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UK planning to evict N-registered aircraft



 
 
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  #41  
Old August 30th 05, 09:19 PM
Bob Moore
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Jose wrote in news:

What are the first four freedoms? (and what are the ones after that?)


From a web site:

Air transportation is different to most other forms of commerce, not
only because of its international components but also because of its
governmental participation and the fact that many national airlines or
'flag carriers' are either in large part government owned, or, even if
not, are felt by the government to reflect the prestige of their nation.
In addition, nations often feel that they can only rely on their locally
owned carriers to have a commitment to providing service to their own
country. This is unimportant if you're a small country in Europe with
excellent road and rail service to other countries, but if you're a
remote island in the Pacific, air service is essential.

And so, for reasons variously good or bad, international air travel has
long been subjected to all manner of complicated restrictions and
bilateral treaties between nations. One of the main treaties that sets
out the fundamental building blocks of air transportation regulation -
the 'rules of the road' - is the Chicago Convention in 1944.

These 'building blocks' are widely referred to as the "freedoms of the
air", and they are fundamental to the international route network we
have today. There are five basic freedoms that are, more or less,
recognized by all countries, two others less widely accepted, and one
hardly accepted at all.

Each is subject to specific conditions, such as establishing the
frequency of flights, that are determined through bilateral agreements
between any two of the countries that are parties to the Convention.

First Freedom - The right to fly and carry traffic over the territory of
another partner to the agreement without landing. (Almost all countries
are partners to the Convention but some have observed this freedom
better than others. When the Korean airliner lost its way over Soviet
air space a few year ago and was shot down, the Soviet Union (among
other offenses!) violated this First Freedom.)

Second Freedom - The right to land in those countries for technical
reasons such as refueling without boarding or deplaning passengers.

Third Freedom - The right of an airline from one country to land in a
different country and deplane passengers coming from the airline’s own
country.

Fourth Freedom - The right of an airline from one country to land in a
different country and board passengers traveling to the airline’s own
country.

Fifth Freedom - This freedom is also sometimes referred to as 'beyond
rights'. It is the right of an airline from one country to land in a
second country, to then pick up passengers and fly on to a third country
where the passengers then deplane. An example would be a flight by
American Airlines from the US to England that is going on to France.
Traffic could be picked up in England and taken to France.

Sixth Freedom - The right to carry traffic from one state through the
home country to a third state. Example: traffic from England coming to
the US on a US airline and then going on to Canada on the same airline.

Seventh Freedom - The right to carry traffic from one state to another
state without going through the home country. Example would be traffic
from England going to Canada on a US airline flight that does not stop
in the US on the way.

Eighth Freedom - This is also called cabotage and almost no country
permits it. Airline cabotage is the carriage of air traffic that
originates and terminates within the boundaries of a given country by an
air carrier of another country. An example of this would be an airline
like Virgin Atlantic Airways operating flights between Chicago and New
Orleans.

  #42  
Old August 30th 05, 09:25 PM
George Patterson
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karel wrote:

How so?


The situation that generated this discussion is called "cabotage." As Bob Moore
posted, it is defined as "the carriage of air traffic that originates and
terminates within the boundaries of a given country by an air carrier of another
country. An example of this would be an airline like Virgin Atlantic Airways
operating flights between Chicago and New Orleans."

Since Amsterdam and Paris are in different countries, cabotage regulations would
not apply. Allowing this sort of flight is not unusual.

George Patterson
Give a person a fish and you feed him for a day; teach a person to
use the Internet and he won't bother you for weeks.
  #43  
Old August 30th 05, 10:57 PM
Chris
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"Bob Moore" wrote in message
21...
Jose wrote in news:



First Freedom - The right to fly and carry traffic over the territory of
another partner to the agreement without landing. (Almost all countries
are partners to the Convention but some have observed this freedom
better than others. When the Korean airliner lost its way over Soviet
air space a few year ago and was shot down, the Soviet Union (among
other offenses!) violated this First Freedom.)


Using commercial airlines to spy for the US is a bit underhand too and runs
the risk of being shot down.



  #44  
Old August 31st 05, 01:49 AM
ORVAL FAIRAIRN
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In article ,
"Chris" wrote:

"Bob Moore" wrote in message
21...
Jose wrote in news:



First Freedom - The right to fly and carry traffic over the territory of
another partner to the agreement without landing. (Almost all countries
are partners to the Convention but some have observed this freedom
better than others. When the Korean airliner lost its way over Soviet
air space a few year ago and was shot down, the Soviet Union (among
other offenses!) violated this First Freedom.)


Using commercial airlines to spy for the US is a bit underhand too and runs
the risk of being shot down.



When was that confirmed? Not that it has never been done (by all sides).
  #45  
Old August 31st 05, 09:26 PM
Robin Birch
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What is the origin of the term "cabotage"?

Robin

In message kh3Re.7748$wE1.6347@trndny01, George Patterson
writes
karel wrote:
How so?


The situation that generated this discussion is called "cabotage." As
Bob Moore posted, it is defined as "the carriage of air traffic that
originates and terminates within the boundaries of a given country by
an air carrier of another country. An example of this would be an
airline like Virgin Atlantic Airways operating flights between Chicago
and New Orleans."

Since Amsterdam and Paris are in different countries, cabotage
regulations would not apply. Allowing this sort of flight is not
unusual.

George Patterson
Give a person a fish and you feed him for a day; teach a person to
use the Internet and he won't bother you for weeks.


--
Robin Birch
  #46  
Old August 31st 05, 10:21 PM
Dave Butler
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Peter wrote:
Robin Birch wrote


What is the origin of the term "cabotage"?



Probably French, like many aviation terms


from http://www.dict.org:

2 definitions found for cabotage

From The Collaborative International Dictionary of English v.0.48 :

Cabotage \Cab"o*tage\, n. [F. cabotage, fr. caboter to sail
along the coast; cf. Sp. cabo cape.] (Naut.)
Navigation along the coast; the details of coast pilotage.
[1913 Webster]


From WordNet (r) 2.0 :

cabotage
n 1: the exclusive right of a country to control the air traffic
within its borders
2: navigation in coastal waters

  #47  
Old September 1st 05, 08:04 AM
Robin Birch
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Thanks, I was wondering whether it had anything to do with Cabot
(sailor).

Cheers

Robin

In message 1125523124.533860@sj-nntpcache-5, Dave Butler
writes
Peter wrote:
Robin Birch wrote

What is the origin of the term "cabotage"?

Probably French, like many aviation terms


from http://www.dict.org:

2 definitions found for cabotage

From The Collaborative International Dictionary of English v.0.48 :

Cabotage \Cab"o*tage\, n. [F. cabotage, fr. caboter to sail
along the coast; cf. Sp. cabo cape.] (Naut.)
Navigation along the coast; the details of coast pilotage.
[1913 Webster]


From WordNet (r) 2.0 :

cabotage
n 1: the exclusive right of a country to control the air traffic
within its borders
2: navigation in coastal waters


--
Robin Birch
 




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