Blackbird Questions, Anyone?

I think Johnson did us a great favor. SR-71 sounds much cooler than RS-71.

"Jay Honeck" wrote in message
oups.com...

Supposedly, the original official designation should have been RS-71
for
"reconisance - strategic" but LBJ muddled the words and called it an
SR-71
when it was unveiled to the public...

No one wanted to correct the Prez so it stuck...True? False?

According to Bill, this is 100% true. He still laughs about it.
--
Jay Honeck
Iowa City, IA
Pathfinder N56993
www.AlexisParkInn.com
"Your Aviation Destination"

"Martin Hotze" wrote in message
...
"Jay Honeck" wrote:

I've made a list of questions to ask him when he gets here, but if you
have
any questions about the Blackbird, the U-2, or any other Lockheed
Skunkworks
stuff, post 'em here and I'll ask him for ya!


is it true that a SR-71 drone was once lost over hostile territory while
flying
a spionage mission? and is it true that several years later this drone was
given
back as a present during a state visit?

(story was told at the Pima Air and Space Museum in Tucson, AZ)

#m
--
Buck Fush!

IIRC according to a biography of the Skunk Works by Ben Rich a former head
of said Plant, it is. The drone was not actually an SR-71 but small scale
version which incorporated many of the SR-71s features including its shape.
It was launched by piggy backing off an SR-71 however and crashed over
Communist East Asia (I forget where and don't have the book to hand at the
moment) and part of the skin was given to an American delegation by a
Russian delegation who thought it was the current level of Stealth
technology at the time.

HTH and if you want more info. let me know and I'll and dig the book out.


--
Richard

I know the Brit military, and take it from me that they make better friends
than enemies. The Royal Navy is well respected by our guys.

Tom Clancy
A.B.T-C
20 February 2004


---
Outgoing mail is certified Virus Free.
Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com).
Version: 6.0.809 / Virus Database: 551 - Release Date: 09/12/2004

"Jay Honeck" wrote in message
oups.com...

Supposedly, the original official designation should have been RS-71
for
"reconisance - strategic" but LBJ muddled the words and called it an
SR-71
when it was unveiled to the public...

No one wanted to correct the Prez so it stuck...True? False?

According to Bill, this is 100% true. He still laughs about it.
--
Jay Honeck
Iowa City, IA
Pathfinder N56993
www.AlexisParkInn.com
"Your Aviation Destination"


Hehehe...cool.

Thanks!

Jay B

"Jay Honeck" wrote in message
ups.com...
1. According to Bill, they called it either Area 51 or "The Ranch".

"The Ranch" came about when Kelly Johnson was looking for somewhere on
behalf of the CIA to train pilots on the U2. It was called "The Ranch" to
make it sound attractive to the personnel who would be posted there despite
the fact it was a desolate place with small rocks being blown around as if
they were tumbleweeds.


--
Richard

I know the Brit military, and take it from me that they make better friends
than enemies. The Royal Navy is well respected by our guys.

Tom Clancy
A.B.T-C
20 February 2004


---
Outgoing mail is certified Virus Free.
Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com).
Version: 6.0.809 / Virus Database: 551 - Release Date: 09/12/2004

"Jay Honeck" wrote in message
ups.com...
Bill says that in all of his years there, he never got to see any
aliens.

He says the whole UFO legend began because the Air Force didn't want to
admit that they were sending mylar balloons (then new technology) over
the Soviet Union. When people found the remains of a balloon -- which
looked like sci-fi space suit material -- they denied knowing about
them, which, of course, simply inflamed the curiosity of everyone.

Bullsquat! You are part of the conspiracy, Jay.

The truth is out there!

--
Jim Xisher

IIRC according to a biography of the Skunk Works by Ben Rich a former head
of said Plant, it is. The drone was not actually an SR-71 but small scale
version which incorporated many of the SR-71s features including its
shape. It was launched by piggy backing off an SR-71 however and crashed
over Communist East Asia (I forget where and don't have the book to hand
at the moment) and part of the skin was given to an American delegation by
a Russian delegation who thought it was the current level of Stealth
technology at the time.

(If this answer came through twice, my apologies. I posted my first answer
using "Google Groups" which -- even in its latest incarnation -- is the
worst piece of sh*t I've ever used... But I digress.)

According to Bill:

This story is not true. No D-21 drones were ever lost over enemy territory,
despite the fact that they routinely crossed hostile countries. The drone
would be launched at altitudes of 70+ thousand feet, and would fly using its
ramjet at speeds of over Mach 3.5. Incredibly, it had a range of over
2200 miles.

When it got back over "friendly" territory (usually the Sea of Japan) it
would "kick out" its payload -- a 6' x 4' x 3' box -- which would float down
under three parachutes. The payload would then be snagged by a C-130, and
the D-21 would be destroyed remotely, blown into a million pieces.

The only accident Bill reported was when one of the three 'chutes failed to
open, and the payload dropped much faster than expected. The C-130 missed
catching it, and it impacted the sea. Two American destroyers in the area
began a search, with one finally putting a tow-line on the payload.
Amazingly, while under tow, the OTHER destroyer managed to cross the
towline, breaking it, sending the payload to the bottom.

The D-21 program was axed by Kelly Johnson after a fatal accident about 50
miles off the coast of California. Apparently the D-21 experienced an
"unstart" at release, causing it to settle back down on top of the mother
ship, breaking the SR-71 in two. One of the pilots was killed when he broke
his arm while ejecting, which tore his flight/space suit, which then filled
with water after he landed in the water, drowning him.

From that point on, D-21s were only launched from B-52s. They were attached
to a missile to accelerate them to speeds where their ramjet could ignite,
not unlike the recent NASA scramjet test -- although much slower. (If Mach
3+ can be called "slow"...)
--
Jay Honeck
Iowa City, IA
Pathfinder N56993
www.AlexisParkInn.com
"Your Aviation Destination"

The National Museum of the United States Air Force (formerly the United
States Air Force Museum) in Dayton Ohio has a YF-12.

Casey Wilson wrote:
(4) How many YF-12s were built. And do any exist today?

Usually when pressed about the fabled Aurora project (the purported
replacement for the SR-71, with rumored Mach 4+ capability), Bill gets sort
of vague, with a somewhat wistful look in his eye, and artfully changes the
subject.

Today, however, he mentioned something that caught my ear, and made me perk
up. I'm paraphrasing what he said, as I was writing as fast as I could
scribble, so I may have gotten a few details wrong, but here goes:

Apparently the Air Force built a huge and extensive air base in Tonopah,
Nevada, exclusively for the F-117 Stealth program. New hangars, testing
facilities, living quarters, runways -- all were constructed at huge
expense, in the absolute middle of nowhere for this ultimate Top Secret
stealth fighter.

And then the base was "abandoned". Without fanfare the F-117s were quietly
transferred to Holliman Air Force Base, where they remain based to this day.

What's at Tonopah now? No one will say for sure, but according to Bill,
that's where he thinks the fabled Aurora was tested. All he would say after
that was that they "apparently were having a lot of trouble with the
engines" -- the first time he has actually addressed the Aurora in "real"
terms.

When pressed further, he related the following story.

One night, while at his retirement home in Charles City, IA, he saw an
aircraft fly overhead late at night. It was making sequential sonic booms,
and the engine exhaust was sequential fireballs, the proverbial "rings on a
rope" contrail that the Aurora has been rumored to produce. He said he
couldn't determine the altitude due to darkness, but he said it passed over
so fast that he called a couple of his buddies who were still working in the
program, to see if what he was seeing was the real deal.

At this point, Bill changed the subject...again!

When pressed, all he would say is that he thinks the program is probably
moribund, and that you "just don't hear much about Aurora anymore..." He
had a strange, wistful look in his eye...
--
Jay Honeck
Iowa City, IA
Pathfinder N56993
www.AlexisParkInn.com
"Your Aviation Destination"
"Jay Honeck" wrote in message
ups.com...
Bill says that in all of his years there, he never got to see any
aliens.

He says the whole UFO legend began because the Air Force didn't want to
admit that they were sending mylar balloons (then new technology) over
the Soviet Union. When people found the remains of a balloon -- which
looked like sci-fi space suit material -- they denied knowing about
them, which, of course, simply inflamed the curiosity of everyone.
--
Jay Honeck
Iowa City, IA
Pathfinder N56993
www.AlexisParkInn.com
"Your Aviation Destination"

Hehehe...cool.

Thanks!

Other cool tidbits from Bill:

Regarding the D-21 drone: They had many problems with the engine
"unstarting" which, in Bill's opinion, could have easily been solved by
installing a "translating spike" in the engine intake, like on the SR-71
itself. The D-21's engine designer was opposed to the plan, which would
have added weight to the drone, and successfully argued against it --
resulting in the unnecessary loss of several drones, and a couple of SR-71s.

The P-80 program. In 1944 they sent 5 P-80s, built virtually by hand,
from scratch at the Skunkworks (their first plane was the P-38 Lightning,
BTW), to Italy. Because the engines only lasted about 5 hours before
destroying themselves, the pilots were instructed to go "fly the planes near
the enemy, but don't engage them." After each mission, the tail numbers
were changed, so that the Germans would believe that we had dozens of jet
fighters in theater!

Security. At Lockheed's Burbank, CA facility, they were testing the
SR-71's fuel tank and the explosive nature of the special fuel the Blackbird
used. They drained a tank, leaving fumes in it, and heated it to hundreds
of degrees, to simulate in-flight conditions. It, of course, exploded,
blowing the building to bits and starting a raging fire.

When the fire department responded, they ran up against the 10-foot,
razor-wire-topped fence -- and guards who would NOT let them inside.
Apparently no one had thought to give a security clearance to the fire
department -- even though it was LOCKHEED'S fired department! The firemen
were left to aim their hoses at whatever could be reached -- from outside
the fence. (According to Bill, the water caused extensive damage to their
testing equipment -- he was working with Honeywell at that time on the
Blackbird's autopilots...)

Fly by wire. The Blackbird had fly-by-wire capability AND conventional
push-rod and cable controls. Most of the time it was flown by the
autopilots, using the fly-by-wire servos, but the pilots liked knowing that
things were still hooked up conventionally if all the electrons failed.

The pilots. Several pilots achieved over 1000 hours -- at Mach 3 or
higher! This plane was USED, a LOT.

Flying the plane. It was dangerous. They lost 15 of them, primarily to
"pilot error." They lost several after refueling, when the pilots would
try to zoom to altitude, trying to get over weather or whatever. The
pilots would pull back too aggressively, which would cause the SR-71 to
pitch up violently. If the plane was going fast enough, it would break in
half right behind the cockpit. In one accident, the back seater hit the
water dead, while the front seat guy was badly injured. It was determined
that during the aircraft breakup, the right wing somehow hit the fuselage
where the "RESCUE" handles were located. When these handles are pulled, the
crew's straps are disengaged, so that rescuers can pull them out cleanly.

Apparently the wing triggered this mechanism, cutting the crew's straps.
This allowed them to tumble around the cockpit unrestrained. When the plane
pitched up, the pilots were exposed to first positive and then negative Gs.
In the meantime, the pilot's canopy came off, while the back seater's
remained in place. When the plane went into negative Gs, the pilot was
thrown clear, while the back seater was thrown violently into the canopy,
breaking his neck. On the SECOND tumble, the back seater's canopy came off,
and he, too, was thrown clear.

The parachute sequence was automatic, so he floated gently down, quite dead.
As Bill said "It took us quite a while to figure that one out..."

Killing the SR-71 project. We would have found the Scud missiles in
Iraq easily, if the Blackbird was still in service. Its cameras could look
obliquely at things, seeing into caves and canyons that couldn't be viewed
from outer space. In his opinion, Clinton killing the program was "putting
politics ahead of the Nation"...

Building the Blackbird today. He flatly says it couldn't be done. In
the time it took to build the SR-71 (two years), we wouldn't even have the
first piece manufactured, thanks to increased "government oversight".

This is illustrated by the following. The P-80, from start to first
flight, took 90 days. The U-2, from start to first flight, took 6 months.
The SR-71, from start to first flight, took two years. Each plane had a
little more "government help" -- and took much longer to complete.

He said by the time he worked on the Stealth program -- which took years --
there were 50 government workers, doing what one guy did on the SR-71
program. He said the meetings that were held to satisfy all these guys
("Each one had to ask a question to justify his existence, which then
required a formal, written response that could take anywhere from ten days
to six months...") were taking most of his time by the time he retired.

The danger of working on the program. Many pilots were lost in this
super secret program, without fanfare. But what few people remember is how
dangerous the plane was to work on. The hydraulic system, specially
designed for high temperatures, was operated at 3350 psi. The hydraulic
fluid, if it leaked, would vaporize as it came out at 650 degrees. By the
time the plane cooled down, the leak could no longer be found -- so it HAD
to be tested at high temperatures and pressure.

On one occasion, a technician had the system pressurized and heated, and
found the leak he was looking for. Stupidly, he instinctively put his
gloved hand over the leak, which instantly bored a hole clean through his
glove -- and his hand.

I meet some pretty interesting people at the inn -- but none more
interesting than Bill.
--
Jay Honeck
Iowa City, IA
Pathfinder N56993
www.AlexisParkInn.com
"Your Aviation Destination"

"Jay Honeck" writes:

Bill actually ran Area 51 for a few years, and was instrumental in the
development and deployment of the SR-71

Which was developed in the late 1950s I think, which makes ol' Bill
rather old indeed.