Instrument Rating tests

I understand it as the IRA (Instrument Rating Airplane) and FII
(Flight Instructor Instrument) tests come from the same question
bank. Does the FII test expire like the IRA does? I didn't see it in
part 61 unless I'm missing something. To me, it seems like none of
the tests expire for CFI?

On Feb 15, 8:03 pm, "kevmor" wrote:
I understand it as the IRA (Instrument Rating Airplane) and FII
(Flight Instructor Instrument) tests come from the same question
bank. Does the FII test expire like the IRA does? I didn't see it in
part 61 unless I'm missing something. To me, it seems like none of
the tests expire for CFI?

Take a look at 61.39. All knowledge tests expire in 24 months.

§ 61.39 Prerequisites for practical tests.
(a) Except as provided in paragraphs (b) and (c) of this section, to
be eligible for a practical test for a certificate or rating issued
under this part, an applicant must:

(1) Pass the required knowledge test within the 24-calendar-month
period preceding the month the applicant completes the practical test,
if a knowledge test is required;

They all expire. But the FOI test or holding a certificate
is required for a CFI practical.
When you take the FOI as part of the CFI or CFII written,
also take the ground instructor basic [any of the tests].
When you have your results, the local FSDO will issue a
ground instructor certificate when you present the
application and the FOI with a passing GI result. Then you
only have to show the GI certificate for any further
instructor tests. You can do this while you're still a
non-pilot, no hours required.




"kevmor" wrote in message
oups.com...
|I understand it as the IRA (Instrument Rating Airplane) and
FII
| (Flight Instructor Instrument) tests come from the same
question
| bank. Does the FII test expire like the IRA does? I
didn't see it in
| part 61 unless I'm missing something. To me, it seems
like none of
| the tests expire for CFI?
|

On Feb 15, 5:03 pm, "kevmor" wrote:
I understand it as the IRA (Instrument Rating Airplane) and FII
(Flight Instructor Instrument) tests come from the same question
bank. Does the FII test expire like the IRA does? I didn't see it in
part 61 unless I'm missing something. To me, it seems like none of
the tests expire for CFI?

As others have said, it does expire. If you take the IRA also take the
IGI exam and get your IGI rating for free (assuming you already have
FOI).
The one difference between CFI knowledge tests and pilot knowledge
tests is that you do not need an endorsement to take the CFI knowledge
tests, just walk in and take them. I never figured out why the FAA
requires endorsements for the pilot knowledge exams.

-Robert, CFII

Forty years ago, ACME and other schools were having their
students and instructors take the tests [all of them] dozens
of times. The tests were of limited numbers and the schools
were having student memorize the questions and answers.
Rated pilots and instructors were also taking the tests
multiple times.

Requiring endorsements and also yanking certificates if a
pilot failed the test for a rating already held was used to
keep the work load down. [Test were all given by the FAA
then and they were "free."] Later lawsuits by the schools
made the FAA publish the question bank [but not the
answers].


"Robert M. Gary" wrote in message
ups.com...
| On Feb 15, 5:03 pm, "kevmor" wrote:
| I understand it as the IRA (Instrument Rating Airplane)
and FII
| (Flight Instructor Instrument) tests come from the same
question
| bank. Does the FII test expire like the IRA does? I
didn't see it in
| part 61 unless I'm missing something. To me, it seems
like none of
| the tests expire for CFI?
|
| As others have said, it does expire. If you take the IRA
also take the
| IGI exam and get your IGI rating for free (assuming you
already have
| FOI).
| The one difference between CFI knowledge tests and pilot
knowledge
| tests is that you do not need an endorsement to take the
CFI knowledge
| tests, just walk in and take them. I never figured out why
the FAA
| requires endorsements for the pilot knowledge exams.
|
| -Robert, CFII
|

I think I read somewhere that the FOI test doesn't expire, is that
true? I passed the FOI already, if I pass just the FOI and IGI, you
can get the IGI rating from the FSDO? Is the IGI test is from the
same question bank as the IRA? Is the IGI test required to be a CFII
flight instructor? Would I have any benefit of taking the IGI test if
I most likely won't be taking the CFI practical test in two years?

Thanks all,
-Kevin

On Feb 16, 8:03 am, "Robert M. Gary" wrote:
On Feb 15, 5:03 pm, "kevmor" wrote:

I understand it as the IRA (Instrument Rating Airplane) and FII
(Flight Instructor Instrument) tests come from the same question
bank. Does the FII test expire like the IRA does? I didn't see it in
part 61 unless I'm missing something. To me, it seems like none of
the tests expire for CFI?

As others have said, it does expire. If you take the IRA also take the
IGI exam and get your IGI rating for free (assuming you already have
FOI).
The one difference between CFI knowledge tests and pilot knowledge
tests is that you do not need an endorsement to take the CFI knowledge
tests, just walk in and take them. I never figured out why the FAA
requires endorsements for the pilot knowledge exams.

-Robert, CFII

On Feb 16, 12:58 pm, "kevmor" wrote:
I think I read somewhere that the FOI test doesn't expire, is that
true? I passed the FOI already, if I pass just the FOI and IGI, you
can get the IGI rating from the FSDO? Is the IGI test is from the
same question bank as the IRA? Is the IGI test required to be a CFII
flight instructor? Would I have any benefit of taking the IGI test if
I most likely won't be taking the CFI practical test in two years?

I"m pretty sure the FOI expires but you can work around that, just get
your IGI (or AGI, etc).
Once you have both your FOI and your IGI in hand, just walk into the
FSDO with a completed 8710 and they will hand you an IGI ticket, no
questions asked.
The IGI test is from the same bank as the FOI (although there may be a
couple extra questions in the bank, but I think that's just the AGI).
The benefits of the IGI are 1) you don't have to show your FOI test to
your PI 2) Looks good on the resume and 3) It allows you to teach
ground school where not all pilots are fixed wing. It is not required
just to get your CFII.
Taking the CFI practical will not affect the IGI or FOI tests but
perhaps you meant CFII?
Since the IGI and AGI are good for life there isn't much reason not to
get them other than the $80 testing fee.
-Robert

On Feb 16, 11:26 am, "Jim Macklin"
wrote:
Forty years ago, ACME and other schools were having their
students and instructors take the tests [all of them] dozens
of times. The tests were of limited numbers and the schools
were having student memorize the questions and answers.

I'll admit to having done that a few times. However, I didn't need to
take the test dozens of times to do it, the bank of questions is
available on the internet and ASA, etc provide all the answers already
(I know you know this). It doesn't seem like there is much benefit of
taking a test over and over to memorize the questions when the
questions are available on the internet.
Nowadays with study software you can generate tests with the same
exact questions as the real test as many times as you like and take
them on your PC.

-Robert, CFII

"Jim Macklin" wrote in message
...
Forty years ago, ACME and other schools were having their
students and instructors take the tests [all of them] dozens
of times. The tests were of limited numbers and the schools
were having student memorize the questions and answers.
Rated pilots and instructors were also taking the tests
multiple times.

That's essentially the way the public schools operate today - rote
memorization.

Robert M. Gary wrote
I'll admit to having done that a few times. However, I didn't need to
take the test dozens of times to do it, the bank of questions is
available on the internet and ASA, etc provide all the answers already
(I know you know this). It doesn't seem like there is much benefit of
taking a test over and over to memorize the questions when the
questions are available on the internet.

But that was not the case back in the '60s and '70s. The FAA had IIRC,
4-5 individual tests with 40 questions each. There was a company in Texas
that hired people to take the tests just to memorize the questions. I
recall buying their booklet with all of the tests in it. I debriefed all
of my students taking the tests for any changes.

No one ever worked out the problems, if you had test "A", the answer to
the flight planning problem was 2:47. :-)

What was the name of that company and their test guide ?????

Bob Moore