Friday 072707 in Oshkosh Pt 1 - the Raptor [01/30] - "F22 lifting off 18 after very short takeoff roll.jpg" yEnc (0/1)

Shiver..
Thank you for your kind words of support...
I don't think that the newbies or indeed anyone else is here to destroy the
group... I am quite sure that 99% of them are sincere in their desires to
be a part of the group and further improve upon it. Plane Noise, Clearbare
and a few others who's names escape me are no more bent upon this groups
destruction then you or I are bent on destroying the needle point newsgroup.

Have many of the newer particpants been rude and insulting? F---ing right
many of them have! Could a few of them benefit from a course in basic
manners? Damn straight they could!!! But these same charges could be laid
upon
a few of us who have been here for several years. We bristle and bar our
fangs the moment anyone even mentions the dreaded yEnc, and certainly our
remarks have been just as course and tactless as those who favor yEnc.

Many of the newer arrivals have remarked that we are stuck in the past with
our steadfast refusal accept the dreaded yEnc. Which rightly, or wrongly it
could be argued we are. In this latest episode of the yEnc debates I would
argue that the blame for the heated exchanges is very much a shared blame.
Look at my exchange with Dave if you want an example. He made what I
considered some rude snide remarks without reading any of my previous
comments. I in turn told him to F$%^ Off and then to compound things even
further I miss read two of his replies. So who is at fault? Yes it could
be said well if he had read my earlier statements there would have been no
need for the snide remarks. On the other hand if I had CLEARLY read his
responses perhaps it would not have heated up so fast. Two wrongs or???

One of the things that makes this Newsgroup a little bit different from any
other NG is that it is aimed at a mix of amatuer and pro aviation photo
geeks. It also by design intended to appeal to newbies who have just
discovered the wonderfull world of Newsgroups. Which is one of the biggest
reasons for my own opposition to yEnc which may confound and confuse newbies
who maybe a little shy about asking questions. When my e-mail address was
public I was constantly inundated by questions about this group,
unfortunatly in recent years due to the spam issues I have had to change to
an annoymous E-mail status. But every now and again some one will track me
down and ask a question. With the current battles though everthing has
changed and I would be willing to bet that the number of lurkers has dropped
dramaticaly. After all if you discovered a really cool sounding Newsgroup
that
appealed to you, would you want to listen to a bunch of silly twits argue
about a subject that you do not understand or care about? Then to make
matters worse the level of hostility that the waring sides are displaying
makes it seem unwise to even broach the question about what is this yEnc
thing that they are arguing about. So again why would you even want to join
such a NG, and hang around?

This group like most of the others out there has an incredible number of
lurkers, I would venture to say that it could be as many a COUPLE OF
THOUSAND. Though we will never know for sure the exact number because for
their own reasons they choose not make their presence known. Do you
remember when I asked the simple question "Where is everyone from?" Look at
the HUNDREDS who responded!!! Many also included little bits of information
about themselves, and reading their tales I thought was fascinating. I
have even heard a couple of unconfirmed tales that our group has or had a
few celebrities hidden in our midst. Again though we will never know and
one of the really cool things about the NGs is that you can hide yourself so
easily.

Which brings me to my final point...
One of my biggest concerns right now is not the question of to yEnc or not
to yEnc, instead it this the very argument! Basically we are spending so
much time and energy arguing about that it is turning people away. We are
also doing an enormous disservice to some bigger issues and events than a
posting method. Last week we lost two great air show performers, and though
some did comment upon the loss. Many of us where so wrapped up in our petty
differences that we barely acknowledged the tragedy. For my part I feel
rather a shamed of myself for that...

Here is a challenge to everyone who responds to this long winded reply of
mine.
Post an image with your reply and let's see what the group produces.

Attached is an image from an air show that Jim Leroy flew at in West
Virginia a few years ago... It was taken by me, but is not copyrighted...

Andrew




"shiver" wrote in message
...
TO THE GROUP.

You know folks this has always been a friendly group.

Oh yes a few agitators show up from time to time just like they have
this past few weeks.

But on the average it has always been a friendly group.

It's surprising that in the past few weeks just two or three
johnny come latelys have shown up with a desire to destroy this group.

HEY - LET'S BE HONEST.

They must be here to destroy it because they certainly are not
acting like reponsible adults who wish to build it up.

NOW ARE THEY.?????

I'll bet that these little assholes have jobs and that on the first day
of the job they were told there were certain standards and that they
were expected to follow those standards or else.

I'll bet they raised their children in a household that has certain
standards and that they expected those children to follow those
standards.

I'll bet they sleep beside a woman who has certain standards that have
to be met.... or else.

If they joined a social club, sports club, or any organization there
would be certain standards that they would be expected to adhere too.

Or else they would be told to leave and not come back.

In reality if people don't follow certain standards they get fired from
their jobs, divorced by their wives, or kicked out of the club.

But this is cyber space and instead of coming into the group and
realizing that the majority had settle the Yenc problem by declaring
this a Yenc free group years ago..... they have decided as a small
group
of relative unknowns and newcomers to be total assholes and disregard
the requests of the majority.

They have decided that their standards are more important than the
overall welfare of the group as a whole.

People like Andrew who has been here for ten years posting many many
thousands of pictures can't hold a candle to these guys.

People like Andrew are strictly dirt under their fingernails and the
way they behave is this group is more important than anybody and
everybody else.

But within a few months they will disappear just like every other
asshole who has tried to disrupt this group has disappeared.

They say they won't but we all know they will.

They will realize that no matter how much they mouth off, or try to ram
Yenc down everybodies throat that the following they are hoping for did
not materialize.

And when they realize they have few friends here and that the majority
is not responding to their postings in a positive manner they will go
and this group can get back to normal.

And to you the small group who are disrupting this newsgroup right now
I point out the obvious that you could have come in with your best foot
forward, telling us a little bit about who you are, what your interests
are. You would have seen that Yenc was frowned upon, and for all that
software you talk about I presume that if Yenc can be turned on it can
also be turned off.

Now that would have been the mature way to join the group, and if you
had done that you guys would have been immediately welcomed into this
little group of airplane enthusiasts with open arms.

Instead you have decided that for a short time you will be the assholes
of the group.

And guys I just can't understand why you take that attitude and act
this way when the absolute majority here would rather welcome you with
open arms as new friends.

But that's a decision you guys made.

SO GO AHEAD AND ENJOY YOURSELF.

When you get tired of little or no attention or response, you will
disappear just like every other asshole has disappeared before you,
because you will be ignored just like every other asshole before you
has been ignored.

You guys came here with no friends and you will leave here with no
friends. And that is a decision you guys made all on your own.