Avgas Where is the ceiling?

"Robert M. Gary" wrote in message
ups.com...

You've got a loooooong way to go before you match the $10 we pay here in
Greece, along with incredible restrictions on all aspects of GA as well.

That's just because you *chose* to tax the fuel up to $10/gal.

-Robert

You DO realize how funny that came out, right???

Doug Palmer wrote:
100 LL just jumped from $3.82 to $4.54 at our airport, and at HAF we
traditionally represent the lower costs for our area (SF Bay) Where will it
end?

Last fall, I saw nearly $6 for a short while @ OXC.

a 50% increase in just a few days is airway robbery

Oil going up $3/ barrel for raw crude does not equate to $1.60 per gallon of
refined fuel.

Local county aviation departments are getting upset that the local hanger
owners and tie down renters are not buying as much fuel now as last year..
so their "flowage fee" revenues are off.

It was $3.80 / gallon at the county self service pumps last weekend,
interesting to see what it is this weekend.

BT

"Doug Palmer" wrote in message
ink.net...
100 LL just jumped from $3.82 to $4.54 at our airport, and at HAF we
traditionally represent the lower costs for our area (SF Bay) Where will
it end? to the pessimists in the room this feels like the begning of the
end for those of us who pinch our pennies to get a little air time in once
or twice a week. It doesn't seem that long ago that it was just above
$2/Gal.

Flying less in CA
D

In article . net, Doug
Palmer wrote:

100 LL just jumped from $3.82 to $4.54 at our airport, and at HAF we
traditionally represent the lower costs for our area (SF Bay) Where will it
end? to the pessimists in the room this feels like the begning of the end
for those of us who pinch our pennies to get a little air time in once or
twice a week. It doesn't seem that long ago that it was just above $2/Gal.

Flying less in CA
D


Well, we could always finish up this trial and start making our own
fuel.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Thermal_Depolymerization

That's _make_, not pump and refine.

IS User wrote:
That's _make_, not pump and refine.

Eventually you will see more of this type of processing waste
into energy. But you must realize that it would take a massive
contruction effort to build enough of these plants to make even
a small dent in the total oil needs of the United States.

There are infastructure issues to be dealt with as well such as
the collection and transportation of all of this waste to get
to these facilities. Thinking that "making" oil iright around
the corner and so there is no further need to explore and produce
additional oil reserves for the country's needs is pure ignorance.

On 2006-04-21, ktbr wrote:
Eventually you will see more of this type of processing waste
into energy. But you must realize that it would take a massive
contruction effort to build enough of these plants to make even
a small dent in the total oil needs of the United States.

What would likely happen is market forces would cause a migration rather
than a big conscious effort to build these things. Additionally, the
economics of things like thermal depolymerisation are different - it's
not so much as the traditional having a huge oil well, going to a huge
refinery. The best infrastructure would probably to have the plants
on-site where the waste is already. Such as the one right next to the
Butterball factory.

But, say, $100/barrel oil will ensure that companies go prospecting for
more oil. Suddenly, oil sources that weren't economical become
economical - as do alternate fuels - when oil isn't as cheap as it is
today (and for what you can get out of oil, it's still cheap stuff at
$70 a barrel).

--
Yes, the Reply-To email address is valid.
Oolite-Linux: an Elite tribute: http://oolite-linux.berlios.de

"Dylan Smith" wrote in message
...
But, say, $100/barrel oil will ensure that companies go prospecting for
more oil. Suddenly, oil sources that weren't economical become
economical - as do alternate fuels - when oil isn't as cheap as it is
today (and for what you can get out of oil, it's still cheap stuff at
$70 a barrel).

It's feasible to prospect and drill for oil if the world market price hits
$35 or more. It's double that now. Problem is the environuts will not let it
happen

We're now at the point that tar sands are feasible and coming into the range
that shale is profitable. Just a ways from me is enough shale that makes
much of the middle east seem like pikers. Canada has more oil in tar sands
than Saudia Arabia has.

As the economics get past the size scales and learning curves, thigs could
well change dramatically.

Imagine the towelheads losing their grip and their market. :~)

"Dylan Smith" wrote in message
...
On 2006-04-21, ktbr wrote:
Eventually you will see more of this type of processing waste
into energy. But you must realize that it would take a massive
contruction effort to build enough of these plants to make even
a small dent in the total oil needs of the United States.

What would likely happen is market forces would cause a migration rather
than a big conscious effort to build these things. Additionally, the
economics of things like thermal depolymerisation are different - it's
not so much as the traditional having a huge oil well, going to a huge
refinery. The best infrastructure would probably to have the plants
on-site where the waste is already. Such as the one right next to the
Butterball factory.

But, say, $100/barrel oil will ensure that companies go prospecting for
more oil. Suddenly, oil sources that weren't economical become
economical - as do alternate fuels - when oil isn't as cheap as it is
today (and for what you can get out of oil, it's still cheap stuff at
$70 a barrel).

--
Yes, the Reply-To email address is valid.
Oolite-Linux: an Elite tribute: http://oolite-linux.berlios.de


This is very true and not just for NEW oil. South Arkansas has MANY oil
wells that get shut off when the price falls below about $45/barrel and they
don't get restarted until the price goes above $55.

The bad part is a lot of those wells can't restart affordably when the price
goes up and the oil is affectively lost forever.

On Fri, 21 Apr 2006 14:59:44 GMT, ktbr wrote:

IS User wrote:
That's _make_, not pump and refine.

Eventually you will see more of this type of processing waste
into energy. But you must realize that it would take a massive

But this is a very limited resource.

contruction effort to build enough of these plants to make even
a small dent in the total oil needs of the United States.

By the time you have enough to make a small dent the raw materials
will become scarce and expensive.


There are infastructure issues to be dealt with as well such as
the collection and transportation of all of this waste to get
to these facilities. Thinking that "making" oil iright around
the corner and so there is no further need to explore and produce
additional oil reserves for the country's needs is pure ignorance.

Right around the corner works on this particular stuff, but not on a
wide scale as there just isn't enough to use on a large scale.

Roger Halstead (K8RI & ARRL life member)
(N833R, S# CD-2 Worlds oldest Debonair)
www.rogerhalstead.com

"Roger" wrote in message
...
On Fri, 21 Apr 2006 14:59:44 GMT, ktbr wrote:

IS User wrote:
That's _make_, not pump and refine.

Eventually you will see more of this type of processing waste
into energy. But you must realize that it would take a massive

But this is a very limited resource.

contruction effort to build enough of these plants to make even
a small dent in the total oil needs of the United States.

By the time you have enough to make a small dent the raw materials
will become scarce and expensive.

Which raw materials are you referring to?