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Another warbird lost



 
 
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  #1  
Old February 18th 07, 07:02 AM posted to rec.aviation.piloting
Kingfish
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Posts: 470
Default Another warbird lost

http://video.google.com/videoplay?do...06816384837258

This makes me nuts. An irreplaceable Corsair is lost in an air race -
a Super Corsair at that, which I think was one of a handful of R-4360
powered F4Us. Glad the pilot got out, but another piece of history is
gone, and for no good reason IMHO...

  #2  
Old February 18th 07, 07:32 AM posted to rec.aviation.piloting
vlado
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Posts: 16
Default Another warbird lost

On Feb 18, 12:02?am, "Kingfish" wrote:
http://video.google.com/videoplay?do...06816384837258

This makes me nuts. An irreplaceable Corsair is lost in an air race -
a Super Corsair at that, which I think was one of a handful of R-4360
powered F4Us. Glad the pilot got out, but another piece of history is
gone, and for no good reason IMHO...


Kingfish:
This aircraft was not a stock F4U by any means. It was not even a
factory built aircraft. It did not posses a serial number from the
manufacturer or Navy. This airframe was built completely from spare
parts and many custom made parts. Thus, as an airframe, it had no
history. If this helps your regret..............

  #3  
Old February 18th 07, 08:50 AM posted to rec.aviation.piloting
Grumman-581[_1_]
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Posts: 491
Default Another warbird lost

On 17 Feb 2007 22:02:22 -0800, "Kingfish"
wrote:
This makes me nuts. An irreplaceable Corsair is lost in an air race -
a Super Corsair at that, which I think was one of a handful of R-4360
powered F4Us. Glad the pilot got out, but another piece of history is
gone, and for no good reason IMHO...


Given the going prices for warbirds, if the data plate survived,
someone will "rebuild" the aircraft... A few years back, I stumbled
across Chino airport in SoCal... They have quite a few warbird
restoration shops over there... Spoke with one guy and he said that if
someone gives them a data plate, they can rebuild the rest of the
aircraft all around it from the blueprints that they had or could
get... Here's a link to a view of the airport... You can see quite a
few "spare parts" scattered around...

http://maps.live.com/default.aspx?v=...&scene=6482833
  #4  
Old February 18th 07, 10:59 AM posted to rec.aviation.piloting
G. Sylvester
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Posts: 58
Default Another warbird lost

Grumman-581 wrote:
Given the going prices for warbirds, if the data plate survived,
someone will "rebuild" the aircraft... A few years back, I stumbled
across Chino airport in SoCal... They have quite a few warbird
restoration shops over there... Spoke with one guy and he said that if
someone gives them a data plate, they can rebuild the rest of the
aircraft all around it from the blueprints that they had or could
get...


I saw an FAA safety seminar with a speaker from the local FSDO. He said
more and more companies are dispatching reps to accident sites to
confirm the S/N off of the data plate. The company determines if the
plane is a complete loss in their eyes separate from insurance
companies. The company certifies the plane when built and then certifies
the plane is a complete loss and effectively ending the plane's
(actually the S/N's) life. IIRC, Bell helicopter lists these S/N on
their website.

For these warbirds, I'm guessing most are probably in the Experimental
category so probably the dataplate doesn't mean too much other than from
the historical perspective but that is a pure guess.

Gerald
  #5  
Old February 18th 07, 04:16 PM posted to rec.aviation.piloting
Kingfish
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Posts: 470
Default Another warbird lost

On Feb 18, 1:32 am, "vlado" wrote:
Kingfish:
This aircraft was not a stock F4U by any means. It was not even a
factory built aircraft. It did not posses a serial number from the
manufacturer or Navy. This airframe was built completely from spare
parts and many custom made parts. Thus, as an airframe, it had no
history. If this helps your regret..............


Interesting, vlado. Where'd that info come from? I'm curious. Did that
plane have the R-4360 engine or the R-2800? Although, even without a
NSN it's still a Corsair (right?) - albeit without any military combat
history. Considering how many F4Us are airworthy these days, the loss
of even a flying parts kit still bums me out.

Gerald added: For these warbirds, I'm guessing most are probably in the Experimental
category so probably the dataplate doesn't mean too much other than from
the historical perspective but that is a pure guess.


IIRC all warbirds are Experimentals because no civilian type
certificate ever existed for them.

  #6  
Old February 18th 07, 04:38 PM posted to rec.aviation.piloting
Kyle Boatright
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Posts: 578
Default Another warbird lost


"Kingfish" wrote in message
ups.com...
On Feb 18, 1:32 am, "vlado" wrote:
Kingfish:
This aircraft was not a stock F4U by any means. It was not even a
factory built aircraft. It did not posses a serial number from the
manufacturer or Navy. This airframe was built completely from spare
parts and many custom made parts. Thus, as an airframe, it had no
history. If this helps your regret..............


Interesting, vlado. Where'd that info come from? I'm curious. Did that
plane have the R-4360 engine or the R-2800? Although, even without a
NSN it's still a Corsair (right?) - albeit without any military combat
history. Considering how many F4Us are airworthy these days, the loss
of even a flying parts kit still bums me out.

Gerald added: For these warbirds, I'm guessing most are probably in the
Experimental
category so probably the dataplate doesn't mean too much other than from
the historical perspective but that is a pure guess.


IIRC all warbirds are Experimentals because no civilian type
certificate ever existed for them.


The aircraft was powered by an R-4360. This crash happened in 1994...

I would guess that there are more flying Corsairs today than there were
then, due to various restoration project coming to fruition. In today's
high dollar warbird scene, it is economically feasable to restore (or
remanufacture) projects that were not viable projects 10 or 20 years ago.

KB


  #7  
Old February 18th 07, 11:12 PM posted to rec.aviation.piloting
vlado
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Posts: 16
Default Another warbird lost

On Feb 18, 3:59�am, "G. Sylvester" wrote:
Grumman-581 wrote:
Given the going prices for warbirds, if the data plate survived,
someone will "rebuild" the aircraft... A few years back, I stumbled
across Chino airport in SoCal... They have quite a few warbird
restoration shops over there... Spoke with one guy and he said that if
someone gives them a data plate, they can rebuild the rest of the
aircraft all around it from the blueprints that they had or could
get...


I saw an FAA safety seminar with a speaker from the local FSDO. *He said
more and more companies are dispatching reps to accident sites to
confirm the S/N off of the data plate. *The company determines if the
plane is a complete loss in their eyes separate from insurance
companies. The company certifies the plane when built and then certifies
the plane is a complete loss and effectively ending the plane's
(actually the S/N's) life. *IIRC, Bell helicopter lists these S/N on
their website.

For these warbirds, I'm guessing most are probably in the Experimental
category so probably the dataplate doesn't mean too much other than from
the historical perspective but that is a pure guess.

Gerald


P-51D Mustangs are Limited Category
(except those modified for racing).
Kevin (the pilot) told me that the crash video Corsair was made from
spare parts; early wings, late fuselage, engine/cowl from KC-97 or
such, or some sort of combination. At Oshkosh, it would be poo-poo'd
due to its '*******' heritage. But yes, it still was a Corsair -lost.
VL

  #8  
Old February 19th 07, 12:11 AM posted to rec.aviation.piloting
John[_9_]
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Posts: 103
Default Another warbird lost

As I recall that aircraft was a Planes of Fame aircraft and was
originally an F4U-1, one of the earliest Corsairs built. It had been
used by a movie studio as a wind generator or a prop. When they were
stripping the paint they found some indications of combat service like
kill or mission markings but didn't bother to research it further
before clipping the wings and installing the R 4360 engine. Maybe the
original data plate was missing, and maybe the mission/kill markings
were bogus and maybe not all of the aircraft was intact when the
rebuild began but it was a -1 Corsair airframe. The same type that
Ira Kepford and Pappy Boyington flew. It seemed a waste to me a the
time and still does.

I don't buy the idea that every old airframe is historic and I support
fully the right of anyone owning anything to do with that thing
whatever they legally want. The Planes of Fame has done such great
work that I can't really blame them for experimenting with one
artifact of unknown provenance.

I think that there ought to be clearly defined hierarchy for
historical artifacts. Some things are historic because they were used
in a specific event (Enola Gay, Spirit of St. Louis etc.), some are
historic because they are among the last of their specific type
(Douglas Dolphin or the Brewster 239 at Pensacola) and some are
historic because they are among the last of their general kind,
(Martin Mars, last piston engined true flying boats operational). In a
perfect world people that owned historic artifacts would treat them
with appropriate respect.

On Feb 18, 1:32�am, "vlado" wrote:
On Feb 18, 12:02?am, "Kingfish" wrote:

http://video.google.com/videoplay?do...06816384837258


This makes me nuts. An irreplaceable Corsair is lost in an air race -
a Super Corsair at that, which I think was one of a handful of R-4360
powered F4Us. Glad the pilot got out, but another piece of history is
gone, and for no good reason IMHO...


Kingfish:
This aircraft was not a stock F4U by any means. *It was not even a
factory built aircraft. *It did not posses a serial number from the
manufacturer or Navy. *This airframe was built completely from spare
parts and many custom made parts. *Thus, as an airframe, it had no
history. *If this helps your regret..............



  #9  
Old February 19th 07, 01:52 AM posted to rec.aviation.piloting
Kingfish
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Posts: 470
Default Another warbird lost

On Feb 18, 10:38 am, "Kyle Boatright" wrote:

The aircraft was powered by an R-4360. This crash happened in 1994...

I would guess that there are more flying Corsairs today than there were
then, due to various restoration project coming to fruition. In today's
high dollar warbird scene, it is economically feasable to restore (or
remanufacture) projects that were not viable projects 10 or 20 years ago.


Aha. I saw the Dec. '04 date on the video and assumed it was recent.
Interesting point about the viability of warbird restorations KB. I
never thought of that.

  #10  
Old February 19th 07, 08:42 PM posted to rec.aviation.piloting
Tri-Pacer
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Posts: 120
Default Another warbird lost


" This makes me nuts. An irreplaceable Corsair is lost in an air race -





Hey it's his airplane to do with what he wants.

Cheers:

Paul
N1431A


 




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