 'Almost nothing.'"

Rob

--
[You] don't make your kids P.C.-proof by keeping them
ignorant, you do it by helping them learn how to
educate themselves.

-- Orson Scott Card

On Thu, 20 Nov 2003 18:02:24 +0000, Ian Graeme
wrote:

Okay, lessee, you, from the country that censored references to the
NSDAP, were not lied to, but we were.

And your proof is that he used the wrong term (in a different language)
for the school.

Oh, I'm using the correct terms. My interviewees were two men in their
early 20's, and our conversations, casual peer conversations that they
were, took place in late 1989.

One of them had attended a Gesamtschule in Berlin. The other had
attended Realschule in Wuertzburg. Neither professed any familiarity
with the NSDAP or Hitler's rise to power, or the goings on in Germany
between Hitler's Chancellorhood and the fall of the Reich.

No knowledge of Kristallnacht, no descriptions of concentration camps
or the fate of the enemies of the German State at the time. No study
of the reasons behind the popular support of "dem dritten Reich". No
comparison of the political system in power then, as opposed to the
1989. Nothing.

They just didn't study it. History began with the formation of the
BRD, there was a 17 year gap, anything before that was like studying
pre-Civil War days in the U.S., that is to say, cursory.

Rob

--
[You] don't make your kids P.C.-proof by keeping them
ignorant, you do it by helping them learn how to
educate themselves.

-- Orson Scott Card

On Thu, 20 Nov 2003 22:42:27 +0000, Robert Perkins wrote:
Oh, I'm using the correct terms. My interviewees were two men in their
early 20's, and our conversations, casual peer conversations that they
were, took place in late 1989.

Asking two guys during a "casual peer conversation" what they remember
from their school time is hardly a base to judge a country's school
system. Your report may be truthful, but it's not even worth mentioning.

BTW, the one from Berlin doesn't count anyway. Different world there

- Holger

"Rich S." wrote in message ...


Iraq under Saddam was not abiding by international law. In the terms of
their surrender in the Gulf War, they agreed to disarm and to prove they had
done so. Their refusal to comply with those terms resulted in the resumption
of hostilities to force compliance. The existance or non-existance of WMD
has no bearing on the situation.


Iraq under US control has destroyed no WMDs nor shown proof that any
were destroyed.

Are we in violation of those UN sanctions now?

--

FF

"C J Campbell" wrote in message ...
"Thomas Borchert" wrote in message
...
|
| I can't see much of a difference for the world with Saddam missing (he
| isn't, really, by the way). I am now absolutely certain - as most news
| watchers - that Saddam didn't pose nearly the threat that some were led
| to believe. There are no WMD, period.
|

Saddam's own military commanders all believed that Saddam had WMD. They have
told investigators that they still believe it.

I'm only aware of one such person and he made claims about nuclear
weapons which made it clear that he actually knew nothing about them.
If you can refer me to documented statements by several such
persons I'd appreciate it. Seriously. I suspect you've been
hosed.

--

FF